Are CDs Dead ?

[Xann]

24 minutes ago, hippo said:

CD tech in terms of players seems to have gone backwards. Few years back I brought a shitty £30 thing from Argos - more than decent sound.

2 of the recent players (around £100) I brought went back - I got crisper sound from my phone !!!

Don't watch telly so much, so as such I'd pay more for a player than that.

DACs have got much better over time, and you can get a decent one for £100. With a decent transport there's more choice with CD players from £200 up.

Know where you're coming from though, there's a stack of optical drives next to me and they've definitely got steadily worse. Not everything new is great.

I've had  the same modest system for 30 years, but gradually improved the CD player. Sony (robbed), Marantz (transport failed), Arcam (laser failed) and now I've got an Oppo which chats to the telly, my phone, the camera, will stream from a network drive, stick or from my computer. It'll play Blu-Ray Audio discs in surround or it can be told to play like a legacy player. 

So yeah, they've come on.

 

 

 

[OutByEaster?]

The best I could find was a yougov survey from 2018 that suggests that 55% of CD sales are to people over 55.

 

[OutByEaster?]

I've just realised that I don't own a single device thats sole purpose is playing recorded music.

Anyways, for me the answer to the question is yes.

[TheAuthority]

8 hours ago, bickster said:

Thats a perfectly reasonable position, there are many ways to reward the artist

For example, you can just PayPal me directly 

[TheAuthority]

7 hours ago, blandy said:

I buy more CDs than vinyl. Partly because my CD player is the best quality stereo component I have, so I get the best sound from them.

There is an argument waiting to be had in there for a purist!

[TheAuthority]

My biggest gripe about the progression from physical to digital audio media may seem niche but it's very important to me and many classical enthusiasts. If you had a CD or vinyl recording of a symphony, the info on the back told you exactly; who the orchestra was, who conducted and most importantly in which year it was recorded. This meant you knew which musicians were in the group at that point, was it originally recorded in analogue and then digitized, where it was recorded etc.

The way that digital media is catalogued and the info displayed online, there is no company that presents all of this very pertinent info clearly and of course it's because it isn't worth their time financially. Often labels release recordings and so if you go to buy something online that eg looks like a recent recording of the Chicago Symphony, it may actually be a re-release from 1950 recorded with a tin can and a piece of string.

Edited January 8, 2022 by TheAuthority

[hippo]

7 hours ago, Xann said:

Don't watch telly so much, so as such I'd pay more for a player than that.

DACs have got much better over time, and you can get a decent one for £100. With a decent transport there's more choice with CD players from £200 up.

Know where you're coming from though, there's a stack of optical drives next to me and they've definitely got steadily worse. Not everything new is great.

I've had  the same modest system for 30 years, but gradually improved the CD player. Sony (robbed), Marantz (transport failed), Arcam (laser failed) and now I've got an Oppo which chats to the telly, my phone, the camera, will stream from a network drive, stick or from my computer. It'll play Blu-Ray Audio discs in surround or it can be told to play like a legacy player. 

So yeah, they've come on.

 

 

 

Mrs Hippo loves the TV - so we/I don't have a time where we just sit and listen to music. If we did I would probably buy a decent hifi and start buying vinyl.

Main use is background music when WFH and if doing a spin bike or home workout.

The ones I brought tend to have what I can only describe as a softer sound - than the cheap boombox I had been using. Maybe it's by design to accommodate the alarm wake up radio setting.

[bickster]

7 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

I think we're a fairly small demographic - for my nephews (one teenager, one just on the edge of teenship) the idea of owning things like music is odd, it's not the way they think about it - music is just sort of there if they want it, they feel like they own everything already, it's just a matter of connecting to it. For them, music isn't a physical product, it's more like a library that exists online.

It'd be interesting to see who is buying vinyl and CD''s. I have a feeling it's not the young.

 

 

 

The young are definitely buying vinyl, you only have to walk into a record shop to see that

[chrisp65]

9 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

I think we're a fairly small demographic - for my nephews (one teenager, one just on the edge of teenship) the idea of owning things like music is odd, it's not the way they think about it - music is just sort of there if they want it, they feel like they own everything already, it's just a matter of connecting to it. For them, music isn't a physical product, it's more like a library that exists online.

It'd be interesting to see who is buying vinyl and CD''s. I have a feeling it's not the young.

