Ratings & Reactions: Villa v Southampton

[villabromsgrove]

I'm sat here thinking back to the 90 minutes of uninspiring footy that I watched last night.

I have a genuine question .... Did we play the same system as usual, only with one full back staying back when the other went forward?

The reason why I ask is that on reflection I saw McGinn and Kamara on the touchline a lot covering for Digne and sometimes Young, and when Dendoncker came on I genuinely cannot remember seeing him touch the ball in centre midfield.

This would indicate that there was no change to Gerrard's system except for the small but useful full back tweak. If that's so then half decent teams will continue to beat us. A positional map of our play against the Saints would be useful if anyone can find one.

It was a very welcome three points, but poor entertainment for millions of tv watching neutrals. 

Recent media profile gains are going to be wiped out if we keep on playing this turgid type of football.

I said to my son last night that we should be beating Southampton by two or three goals as they were very poor, except I couldn't see how we were actually going to put the ball in the net. In the end our one goal was scored by playing a bit of lucky ping pong in their six yard box.

A goal from a 'Luiz' corner is more likely than a goal from open play at the moment.

[briny_ear]

1 hour ago, El Segundo said:

I'd say it's potentially a pyrrhic victory but it remains to be seen.  If it means Gerrard stays too long and takes us down - as some, including me,  fear he might -  that would be pretty devastating, and would clearly demonstrate damage to the long term progress of the club.  As for the rest of the definition, I certainly felt any sense of achievement last night was negated by the latest in a long-ish line of dreadful, boring , clueless performances that really do not offer much promise of an enjoyable or successful season ahead. 

In response to other posts, comparing our situation to pre-Wenger Arsenal, and Gerrard's to Ferguson's in the late 80s is ridiculous, unless you are happy with 90's style dinosaur football and happy to ignore the changes in the financial structure of the game since those days.   Ferguson's situation was a massive exception at a time when financial pressures were nowhere near what they are today, and unlikely to ever be repeated.  If we want to play like Arsenal in the late 80s and early 90s we may as well just get McLeish or Bruce back.  And just which top players is Gerrard going to get through the door by playing shite football and hovering around the lower reaches of the table? 

No, that’s not a pyrrhic victory. Jeez, I think this is a fairly simple concept. It’s when you win a battle but lose so many resources or troops that you are unable to win any in the future. So if we had won last night but half our squad went off with long term with long term injuries, that would have been a pyrrhic victory. As it is, as far as I am aware, there were no injuries and the team seem to have gained a bit of morale and confidence. Getting three points and climbing up the table cannot do long term damage to the club.

Funny how many of the posters on this site that I now think of as #AntiGerrardTalk# because of the total obsession with the manager to the exclusion of all else,  seem at their unhappiest when we win.

A bit of reflection on whether that is a sensible approach to life might be called for.

[El Segundo]

34 minutes ago, Rugeley Villa said:

I’ve always been over patient with managers which goes against the grain nowadays . I’m far from happy with Gerrard but not ready to hound him out yet. 
 

Who do we replace him with ? 

It's hardly "hounding him out" if he's already had 34 games worth of "patience".   Who we replace him with isn't relevant to whether Gerrard's competent or not and anyway that's Purslow's job.  We could have said the same when sacking Smith, many did say the same about Bruce and then we got Smith.  Personally I'd have Smith back over Gerrard any day of the week, the results were no worse and the football 10 times better. 

[sne]

18 minutes ago, briny_ear said:

No, that’s not a pyrrhic victory. Jeez, I think this is a fairly simple concept. It’s when you win a battle but lose so many resources or troops that you are unable to win any in the future. So if we had won last night but half our squad went off with long term with long term injuries, that would have been a pyrrhic victory. As it is, as far as I am aware, there were no injuries and the team seem to have gained a bit of morale and confidence. Getting three points and climbing up the table cannot do long term damage to the club.

Funny how many of the posters on this site that I now think of as #AntiGerrardTalk# because of the total obsession with the manager to the exclusion of all else,  seem at their unhappiest when we win.

A bit of reflection on whether that is a sensible approach to life might be called for.

Kamara did get injured thou

[PaulC]

5 hours ago, romavillan said:

Don't agree, what we need is a way of playing, teamwork and interplay to create chances to beat teams. Shithousing 3 points playing filth is not going to get us where we want to go.

It been a criticism in the past that we have lost the physical battle. Last night we won it and although it wasn't pretty we ground out a result. Its  a platform which we can build. 4 points against Man City and Southampton is a good return. The pretty football can come later. 

[onmeedson]

I think last night showed how poor this squad is , we made hard work of a poor southampton side that had nothing to offer. The lump upto the strikers was mind numbing in its total panic to get rid of the ball and left it meat and drink for the taller saints players to own. Yes we have to get better at the back and Gerrards has revitalised Mings by letting him play his own game without the worry of being captain and maybe it would do McGinn a favour by just letting Emi take the reigns. This will be a tough season but that squad needs breaking up.

[Brumstopdogs]

Went to the match yesterday and although the performance was not an eye catching one it was certainly one where the players looked committed which is the least we should expect.

Southampton were poor offensively (which we should take credit for) but did largely nulify us going forwards so we'll certainly need to improve our attacking play in the future.

Personally I'm pleased with the 3 points and hope we can take some momentum into the next matches. UTV!

[Zhan_Zhuang]

A workmanlike performance which Villa seriously needed to get points.

Also a clean sheet was important and I think against Southampton that was a key focus to limit their opportunities. It worked and it wasn't the prettiest but it was very much needed.

Coutinho played well I thought and nearly scored a fantastic goal, he was my MOTM. 

Mings also very solid.

Bailey was disappointing, I think Buendia should take his place for a few matches now as he also gives us protection.

