VillaJ100 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 7 hours ago, villalad21 said: I'd say Italy have a great chance winning the World Cup if they can keep hold on their manager No way. With the speed of our players and the age of their CBs tactically brilliant or not we should have ripped them apart. They will be nearly 40 at the world cup. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Just now, jacketspuds said: I didn’t get a sense that you were defending him with your post. He wouldn't appreciate it if I did . (In high pitched Corkshire accent) Dats moy job. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wurzel Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Well, in the cold light of day, it's clear to me that Southgate's overly defensive attitude cost England a realistic chance of beating Italy. It is the standard setting for Managers who are not brave enough to trust in the players and let them do their thing. He should have changed things at half time and given Jack or A.N.Other a half to do something. Things got worse when he took off Rice but left the obviously knackered Philips on the pitch. England should have lost in normal time, but at least they had a little go in Extra time, but by then it was too late. I hope he learns from this. I hope he gets the courage to trust his creative players and use them, and to take off those players he sees undroppable at the moment. The World cup is in a year and a half so not much time for him to iron things out. i really hope he changes his mindset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Classic over thinking by Southgate all the way through. The right answer is staring him in the face and he feels the need to always be unorthodox. If he was thinking of using Grealish as impact sub if chasing a game then why not pair him with JWP? Bring them both on as a double act, it makes perfect sense. But noooo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I’m not the worlds biggest Declan Rice fan but he was having the game of his life, why was he taken off? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted July 12, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted July 12, 2021 6 hours ago, Aston_Villan4 said: Anyone else see Lineker with the mother of all "Captain Obvious" quotes: Well Gary, the best way to achieve that is to get a manager who is prepared to do that. Honestly, all tournament the commentators have highlighted what our issues are yet none of them have criticised the manager for them, in fact they have banged on about how brilliant he is. Pretty much all the criticism that's been levelled at Southgate over the last 2 weeks on these pages was completely laid bare last night. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCU Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) I think it’s quite worrying this obsession Southgate has going on with Mount. It was obvious early on in the tournament we had better choices but Southgate always managed to squeeze him in the starting line up somehow. (Apart from when he couldn’t play). It was literally like playing with 10 men last night. Completely forgot he was playing! James Maddison is miles better than Mount and he didn’t even make the squad ffs. I dunno, it just seems a bit dodgy now. He literally builds his team around him. Edited July 12, 2021 by MCU 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I said from the start we were as good as set up for penalties, the tactics were all wrong especially in front of 60k home crowd, despite the lucky goal. Now I've slept on in, I have no idea and a little angry Southgate used Saka and Sancho for a penalty, he will regret that for the rest of his life, with his penalty miss I'm sure None of us are managers anywhere near it, but Italy were all over the place after the goal too, why we didn't just go for it, is beyond me. We already started to sit back and try be risk free. 2 shots on target the whole game with a £125 million striker and about £500 million worth of attacking quality on the bench is just criminal really. I don't want him to manage this team anymore, we are back to square one. Even if he decided to start going with a more attacking line up, it would take another 3-4 years for Southgate to get it to a level which is expected of this group, an I doubt they will, but I think it's time for the FA to start looking and Southgate to step down. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCU Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 5 minutes ago, Genie said: I’m not the worlds biggest Declan Rice fan but he was having the game of his life, why was he taken off? We said this. He must have been shattered. That was such an odd sub to make when it’s 1-1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, MCU said: I think it’s quite worrying this obsession Southgate has going on with Mount. It was obvious early on in the tournament we had better choices but Southgate always managed to squeeze him in the starting line up somehow. (Apart from when he couldn’t play). It was literally like playing with 10 men. James Maddison is miles better than Mount and he didn’t even make the squad. I dunno, it just seems a bit dodgy now. He literally builds his team around him. Mount makes sense as a central midfielder, but Southgate wants two defensive midfielders, but he can’t drop Mount so plays him on the wing/wide where he is less effective. Edited July 12, 2021 by avfcDJ 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 3 minutes ago, Genie said: I’m not the worlds biggest Declan Rice fan but he was having the game of his life, why was he taken off? It's our first final for 55 years and out of loyalty to his favourites he made sure they can say they played in it. It's not something I agree with, it's sort of admirable but ultimately proved to be an error of judgement. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCU Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Just now, avfcDJ said: Mount makes sense as a central midfielder, but Southgate wants two defensive midfielders, but he can’t drop Mount so plays him on the wing/wide where he is less affective. Exactly my point. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 5 hours ago, Zatman said: did Mason Mount even play in the tournament, absolute anonymous in the tournament yet Southgate continued with him. 22 passes in over 100 minutes of football. No key passes. No through balls. No crosses. No tackles. No shots. 1 dribble. Absolute non entity. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted July 12, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted July 12, 2021 Southgate would change the players in a game of table football into a defensive unit. We have a wealth of talent going forward, **** him off and get someone like Deano in. Obviously not Deano But somebody with his mindset 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 As Foden wasn’t fit, I feel this would have been the better team Kane Sterling - Grealish - Sancho Rice - Mount (I love Philips but two DMs isn’t needed, especially as Mount works hard) I honestly have trouble choosing which DM. Same back 4. Puts the impetus on attacking and pushing Italy back. From 35mins we had 11 men behind the ball, 7 were defensive and one a keeper - no way are we pushing out with that attitude. We played to score and hold on and then couldn’t build momentum. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewiek2 Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I'd have sacked him at full time. He cost us that final. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummybloke Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Southgate has been extremely lucky in the world Cup and the euros, getting the easiest routes to the finals. Then each time he regresses to far too defensive tactics. We sat to deep for long periods hoping to hit it long for sterling to chase. Sterling who 95% of the time just runs into trouble. But you can't even blame just one player. It's down to Southgate and negative tactics. Italy made 4 subs in the 2nd half and dominated the half. We sat back and were passive. Mount did some closing down and that was it. Nothing of note going forwards. Saka had a shocker in his playing time, I can forgive picking him to come on as he has shown he can make a difference but waiting until extra time to bring on any other forward players ? Said it to a mate via message, half time I said we have this won as long as we don't go any more defensive. Then extra time said we need to put on all our subs and go for it. Everyone could see it bar Southgate. Disappointed Come back Tyrone and Jack, back where you get game time and get to play with players who pass you the ball and a manager who appreciates you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Interesting that even though the Croatia WC game didn’t go to pens, in that we scored early (a full back) sat back and invited pressure, Croatia scored in the 68th min and we were dead on our feet from defending and they went on to win it in ET. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 Entirely predictable violence, racism and penalty shootout loss. EN-GER-LAND. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinRichardsonsMoustache Posted July 12, 2021 Share Posted July 12, 2021 I have a lot of emotions still pulsing around me atm so apologies if this doesn’t make much sense. I was watching the match yesterday on a small rivulet with french commentary (long story). Over and over again they mentioned Southgate’s system and how the players were drilled into that system. The problem is that, according to everything I’ve ever heard or read from Football Management 101 says that your system should be led by the players you have, rather than a preordained shape you, as coach, trust. You need to be flexible so your ideas meet the players at your disposal half way. Southgate failed to do this all tournament. The two defensive midfield players were literally at the heart of Southgate’s preferred system - a feature many on these forums had criticised throughout the tournament. This meant that with one decision Southgate forced himself to pick one creator, writing off most of the unique attacking talent at his disposal. Finally, another feature of Southgate’s play was the wide player overload, exemplified by Luke Shaw. While this was the most successful feature (and something copied from the Premier League), Southgate preferred to man these roles with full backs (hence all those right backs) rather than players like Sancho et al. So, again, the system is designed to suit Southgate’s whims rather than the players at his disposal. I hope Southgate has matured as a coach after that performance: go back to basics and build a team that reflects the players you have not a preordained, rigid, system. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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