 

In a very small sample:

My eldest lives in a shared house, the place is an I.T. Geek palace, everything is run off their phones and voice command, they turn the Christmas tree lights on with an app, they don’t have a TV as such, they have no physical music collection.

My youngest is in a 6 person Uni house share, 5 of the 6 in the house got vinyl records for Christmas, the only one that didn’t was my nipper, who has returned to Uni digs… with a xylophone, the world’s biggest bean bag, and a skeleton called Colin.

[mjmooney]

6 hours ago, TheAuthority said:

My biggest gripe about the progression from physical to digital audio media may seem niche but it's very important to me and many classical enthusiasts. If you had a CD or vinyl recording of a symphony, the info on the back told you exactly; who the orchestra was, who conducted and most importantly in which year it was recorded. This meant you knew which musicians were in the group at that point, was it originally recorded in analogue and then digitized, where it was recorded etc.

The way that digital media is catalogued and the info displayed online, there is no company that presents all of this very pertinent info clearly and of course it's because it isn't worth their time financially. Often labels release recordings and so if you go to buy something online that eg looks like a recent recording of the Chicago Symphony, it may actually be a re-release from 1950 recorded with a tin can and a piece of string.

Exactly this. Maybe it's because music is more important to me that just some disposable background sound. I'm nerdy about it. Whether it's classical, jazz or pop, I want to know all that stuff - who wrote it, who played on it, where and when was it recorded, etc. OK, I could find some of that information online if I dig around, but it makes far more sense to have a well-written set of notes in the CD booklet (even if I have to deploy my reading glasses on the small print). Spotify utterly fails in this matter. 

[chrisp65]

Yep, liner notes and artwork.

CD’s are ok for that, streaming / downloading just doesn’t cut it.

But I do get that some people aren’t interested in where each track was recorded, or even in listening to the tracks in the correct order.

I love to know that this album was recorded at Monnow or Rockfield Studios or included Paul McCartney chewing celery on track 5.

I have zero point zero interest in the credits at the end of a tv programme that tell me who supplied the catering, or what seventeen arts grants companies were involved in putting together a movie for Film 4.

I skip that shit.

 

 

[mjmooney]

30 minutes ago, chrisp65 said:

I have zero point zero interest in the credits at the end of a tv programme that tell me who supplied the catering, or what seventeen arts grants companies were involved in putting together a movie for Film 4.

Rostrum camera: Ken Morse. 

[OutByEaster?]

2 hours ago, bickster said:

The young are definitely buying vinyl, you only have to walk into a record shop to see that

It's interesting, a quick google suggests that you're right and that vinyl buyers are a younger group than CD buyers.

https://www.kantar.com/uki/inspiration/consumer/vinyl-sales-continue-to-grow-in-the-uk

Quote

Compared to the average buyer of music, buyers of vinyl records are 57% more likely to be aged under 25 (i.e. aged 15-24) and over a fifth more likely to be London-based.

I wonder if there's an element to that where it's having the vinyl rather than playing the music that's important to those buyers, you know, the whole thing about being a collector?

There's a certain cool to owning LP's, they look good around the house and there's something nice about handling them - so without any real evidence at all, and to play devils advocate, I'm going to suggest that vinyl sales to younger people aren't necessarily about the music itself.

 

 

[LondonLax]

11 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

I think we're a fairly small demographic - for my nephews (one teenager, one just on the edge of teenship) the idea of owning things like music is odd, it's not the way they think about it - music is just sort of there if they want it, they feel like they own everything already, it's just a matter of connecting to it. For them, music isn't a physical product, it's more like a library that exists online.

It'd be interesting to see who is buying vinyl and CD''s. I have a feeling it's not the young.

 

 

 

That’s essentially it in a nutshell. 

People usually develop an affinity to the method they used to connect to music and stick to it long term and for the younger generations typically it’s not music in a physical form. 

[Xann]

Music for kings and sultans, beautifully played, fantastic production, well packaged and informative, on hybrid discs that'll come out in surround on an SACD or home cinema set up.

They're between £11 - £30. Alia Vox is a wonderful label. This is a luxury product that's affordable for many.

Jordi Savall wants to spread the love above lining his pockets.

 

[El Zen]

This thread has made me realise that I’ve probably bought my last ever music CD. And that was a few years ago, too. 

I have a collection that was never really unpacked after we last moved three years ago. There’s just nowhere to play them (neither of our cars have a CD player) and Spotify is just far too convenient. 