Buendia and Coutinho linked up really well briefly when they were on the pitch together.

 

[Marka Ragnos]

17 hours ago, CVByrne said:

Gerrard out army you have the floor. You have taken over all of VT already. 

Even when we win you'll trot out the same shite as always

There are very consistent, intelligent people who advocate for and against Gerrard’s dismissal, but as we’ve seen so graphically with the polls, the VT center of gravity moves much depending on the latest match results and form. I don’t feel any tribe has “taken over” VT, personally. 

I myself have gone back and forth shamelessly, which makes me awful — and pretty much a bang average, faithless football supporter. 

[Marka Ragnos]

16 minutes ago, Zhan_Zhuang said:

Bailey was disappointing …

 

It DID feel very “bad day at the office” for Bailey. His targeting on goal was off the mark, often frustratingly. Still a very dynamic, scrappy player. Can’t hurt to let Buendia slot in with Bailey as an impact sub?

[BleedClaretAndBlue]

The SS highlights make it look like we played well. You wouldnt have thought theyd get that many highlights from that.

Well done boys going into the break with a win was important for my health. Get to think over the Gerrard appointment for another 2 weeks now

 

 

Edited September 17, 2022 by BleedClaretAndBlue

[Brumstopdogs]

 

[thunderball]

1 hour ago, Brumstopdogs said:

Went to the match yesterday and although the performance was not an eye catching one it was certainly one where the players looked committed which is the least we should expect.

Southampton were poor offensively (which we should take credit for) but did largely nulify us going forwards so we'll certainly need to improve our attacking play in the future.

Personally I'm pleased with the 3 points and hope we can take some momentum into the next matches. UTV!

I am surprised but you are right, the application is very good, even as far back as against Arsenal, this is a good sign. I just wish we would use more of the squad, the selection and subs should be better, we do have a good squad.

I also agree that we are limiting teams offensively. 

I just feel we should be far better than our displays and seem to have no offensive pattern or plan. The points are great, but I feel a better manager would be getting a decent tune out of these players, it seems to be the system structure.

[Keener window-cleaner]

Very good and vital three points for us. But must admit that Saints were truly awful, so many times did their keeper and center backs just kick the ball away to no one even whn not under pressure, and had nothing going forward. 

What I liked about our performance was the grit and the determination, we were really switched on the full game and were agressive. Also good to see that Coutinho still had something to bring to the team, looked hungry and agressive.

It was a performance Steve Bruce and McLeish would have been proud of.

[pacbuddies]

Yesterday's performance made my eyes bleed. I am astounded that NSWE think this is acceptable for the amount of investment they have made. If they think we can qualify for Europe anytime soon they are very gullible!

[M_Afro]

5 minutes ago, pacbuddies said:

Yesterday's performance made my eyes bleed. I am astounded that NSWE think this is acceptable for the amount of investment they have made. If they think we can qualify for Europe anytime soon they are very gullible!

What makes you think that they think it’s acceptable? I am 100% certain that they will not think it’s acceptable. I am also certain that, as measured business people, they will not make an impulsive decision. They will make the change when they think that the time is right.

[AlwaysAVFC]

What an awful game and not an easy one to explain. My thoughts on some of the individual performances.

Martinez, very little to do. I've seen people comment on his time wasting. To be honest I love his Innate shithouse. Would I hate it as an opposition fan-yes, I even hated Trezeguets time-wasting and it did us over against Liverpool a couple of years ago. So a complete contradiction but Martinez get it right.

The back 4 I thought played well.

McGinn - set the tone for the game a bit really. Obviously struggling for form and don't think he had a great game but one way to play your way into form is to force it and getting stuck in like he did yesterday, will have to see if it works.

Watkins I thought had an ineffective game but I don't particularly think that was his fault. We really didn't use him, at all! You sort of saw his frustration when Ings came on as that allowed him to get stuck in and track back rather than being isolated and no balls to run onto.

Douglas Luiz, I've always thought he is better suited as a DM rather than a bit more forward like a lot prefer. Last night swayed me to agree with the majority, certainly with how we are playing currently.

Thought Ramsey played well and switching sides him and McGinn worked OK.

Coutinho I thought had a good game in context. Like Gerrard said prior to game, he looked like he was hurt and wanted to do something about it. I like what I saw, had we got control of the game it would have been much better.

After such an awful game it's hard for optimism and despite my summary there's not a lot there. There is a hell of a lot to sort out.

 

[AVTuco]

5 hours ago, PaulC said:

It been a criticism in the past that we have lost the physical battle. Last night we won it and although it wasn't pretty we ground out a result. Its  a platform which we can build. 4 points against Man City and Southampton is a good return. The pretty football can come later. 

I'm with you Paul. Gerrard did the right thing and shored up our back end. It wasn't pretty, but we did win, and that's ALL that mattered yesterday. We must consolidate our position in the mid-table now and take it from there.

[Guest av1]

I’m still a bit down after leaving VP yesterday. 
 

Im not entitled, I’ve been going down for 30yrs so I don’t expect to see us smashing teams with beautiful football, but yesterday just felt wrong. 
 

I have never been upset leaving VP after a win so I’m not going justify, or try and explain why. I just know I shouldn’t feel like this after seeing my team win. 
 

Maybe that’s more my problem than the manager’s, but like I say, I’ve never felt less excited about a win as I did yesterday.

 

[fruitvilla]

2 hours ago, AlwaysAVFC said:

After such an awful game

Again ... it certainly was not champagne football. I would describe it as stodgy.

You did not mention Bailey ... ok was not his best game. But you were positive about most of the players?

Gerrard's job is now to work on creativity - create more, better chances and put them away. It won't be quick.