Zatman Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Genie said: To me this looks a lot like “any contact in the penalty area is a foul”, which I think is more dangerous than overturning ones that look extremely soft. Watkins vs Fulham was more of a penalty than last night and was overturned Edited July 8, 2021 by Zatman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, Genie said: To me this looks a lot like “any contact in the penalty area is a foul”, which I think is more dangerous than overturning ones that look extremely soft. its not though the answer is that the refs need to be better and know that if a hand is placed on salah's forearm his knees shouldn't crumple, they have to be better at gauging and understand degrees of contact and not give it as a foul in the first place, personally in this tournament apart from the ref last night i think they have been excellent at it but at the same time the ref has given the penalty because he sees the contact and in his opinion of that is a foul....you want him to watch it again, see the contact again but change his opinion...thats not what i think VAR is for, its not there to change the shades of grey, its not an error, its an opinion that you dont agree with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 9 minutes ago, villa4europe said: the answer is that the refs need to be better and know that if a hand is placed on salah's forearm his knees shouldn't crumple 9 minutes ago, villa4europe said: you want him to watch it again, see the contact again but change his opinion...thats not what i think VAR is for, its not there to change the shades of grey, its not an error, its an opinion that you dont agree with Aren’t these 2 statements contradictory? VAR is in place to improve the accuracy of decisions by the collective refereeing team. There won’t be many clear cut wrong decisions (where there is zero contact). They need to watch a replay and not ask “was there contact?” but “did the defender bring the player down?” Nobody watched that and thought the defender brought Sterling down, but it seems to get a level of acceptance because of a tiny, tiny contact. Kane was worse though, running into a dead end and then just dropping to the ground. He did it 2 or 3 times and got the decision every time. It was refreshing seeing these not given for the most part of this tournament, but it changed last night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Just now, Genie said: Aren’t these 2 statements contradictory? VAR is in place to improve the accuracy of decisions by the collective refereeing team. There won’t be many clear cut wrong decisions (where there is zero contact). They need to watch a replay and not ask “was there contact?” but “did the defender bring the player down?” Nobody watched that and thought the defender brought Sterling down, but it seems to get a level of acceptance because of a tiny, tiny contact. Kane was worse though, running into a dead end and then just dropping to the ground. He did it 2 or 3 times and got the decision every time. It was refreshing seeing these not given for the most part of this tournament, but it changed last night. agree he gave it all night so what makes you think he will watch it on the screen and change his mind? he thinks that kind of contact is a foul, he is wrong IMO, watching it again wont change his opinion though, thats why VAR fundamentally doesnt work, its still an opinion not a fact and it can still be "wrong" because they are still grey areas you cant improve the accuracy if that is how a ref interprets the rules, VAR will not change his interpretation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Nice to have fans back in the stadium... English fans once again doing what they do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, villa4europe said: agree he gave it all night so what makes you think he will watch it on the screen and change his mind? he thinks that kind of contact is a foul, he is wrong IMO, watching it again wont change his opinion though, thats why VAR fundamentally doesnt work, its still an opinion not a fact and it can still be "wrong" because they are still grey areas you cant improve the accuracy if that is how a ref interprets the rules, VAR will not change his interpretation At full speed, as Sterling was the far side of the first defender the ref might have thought he was physically forced off the ball by the 2 defenders. Having the benefit of the other angle he might conclude that it wasn’t what he thought and that the slight contact did not merit a foul as Sterling was clearly looking for the penalty. Case closed, VAR has done its job but correcting an initial mistake. Edited July 8, 2021 by Genie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 1 hour ago, Genie said: I’m really intrigued about Southgate and Grealish though. Southgate obviously thinks Jack has an attacking threat hence putting him on as plan B when needing a goal. In Southgates mind though there is some major drawback to having him on the pitch which I can’t work out. He won’t start him, and to sub him once in the lead reinforces it. Does he think Jack is lazy or doesn’t defend? Or is he uncomfortable with JG winning free kicks? I don’t agree with either but just trying to work out why he uses him as he does. He said when asked the question that he was responding to Denmarks change of tactics so he wanted an extra defender. He said Sterling was causing Denmark so many problems with his pace on the right so it was a straight choice between Grealish and Foden. If Sterling had of dropped off I think he would have been subbed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, sne said: Nice to have fans back in the stadium... English fans once again doing what they do. Just the 2 UEFA charges for last night Quote Uefa has charged England after a laser pointer was directed at Denmark keeper Kasper Schmeichel during Wednesday's Euro 2020 semi-final at Wembley. Television pictures showed a green light on Schmeichel's face just before Harry Kane took an extra-time penalty. Schmeichel saved the spot-kick but Kane scored the rebound as England won 2-1 to reach Sunday's final against Italy. England are also charged with causing a "disturbance" during Denmark's national anthem and setting off fireworks. BBC 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Steve Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Still irks me that Southgate thinks Jack lacks pace. