Ratings & Reactions: Crystal Palace v Villa

[HKP90]

Anyway, time for my dinner. Nice debating with you folks. UTV.

 

[TRO]

1 hour ago, Jas10 said:

Yes we do, 100%. But we don’t have to sack the manager which is basically all I was referring to.

 

1 hour ago, HKP90 said:

That is absolutely not what I said or implied. 

What message would sacking Dean send to players who have stuck around like Jack? What message does it send to prospective managers? If you act like a mercenary, you get mercenaries. 

No organisation with massive staff turnover is sustainable. You just damage your own resource base. 

 

 

I am all for manager longevity, I think their is a cast Iron Case...but lets continue to be Devils Advocate.

• I thought Liverpool under Brendan Rodgers was doing ok, Their Hierarchy thought different and brought in Jurgen Klopp
• I thought Ranieri done well winning the League and all, Leicester management thought not and brought in Brendan Rogers
• I thought Frank Lampards departure was harsh and Frank would have been a legend as manager, they didn't ,hello Thomas Tuchel.

In each case I was wrong, judging by the results that these people have brought in....sure Klopp has some more work to do.

Maybe Arsenal could be the opposite, getting rid of Wenger....that hasn't worked so far.

I am not making a case to sack Dean Smith, that would be harsh, in my view.......but I could be wrong.

Edited May 16, 2021 by TRO

[HKP90]

Just now, allani said:

That is why targets are always slightly flawed.  As I said there are ways of us being on the exact same points, goal difference, number of wins, etc - where I would have been absolutely delighted to be where we are.  As you say we are ahead statistically of where I thought we would be.  However, I think you have to consider other factors when assessing performance and on that I think there are questions that need to be addressed.  Ultimately when we look back at the end of the season it will have been a success.  But if we want to continue that success we need to build on the things we've done well and learn from those things that have gone less well.  Hopefully then we'll all be really happy this time next year!  And nice to debate with you!  I'm trying to take some of your confidence and optimism with me!!!!

One more. Likewise. Hope you have taken it as a spirited debate. Respect. 

[HKP90]

Just now, TRO said:

 

I am all for manager longevity, I think their is a cast Iron Case...but lets continue to be Devils Advocate.

• I thought Liverpool under Brendan Rodgers was doing ok, Their Hierarchy thought different and brought in Jurgen Klopp
• I thought Ranieri done well winning the League and all, Leicester management thought not and brought in Brendan Rogers
• I thought Frank Lampards departure was harsh and Frank would have been a legend as manager, they didn't hello Thomas Tuchel.

In each case I was wrong, judging by the results that these people have brought in....sure Klopp has some more work to do.

I am not making a case to sack Dean Smith, that would be harsh, in my view.......but I could be wrong.

Last one. 

 

Tottenam sacked Poch and bought in Mourinho

[HKP90]

Now my dinner is burnt

[sne]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

 

I am all for manager longevity, I think their is a cast Iron Case...but lets continue to be Devils Advocate.

• I thought Liverpool under Brendan Rodgers was doing ok, Their Hierarchy thought different and brought in Jurgen Klopp
• I thought Ranieri done well winning the League and all, Leicester management thought not and brought in Brendan Rogers
• I thought Frank Lampards departure was harsh and Frank would have been a legend as manager, they didn't hello Thomas Tuchel.

In each case I was wrong, judging by the results that these people have brought in....sure Klopp has some more work to do.

I am not making a case to sack Dean Smith, that would be harsh, in my view.......but I could be wrong.

• You thought Bruce was doing OK and we brought in Smith 

[allani]

8 minutes ago, HKP90 said:

That is absolutely not what I said or implied. 

What message would sacking Dean send to players who have stuck around like Jack? What message does it send to prospective managers? If you act like a mercenary, you get mercenaries. 

No organisation with massive staff turnover is sustainable. You just damage your own resource base. 

 

 

Yeah I know.    The message would depend on who you replaced him with.  If you brought in a Steve Bruce type that would be one message.  If you brought in an Ancellotti type it would be a very different message.  Anyway I think we are probably losing this analogy thing now (partly my fault!).  Hopefully we can both be celebrating a great season next year!

[TRO]

40 minutes ago, HKP90 said:

That IS exactly what we need. Ball winner and outlet.

Hallelujah!!!

[smg]

40 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Still can't believe we got outplayed by a Roy Hodgson side. 

Why ? Please explain rather than just making comments to get a response.

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, sne said:

• You thought Bruce was doing OK and we brought in Smith 

No I didn't, that is a cheap way of describing my stance............... watch my lips.

• I was Grateful what Steve did in stopping the rot, when we was haemoragging goals under RDM and said so....which was predictably misconstrued.
• I was appalled at some of the vitriol aimed at him and the slinging of the cabbage and still am....It was uncalled for....That was the at the centre of me defending him.
• I was pleased when it came to an end as I thought his football was drab, uninspiring and not convincing.

so if you are going to pick me up on events of over 2 years ago, at least do your research.

[TRO]

19 minutes ago, HKP90 said:

OK. Would you work for that company?

How long do you think it will last when they sack all their decent salesmen after 6 months, and then have to find replacements. Assuming you hired the best folks you could in the first place (and you would). How long before you get to Options B, C, D etc, who are inept and couldn't sell in 18 months what the first guy did in 6? 