I do want to support bands and musicians who have to make a living, though, so I’ll occassionally buy some albums on itunes and/or some merch. 

 

[WhatAboutTheFinish]

An extract from a recent conversation with my 11 year old daughter:

Her: She bought one of those shiny things.

Me: What shiny things?

Her: You know the round shiny things that you put in the radio and they play music.

 

I think CDs are dead!

 

 

[bickster]

1 hour ago, LondonLax said:

That’s essentially it in a nutshell. 

People usually develop an affinity to the method they used to connect to music and stick to it long term and for the younger generations typically it’s not music in a physical form. 

So why are 57% of new vinyl sales to young people as evidence above in a subsequent post by the very poster you quoted

It is absolutely not what you are saying, it's far more complex than simple statements of this is dead, thats dying out, this will takeover, that isn't happening any more. And as it has been since the 50s it is the younger generations that consume the most music product and sales in the sector are growing. Different formats suit different people.

Vinyl sales are actually artificially low right now, there are so few pressing plants left, they have a backlog and you have to book your pressing slots nearly a year in advance. CDs have a much higher profit margin than vinyl but it is vinyl that is pushing the sales. People are still buying downloads for certain markets, it's the only place you can get the product. CDs are the only alternative for people that want physical product. A friend released an album on CD just before Xmas, it's beautifully packaged in a book, its taken them ages to get that out because of the pandemic and the vinyl is still many months away, the CD is the only option for some. Another friend is in a band, they sell their home made CDs at their gigs, it's how they make money.

It isn't a case of any of the formats dying, they are just finding their levels

 

[LondonLax]

16 minutes ago, bickster said:

So why are 57% of new vinyl sales to young people as evidence above in a subsequent post by the very poster you quoted

It is absolutely not what you are saying, it's far more complex than simple statements of this is dead, thats dying out, this will takeover, that isn't happening any more. And as it has been since the 50s it is the younger generations that consume the most music product and sales in the sector are growing. Different formats suit different people.

Vinyl sales are actually artificially low right now, there are so few pressing plants left, they have a backlog and you have to book your pressing slots nearly a year in advance. CDs have a much higher profit margin than vinyl but it is vinyl that is pushing the sales. People are still buying downloads for certain markets, it's the only place you can get the product. CDs are the only alternative for people that want physical product. A friend released an album on CD just before Xmas, it's beautifully packaged in a book, its taken them ages to get that out because of the pandemic and the vinyl is still many months away, the CD is the only option for some. Another friend is in a band, they sell their home made CDs at their gigs, it's how they make money.

It isn't a case of any of the formats dying, they are just finding their levels

 

Vinyl collection is a pretty niche hobby as reflected in that graphic you posted. Streaming services account for more that all the other forms combined on that graphic and I’m guessing the bulk of the CDs still selling are going to the over 40s.

A quick look at the current top selling CDs includes Elton John, Fleetwood Mac and ABBA where as the current top ten for streaming albums reflects the tastes of a much younger crowd. 

[TheAuthority]

26 minutes ago, bickster said:

So why are 57% of new vinyl sales to young people as evidence above in a subsequent post by the very poster you quoted

It is absolutely not what you are saying, it's far more complex than simple statements of this is dead, thats dying out, this will takeover, that isn't happening any more. And as it has been since the 50s it is the younger generations that consume the most music product and sales in the sector are growing. Different formats suit different people.

Vinyl sales are actually artificially low right now, there are so few pressing plants left, they have a backlog and you have to book your pressing slots nearly a year in advance. CDs have a much higher profit margin than vinyl but it is vinyl that is pushing the sales. People are still buying downloads for certain markets, it's the only place you can get the product. CDs are the only alternative for people that want physical product. A friend released an album on CD just before Xmas, it's beautifully packaged in a book, its taken them ages to get that out because of the pandemic and the vinyl is still many months away, the CD is the only option for some. Another friend is in a band, they sell their home made CDs at their gigs, it's how they make money.

It isn't a case of any of the formats dying, they are just finding their levels

 

I’m releasing 2 cd’s this year. Of course they are ‘records of note’ (new music recordings, examples of me as a performer) and certainly not to make money. But if I go and play a recital at a small church in say Virginia for the local chamber music society, I take cd’s with me and invariably between 10 & 20 enthusiasts will buy one for $15/$20. They want a “take home.” A memory of an experience they enjoyed and eventually over a number of years the investment in the recording will break even.

Edited January 8, 2022 by TheAuthority