Ratings & Reactions: Watford v Villa

[Hank Scorpio]

16 minutes ago, VillanousOne said:

Most of our squad have had virtually no preseason. I think Targett and Buendia have barely played and had injuries, same with Traore.

Lost Grealish - so now have to work out how to play as a team without him

Lost Watkins to injury (lets hope he's not out for 3 months)

Missing Luiz and at least half our side are lacking match fitness/sharpness.

Lost two very influential coaches

Playing Young and Anwar today backfired, but the rest of the above wasn't Dean's fault.


 

Buendia played most preseaon games didn't he 

[Davkaus]

I have, in the past, been guilty of posting overreactions in trhe R&R thread immediately after the game. I've tried not to take things too seriously, lately.

For the good of your mental health, I'd encourage a few posters in the early pages to take a step back and realise it's just a game, and it doesn't really matter.

[Aston_Villan4]

17 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said:

On the other hand, that first half was so bad it was kind of hard not to improve on it. He deserves credit for making changes yes but it's kind of the bare minimum to expect considering how badly we were being overrun.

I remember an argument a couple of years ago in this thread about how Smith deserved credit for subbing in a player who a lot of us felt should've started to begin with(can't remember who) and helped us win the game. Instead of being credited for fixing a mistake, I'd rather him not make the mistake in the first place.

Certainly. Changes were inevitable and the bar was low. It's fair game to be critical of how he set up the squad even though I think he was hand-tied to some degree. It wouldn't have been any better with Young and AEG swapped plus who knew Cash and Targett would be so woeful today. I just think some credit needs to go to the difference in changes he made today as compared to the kinds he would make in previous years. He was moving guys around in the first half trying to find some spark and too many games he waited until the 70th minute to make any kind of subs or change and would just hope the players would "turn on." 

[Aston_Villan4]

Just now, Pissflaps said:

Buendia played most preseaon games didn't he 

Two games then got hurt.

[TRO]

1 minute ago, villalad21 said:

Yep. 

I have a question for you. 

If you had the option of swapping Mcginn and Luiz with Rice and Soucek, would you do it? 

I'd do it all day long. 

In a breeze.....surprised you asked me that.

We have players, who we have become attached too, but our journey has been progression and one or two, will be superseded.

Richard O was one.....as sad as it seems, Sid Cowans, explained the situation...it wasn't retiring at all, he still wants a job.

[Big Salad]

Had some pretty bad emotional family drama happen a few hours ago(Somewhat sorted for the moment but we'll see tomorrow).

Anyway, just finished watching the highlights. Very tough opening loss no doubt; their goals made them look like Atletico Madrid and us look like Blyth Spartans. Obviously tons of games left, but disappointing none the less.

We move on and try to work out the kinks.

Haven't even checked Twitter,shudder to even think what vitriol is being spewed on there.

UTV

Edited August 14, 2021 by Big Salad

[cheltenham_villa]

8 minutes ago, PieFacE said:

The biggest issue I had with the game today was the huge amount of space between the back four and the midfield. We didn't move up and down the pitch very well as a team at all. When we moved up the pitch we didn't squeeze them anywhere near enough, they had so much time to play through us.

This was my main gripe as well. When in possession they just made our back 4 pass the ball between themselves.

We really needed someone who could get the ball from them and help move it forwards.

[TRO]

40 minutes ago, stewiek2 said:

That lack of getting stuck in today really worried me. A newly promoted team as opposition and there was no 'welcome to the premier league' attitude at all. Watford ran through us like a hot knife through butter. Had all the alarm bells of a Sherwood side. Tom Cleverly ran the midfield for Christ sake!? Smith can moan all he likes about that's not what he expects but bloody hell man you set that side up, you played that unbalanced side, you gave the prematch talk, and worryingly, YOU didn't have a clue how to change it til it got to half time. Good, nay, decent managers, have good in-game management whilst the players are on the bloody pitch. Yet time and time again he has come shirt in that respect. Sorry but I can't see him lasting the season unless he ups HIS Game let alone the expensively assembled squad he has at his disposal. NSWE don't suffer fools, nor does Purslow.

you cannot excuse, not being up for it, no matter how you dress it up.

How many times has this been cited......sorry, its unacceptable for us to be keep rolling out, the same old faults.

Dean needs to demand performances, not ask for them....He needs to be on his metal this season IMO....Dean is usually laid back, that might have to change.