 

I did......and you get grilled.....come up with reasonable responses and feasible reasoning and they are equally as reasonable with their views.....waffle and BS your way through and it could get tricky.

I understand Dean cannot share with us all his warts and all.....and if he could we maybe more understanding, but his bosses will want to know £100 mill is an investment, not a gift.

Its a principle of example, thats all it is.

There are no free rides, and the more you earn in any job ,the more accountable it becomes, its what happens, generally or used to when I was in Sales.....Which is performance related in pay, much like football , only a lot less.

 

[sne]

Just now, TRO said:

No I didn't, that is a cheap way of describing my stance............... watch my lips.

• I was Grateful what Steve did in stopping the rot, when we was haemoragging goals under RDM and said so....which was predictably misconstrued.
• I was appalled at some of the vitriol aimed at him and the slinging of the cabbage and still am....It was uncalled for....That was the at the centre of me defending him.
• I was pleased when it came to an end as I thought his football was drab, uninspiring and not convincing.

so if you are going to pick me up on events of over 2 years ago, at least do your research.

Mate I've went through that thread a bunch of times and you have about 1500-2000 (I even counted them once )  posts in it defending him to the teeth against any and all critique. At the end even you wanted him gone I'll give you that. 

As for research you do know we averaged the same amount of goals shipped under Bruce that we did under RDM in that first season. 12 in 11 games during RDM  and 36 in 35 for Bruce

[markc]

38 minutes ago, TRO said:

Ok

as an analogy.....you are a car salesman...with an annual target of 120 cars and you just do it........but the incremental breakdown is this,you make a great start and sell 90 in the first 6 months, but then go 6 months selling only 30.....hitting target of 120, phew home and dry....Ah!!

Do you think its reasonable for your Boss to ask questions when setting next years budget?...what is your true form, the first 6 or the second 6?

because I can assure you, they would.

Playing football is like making love to a beautiful woman

You’ve got to wait until there’s some grass on the pitch, then try and score,  get your balls out, get into position and then shoot in the box.

[TRO]

19 minutes ago, sne said:

Mate I've went through that thread a bunch of times and you have about 1500-2000 (I even counted them once )  posts in it defending him to the teeth against any and all critique. At the end even you wanted him gone I'll give you that. 

As for research you do know we averaged the same amount of goals shipped under Bruce that we did under RDM in that first season. 12 in 11 games during RDM  and 36 in 35 for Bruce

Mate, are you that interested in me to trawl through all those posts....I wouldn't tell anyone, if it were me, in fear of embarrassment.

I guess I may have had moments when I went OTT too against all the critique.....but my motives were in those 3 lines in my previous post.

perhaps its good time to mention him after his manager of the Month award.....and a very good Newcastle performance.

Look, its gone, that boat has sailed, I said my bit as did his antagonists.....

Dean Smith is our manager and all I am interested in is him now.....ok?

Edited May 16, 2021 by TRO

[HKP90]

8 minutes ago, markc said:

Playing football is like making love to a beautiful woman

You’ve got to wait until there’s some grass on the pitch, then try and score,  get your balls out, get into position and then shoot in the box.

This is my favourite ever villatalk post.

Ever.

[TRO]

9 minutes ago, markc said:

Playing football is like making love to a beautiful woman

You’ve got to wait until there’s some grass on the pitch, then try and score,  get your balls out, get into position and then shoot in the box.

classic.

[TRO]

47 minutes ago, allani said:

That is why targets are always slightly flawed.  As I said there are ways of us being on the exact same points, goal difference, number of wins, etc - where I would have been absolutely delighted to be where we are.  As you say we are ahead statistically of where I thought we would be.  However, I think you have to consider other factors when assessing performance and on that I think there are questions that need to be addressed.  Ultimately when we look back at the end of the season it will have been a success.  But if we want to continue that success we need to build on the things we've done well and learn from those things that have gone less well.  Hopefully then we'll all be really happy this time next year!  And nice to debate with you!  I'm trying to take some of your confidence and optimism with me!!!!

The problem is, is finding someone to debate the not so savoury stuff with, without getting too down beat, whilst doing it........they are like rocking horse manure.

I might move in next door to you.

 

Edited May 16, 2021 by TRO

[chappy]

1 hour ago, allani said:

This is exactly right.  We've "kept faith" with managers too long in the past and things got worse and worse.  Smith should have come in 4 months sooner than he did so that he had a summer to rebuild rather than let Bruce spunk more money on old players on big wages and no resale value.  We can't wait for Smith to fail.  We have to make a change when we think that his replacement will be an upgrade capable of taking us to the next level. 

Seems to be an increasingly prevalent problem on here

[TRO]

20 minutes ago, TRO said:

classic.

does she really have to be Beautiful? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

[TRO]

58 minutes ago, allani said:

Yeah I know.    The message would depend on who you replaced him with.  If you brought in a Steve Bruce type that would be one message.  If you brought in an Ancellotti type it would be a very different message.  Anyway I think we are probably losing this analogy thing now (partly my fault!).  Hopefully we can both be celebrating a great season next year!

Proper ding dong that....top man HKP90