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 1 hour ago, The_Steve said: I hope the police arrest the idiot who aimed the laser pen at Kasper during the penalty I hope they find him and ban him from attending games, but why would the police get involved? I'm not sure shining a laser pen at someone is a criminal act. At a vehicle, absolutely, people get done for that, but distracting a footballer isn't a crime as far as I'm aware Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 4 minutes ago, Davkaus said: I hope they find him and ban him from attending games, but why would the police get involved? I'm not sure shining a laser pen at someone is a criminal act. At a vehicle, absolutely, people get done for that, but distracting a footballer isn't a crime as far as I'm aware You might be wrong there, I think they did make it a criminal act along with shining them at cars and planes etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Absolutely baffling that the game wasn't stopped for this just before the penalty. So much wrong with how the game was decided. But bet UEFA are happy since the home team won again. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Im disappointed and unsurprised how little credit Denmark have gotten. The emotional and physical trauma they have suffered in this tournament and to still fight until the end was incredible. Players like Kjaer and Delaney were more heroic than Kane last night 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 4 minutes ago, sne said: Absolutely baffling that the game wasn't stopped for this just before the penalty. So much wrong with how the game was decided. But bet UEFA are happy since the home team won again. Again interpretation of the rules, you only stop play if the second ball is deemed to be interfering with play The ref obviously didn't so they played on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Just now, villa4europe said: Again interpretation of the rules, you only stop play if the second ball is deemed to be interfering with play The ref obviously didn't so they played on Every situation ever is an interpretation of the rules. Again the ref got it wrong or didn't have the balls to make the right call for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 It didn't look for a moment, even looking back at replays, that any players gave the second ball so much as a glance. It didn't interfere and it was no reason to stop an attack in progress. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 8 minutes ago, villa4europe said: Again interpretation of the rules, you only stop play if the second ball is deemed to be interfering with play The ref obviously didn't so they played on They are 2 metres from each other 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 Forget the second ball on the pitch, there was no contact on Sterling from the first ‘challenge’ and he was well on his way to the ground before the minor contact came from the second ‘challenge’. Of course, neither of them were actual challenges, Sterling dived and its criminal that it wasn’t overturned by VAR. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, Davkaus said: It didn't look for a moment, even looking back at replays, that any players gave the second ball so much as a glance. It didn't interfere and it was no reason to stop an attack in progress. Denmark player should have booted it into the penalty area and then the game would have had to be stopped 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted July 8, 2021 Share Posted July 8, 2021 2 hours ago, Davkaus said: I really struggle with the idea that Sterling was brilliant. He's brainless. He was one of the better forward players on the pitch which is a sad indictment of the rest of them, but he's so wasteful, and just wants to do it all himself no matter how many options he has. I lost count of the number of times he had players available for progressive passes and instead tried and failed to take on his man. Yeah, it worked for the penalty, but a less selfish player (not that I have a specific individual in mind ), in those positions would have been much more effective. You can look at the key stats of the tournament and much like them making Pickford look brilliant, they'd make Sterling look like he's been phenomenal throughout the tournament. It certainly isn't what I see on the pitch though. His 1st touch and close control is league 1 levels. People say you can't argue with the results but we can put out a better team with a better strategy then what we are doing, we need a better coach/strategist but with Southgate running the camp, which is a strength that shouldn't be underestimated. We can do so much more then we and with flare, this can be our golden age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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