El Zen Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Will you fight & potentially die for your country? Would I be willing to fight? No. Would I be willing to die? Yes. Same here. I couldn't fire a gun at anyone if it wasn't an immediate defensive act. To participate in conventional warfare is out of the question. I would be willing to give my life to save others, though. I wouldn't die for my country as such, but for humanity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDon Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 There is no doubt that I'd fight for the freedom of this country. There's no way I'd fight for another though unless it was essential to our freedom. If there was a war machine marching across Europe taking down country by country then I'd fight on foreign lands to halt it, but I'd never go into a war such as Iraq or Afghanistan. When in doubt, turn to Iron Maiden songs for advice on what to do. Although that did cause a bit of a stir at a Round Table do, when I spent a couple of hours playing with madness, before bringing my daughter to the slaughter. I'm getting some conflicting advice from them though, they also seem to want me to run to the hills, and run for my life. Not really the battlecry of most their songs... Maybe we're only meant to fight if we're not heavily outnumbered? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowychap Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I would be willing to give my life to save others, though. I wouldn't die for my country as such, but for humanity. Spot on. You phrased it much better than I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Have to fight I think, not that I'd be too pleased about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant-Major Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Yes.... I'm the Sergeant Major & signed on the dotted line 20 years ago. Since then have put my balls on the line for Queen & Country in such places as Northern Ireland, Bosnia & Iraq. However every time I go to Iraq I don't feel so comfortable being there due to the fact that the only reason we are there is for oil !! Tony Blair stood up in the Commons back in 2002 / 2003 and lied about Iraq having stockpiles of Weapons Of Mass Destruction and how Iraq were potentially 24 Hours away from building a missile that could be launched on the UK. In the 5 years we've been there what have we found? Nothing weapon wise but loads and loads of oil. Makes you want to cry the amount of good young lads & lasses who are now dead because of it... hang your head in shame Mr. Blair. But even though I may disagree with the war I'm a soldier and I do as I'm told. So if a foreign Army was planning to invade the UK would I fight? I would fight twice as hard as the man next to me in my fire trench regardless of how old I was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Rev Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 If it were for reasons like WWII, then yes. If it were for reasons like our invasion of Iraq, then no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrees Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 simpel the falklands is a bunch of rocks where it could be argued we could have solved the problems politically but a certain PM wanted a war to help flagging poll ratings. Now others will disagree but it is my view. I doubt that a certain PM 'wanted a war' but concede that it certainly helped her politically, as major events in history have helped others. If you can try to strip your political grievances out of it the 'bunch of rocks' is populated by human beings, who have a right to protection from aggressors as you and I do. Given that you would have 'politically' solved the problem I assume you see them as expendable? A strange thing for 'moral principles' to be founded upon in my opinion. Here we go, I'm suprised it took till the 3rd page to become a political thread. Any chance we can have a politics sub forum of off-topic? Alas, wars are started by politicians, so probably better to avoid war threads in the future. I did try to strip the politics out of it :winkold: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 I'm a soldier and I do as I'm told. give me all your money then :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianrobo1 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 it is my view on why Falklands was invaded, however it is not a poltical debate for others it weas justifable However this is the key for serving memebers But even though I may disagree with the war I'm a soldier and I do as I'm told. so I have to asked would this include being told to torture people you knwo to be innocent and the extremes we saw with Hitler/Stalin, just because you are told to do so ... not having a go but at some point if you don;t believe in something you have to step out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 so I have to asked would this include being told to torture people you knwo to be innocent and the extremes we saw with Hitler/Stalin, just because you are told to do so ... does your child go to bed when you tell her , does she do most things you tell her ? and why is that , is it becuase you are an authority figure to her ? i don't think soilders are asked , "would you mind awfully old chap " .. theya re trained to follow an order , not to question it .. I know what you are saying but I think it's easy for people to sit here 50 years after the event and say you should have said No , but that would have been signing your own death warrant ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianrobo1 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 yes Tony it was a few brave souls did just that but clealry a pilot when told to bomb somewhere knows he is likely to be killing innocent civillians thats is something I could not morally justify, whereas say just a foot solider it is much clearer on who the enemy is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awol Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 But even though I may disagree with the war I'm a soldier and I do as I'm told. so I have to asked would this include being told to torture people you knwo to be innocent and the extremes we saw with Hitler/Stalin, just because you are told to do so ... not having a go but at some point if you don;t believe in something you have to step out You've never heard of the Geneva conventions then Ian? All military personnel have to follow orders unless and until they believe it be an illegal order. For example, "Sergeant Major, go and kill me some babies so we can have a BBQ" is not a legal order and if followed would lead to prosecution. However "Sergeant Major we are deploying to Iraq on the orders of the British Government" is a legal order and must therefore be obeyed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarry Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 Read "The Nazis" by Laurence Rees. Fascinating book with a lot of insight into why the Eastern Front was so brutal - 2 sides thinking the other was subhuman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikantcpell Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 If it was sweden then yes..if we had a chance of winning it...but not in the navy..i think my seasickness would kill me before the enemy would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrees Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 it is my view on why Falklands was invaded, however it is not a poltical debate for others it weas justifable So a military government invading a tiny neighbour in an attempt to whip up popularity in their own country is justifiable? Astounding :shock: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonno_2004 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 yes Tony it was a few brave souls did just that but clealry a pilot when told to bomb somewhere knows he is likely to be killing innocent civillians thats is something I could not morally justify, whereas say just a foot solider it is much clearer on who the enemy is Aircraft technology isn't that of WWII standards though, but civilian casualties are unavoidable in any method of attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianrobo1 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 yes Jonno they are does that make it right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianrobo1 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 it is my view on why Falklands was invaded, however it is not a poltical debate for others it weas justifable So a military government invading a tiny neighbour in an attempt to whip up popularity in their own country is justifiable? Astounding :shock: another thread if you wish to debate that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonno_2004 Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 yes Jonno they are does that make it right ? Not at all, but are they preventable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thetrees Posted November 20, 2008 Share Posted November 20, 2008 it is my view on why Falklands was invaded, however it is not a poltical debate for others it weas justifable So a military government invading a tiny neighbour in an attempt to whip up popularity in their own country is justifiable? Astounding :shock: another thread if you wish to debate that no desire to Ian, I just wish that you would stop using the word morally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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