Edited August 14, 2021 by TRO

[stewiek2]

14 hours ago, TRO said:

you cannot excuse, not being up for it, no matter how you dress it up.

How many times has this been cited......sorry, its unacceptable for us to be keep rolling out, the same old faults.

Dean needs to demand performances, not ask for them....He needs to be one his metal this season IMO....Dean is usually laid back, that might have to change.

Absolutely. Totally agreee. We need to get that midfield and team as a whole less powder puff. I don't care if it's a club record for a few proper DMs, we have to do it. And as much as I like JWP, today showed we are so bereft of pace it's shocking. Pay top dollar. Liverpool did with VVD AND Allison, City with Edison and Dias, who gives a **** if our record signing is a brute. Get it done as that midfield is frankly as strong as the skin off a rice pudding.

Edited August 15, 2021 by stewiek2

[TRO]

10 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

I agree with this mate 100%. I think he is going to have a problem on how to play him, especially when Watkins comes back in. An we really don't want to be the ones who halt his career, by not getting the best out of him, he has come here to show his qualities.

If not for the penalty today, I think he would have left the pitch feeling a bit pissed off.

but it was never feasible to expect Ollie to play around 50+ games inc cups on his own.

There is nothing wrong with playing 2 strikers, provided you have adequate quality in midfield to feed them....Bailey and Traore/Buendia are ok.

Its the central Midfield that needs up grading to match the other departments.

I have no idea how Dean see's all this.....but I fear trouble ahead.

I have a suspicion Dean is comfortable with a small squad, when it gets bigger, he feels less comfortable and it is .....trouble is, as you progress, it demands you manage a bigger squad.

Hmmmmm.

[TRO]

5 minutes ago, stewiek2 said:

Absolutely. Totally agreee. We need to get that midfield and team as a wholeless powder puff. I don't care if it's a club record for a few proper DMs, we have to do it. And as much as I like JWP, today showed we are so bereft of pace it's shocking. Pay top dollar. Liverpool did with VVD AND Allison, City with Edison and Dias, who gives a **** if our record signing is a brute. Get it done as that midfield is frankly as strong as the skin of a rice pudding skin.

as they say, you are only as strong as your weakest link.

[VillanousOne]

29 minutes ago, Pissflaps said:

Buendia played most preseaon games didn't he 

2 games as already pointed out and bare in mind that wouldn't have been with anything near to a starting eleven.

[TRO]

5 hours ago, AntrimBlack said:

Poor performance, but a disjointed pre season was part of the cause, also the manager's team selection, and players unable to start the game.

But Smith needed to do something about Targett in the first half. He needed to have the balls, as perhaps a better manager might have, to take him off during that first half to possibly save the game.

His substitutions were correct, but by then it was too late. 

Young showed Targett how to be a LB, and should have started there. Guilbert should have been a bench option, as Cash was very poor. And did we really need 2 CB's on the bench?

Ramsey, Bailey and Traore all played well. Nakamba and El Ghazi are just not good enough. Buendia was disappointing, but first half it seemed to me the front 4 had no idea what they were supposed to do and were often playing in unfamiliar positions.

On a positive note, the recruitment team now know what they need to do in the remainder of the window. 

Yep...I wonder if the penny will drop.

Edited August 14, 2021 by TRO

[Delphinho123]

Honestly, if we don’t sign anyone else - lol.

These owners can forget Europe, or the consequences of finishing 13th.

We needed 2 before today’s game. Two central midfielders. The scary thing is, we may need more. 

[VillanousOne]

Just now, Delphinho123 said:

Honestly, if we don’t sign anyone else - lol.

These owners can forget Europe, or the consequences of finishing 13th.

We needed 2 before today’s game. Two central midfielders. The scary thing is, we may need more. 

surely we'll only know what we need when we've been able to field our best eleven?

agree we need a physical, hard tackling midfielder who can pass and win balls in the air.

[Philosopher]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

Thats where his instincts take him......we need a few midfielders with an instinct to defend and a tendency to attack, in that order.

Definitely. I like Nakamba, but I haven't seen anything to suggest he is anything more than solid back up. Douglas Luiz I rate but to me he needs a safety net, rather than being the safety net. McGinn has no business as a number 6 for me.

If you have 2 Combative 8's you can have Luiz as your 6. But for me Luiz is a no 6 regista (dynamic deep lying playmaker), McGinn is a no 8 box to box. The only way those two work is if your fullbacks are kept back and told to hold their position, but then you have 5 and a half defenders and lack support for your attack particularly if opponents do what Watford did today and sit back. The only way this works is if we play counter attack. 

To beat team like Watford we need a dedicated, high class 6, pace in both fullback positions and lots of movement from your front 3. Today we lacked all these things.

The problem wasn't simply midfield. It was also the wide positions. If we were dangerous going forward, kept the ball well and pushed Watford back, they would have struggled to counter us as they would find themselves too deep.

Nakamba and McGinn don't allow us to apply the pressure as they're prone to a wayward pass. El-Ghazi's movement off the right is nonexistent, Young was coming inside playing in front of their midfield, rather than getting between the lines. So as a result their defense could easily read us.

Buendia doesn't suit being played high up. He does his best work from deeper in the RCM / RM position rather than CAM.

It was a very poor team selection today.

Watkins with Ings with gives us some nasty movement up top, and Buendia in RM is the perfect partner for Cash on the right, with lots of dangerous balls being played to the forwards. Then Bailey LW directly running at defenders and also targeting that inside left channel. Then Targett or Young staying deep and narrow and joining  in with the midfield gives us a much better Balance. 

I expected a tough game as we are a work in progress in attack. Away to a newly promoted Club on the first game of the season is always a battle. But we weren't even ready for a battle and got trounced.

[string28]

I think its clear the team needs to work on passing and keeping the ball (i know it was the same last year)

Its clear we are lacking still the problem is like today 2 injuries and we will be back to square one again like last season so we will need to bring people in or we will suffer again. Im starting to feel sorry for smith he must see what we see?

[Kiwivillan]

Just now, MaVilla said:

come on dude, we can all make those types of arguments.

If you mean Luiz, i do think Luiz (or Sanson, McGinn), would be just fine alongside a proper DM.

I just think we need a proper DM to allow the other midfielders we have to properly flourish.

 Just sick to death reading "need a proper DM" mantra everywhere for weeks. 1 loss and it's out in force again. We were flying along fine without "a proper DM" last season until Grealish injury.

DM wouldn't have stopped the goals conceded today from happening

[smg]

21 minutes ago, Philosopher said:

Definitely. I like Nakamba, but I haven't seen anything to suggest he is anything more than solid back up. Douglas Luiz I rate but to me he needs a safety net, rather than being the safety net. McGinn has no business as a number 6 for me.

If you have 2 Combative 8's you can have Luiz as your 6. But for me Luiz is a no 6 regista (dynamic deep lying playmaker), McGinn is a no 8 box to box. The only way those two work is if your fullbacks are kept back and told to hold their position, but then you have 5 and a half defenders and lack support for your attack particularly if opponents do what Watford did today and sit back. The only way this works is if we play counter attack. 

To beat team like Watford we need a dedicated, high class 6, pace in both fullback positions and lots of movement from your front 3. Today we lacked all these things.

The problem wasn't simply midfield. It was also the wide positions. If we were dangerous going forward, kept the ball well and pushed Watford back, they would have struggled to counter us as they would find themselves too deep.

Nakamba and McGinn don't allow us to apply the pressure as they're prone to a wayward pass. El-Ghazi's movement off the right is nonexistent, Young was coming inside playing in front of their midfield, rather than getting between the lines. So as a result their defense could easily read us.

Buendia doesn't suit being played high up. He does his best work from deeper in the RCM / RM position rather than CAM.

It was a very poor team selection today.

Watkins with Ings with gives us some nasty movement up top, and Buendia in RM is the perfect partner for Cash on the right, with lots of dangerous balls being played to the forwards. Then Bailey LW directly running at defenders and also targeting that inside left channel. Then Targett or Young staying deep and narrow and joining  in with the midfield gives us a much better Balance. 

I expected a tough game as we are a work in progress in attack. Away to a newly promoted Club on the first game of the season is always a battle. But we weren't even ready for a battle and got trounced.

Top fan , if we are a work in progress shit happens. Can’t wait for next weeks shit post.

[The Fun Factory]

We definitely looked undercooked for the season which is disappointing as on paper we have a fairly easy start.

We should have got rid of Nakamba and Conor already this window and reinvested this plus 10 odd million to get a quality DM in.

Its going to take time to bed in for the season, hopefully after 3-4  more games we will be up and running and Smith will know his best XI is.