Weekends Football 7/9 May

[VillaChris]

2 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

And the disaster that is us finishing 10th if Leeds finish 9th also doesn't account for that meaning we would finish above arsenal and wolves... 

I think for me it would just sum up how unlucky we are as a club, finishing 11th with potentially 55 points when we actually have a good season. Reminds me of the times we didn't get into europe automatically in 6th when likes of Milwall and Portsmouth were reaching cup finals.

We finished 9th in 10/11 with just 48 points so getting 7 more to just be bottom half would be a bit of a kick in the nuts.

Edited May 8, 2021 by VillaChris

[Mark Albrighton]

1 minute ago, est1874 said:

Sorry but how is that the only thing that matters? 

Does the future matter, yes of course. But are you actually suggesting that where we finish this season doesn't? 

You do understand the objective of football, and of sport right? 

This idea that a season is a write-off once it's not longer possible to win a trophy or qualify in another competition is ridiculous. 

We should want - always - to finish as high as mathematically possible, and then we should want to push on and better that finish next season. That's literally the point of all this, otherwise what are we doing here? Why bother watch a single minute of any game between now and the end of the season if it doesn't matter?

Just a bit odd you seem to be particularly bothered about finishing above Leeds. 

Presumably you’ll be here tomorrow bemoaning if Arsenal get a result? 

Because as you say the object is to finish as high as possible, so it’s probably not unreasonable to expect you to comment on all remaining fixtures that may impact our final league placing.
 

[MachoFantastico]

Rooney's Derby so lucky there, but sometimes you need that to stay up. We have a hardcore Wednesday fan in our family and he'll be heartbroken but not surprised. That club as been run so shockingly poor by a scumbag owner for a while now. 

[useless]

Most boring championship season in a long time, two relegated teams from the premier league promoted with games to spare, play-offs also already decided with games to spare, and looking like another relegated team could win them, and probably the three teams that most would have predicted to go down have gone down, Wednesday because of their points deduction.

[est1874]

1 minute ago, DCJonah said:

We should aim to finish high but it also doesn't matter. Finishing 9th or 12th is not going to have a major impact on us long term. 

Technically nothing in sport "matters". If we want to down the rabbit hole of clear gains being insignificant, that's the outcome. 

When I look back on Villa season finishes in future years, when I'm old and reminiscing with sons or grandsons, I'd rather see multiple top-half finishes during this period than multiple bottom-half finishes. It's really quite simple.

[DCJonah]

2 minutes ago, est1874 said:

Technically nothing in sport "matters". If we want to down the rabbit hole of clear gains being insignificant, that's the outcome. 

When I look back on Villa season finishes in future years, when I'm old and reminiscing with sons or grandsons, I'd rather see multiple top-half finishes during this period than multiple bottom-half finishes. It's really quite simple.

Well no not really. Qualifying for European football and relegation have big impacts on a club. Getting worked up because when you're retired, you'll see 12th next to our name when looking back through history books seems a bit OTT.

[est1874]

8 minutes ago, Mark Albrighton said:

Just a bit odd you seem to be particularly bothered about finishing above Leeds. 

Presumably you’ll be here tomorrow bemoaning if Arsenal get a result? 

Because as you say the object is to finish as high as possible, so it’s probably not unreasonable to expect you to comment on all remaining fixtures that may impact our final league placing.
 

Bit of an obnoxious comment this, to be fair. Of course I'll be annoyed if Arsenal win and finish above us, and based on all remaining fixtures I believe they will, too. I don't know what I'll be doing tomorrow or whether I'll be free to watch the Arsenal game in the evening, it may rest on how I feel about football after seeing our performance earlier in the afternoon.

Why do you imagine I only care about Leeds? It's a bit odd that you seem to be particularly bothered about what I think of them.

Edited May 8, 2021 by est1874

[villa4europe]

6 minutes ago, est1874 said:

Technically nothing in sport "matters". If we want to down the rabbit hole of clear gains being insignificant, that's the outcome. 

When I look back on Villa season finishes in future years, when I'm old and reminiscing with sons or grandsons, I'd rather see multiple top-half finishes during this period than multiple bottom-half finishes. It's really quite simple.

Honest... I won't remember them in 10 years time 

I don't remember the league position finishes under eck or lambert, think we were 9th under ged, obviously 7th 3 times under MON but I also don't remember where we finished in his first 2 seasons 

11th or 9th has very little relevance long term 

Edit - 6th under Mon, see what I mean

Edited May 8, 2021 by villa4europe

[est1874]

Just now, DCJonah said:

Well no not really. Qualifying for European football and relegation have big impacts on a club. Getting worked up because when you're retired, you'll see 12th next to our name when looking back through history books seems a bit OTT.

Not getting worked up at all. You're claiming it doesn't matter, and I'm pointing out why it does.

[DCJonah]

5 minutes ago, est1874 said:

Not getting worked up at all. You're claiming it doesn't matter, and I'm pointing out why it does.

OK, you get annoyed then. 

[useless]

Of course finising top half matters, Dean Smith himself said in his interview yesterday that that's our aim. People saying it doesn't matter now, but I'm sure if we manage it they will bring it up often enough in praise of Smith and how far he's brought us, suddenly a top half finish will matter and mean something then.

We're allowed to set targets, it seems some are scared to have any kind of ambition because if it doesn't work out it will somehow reflect badly on the manager.

 

[DCJonah]

Just now, useless said:

Of course finising top half matters, Dean Smith himself said in his interview yesterday that that's our aim. People saying it doesn't matter now, but I'm sure if we manage it they will bring it up often enough in praise of Smith and how far he's brought us, suddenly a top half finish will matter and mean something then.

We're allowed to set targets, it seems some are scared to have any kind of ambition because if it doesn't work out it will somehow reflect badly on the manager.

 

No, there's a major difference between aiming for something and being proud of achieving that and getting worked up if it doesn't happen. 

I'd love to win the FA Cup, and I'd rightly be signing our praises if we managed it, but it doesn't have a massive impact on us if we don't. 

 

[villa4europe]

1 minute ago, useless said:

Of course finising top half matters, Dean Smith himself said in his interview yesterday that that's our aim. People saying it doesn't matter now, but I'm sure if we manage it they will bring it up often enough in praise of Smith and how far he's brought us, suddenly a top half finish will matter and mean something then.

We're allowed to set targets, it seems some are scared to have any kind of ambition because if it doesn't work out it will somehow reflect badly on the manager.

How does it matter? Other than prize money? 

It doesn't mean that I don't want to, I obviously want to but I fail to see how it matters long term, where we finish this season (based on it being 8th to 12th) has no relevance on where we finish next season, it should have no relevance on our budgets* or transfer targets 

The praise thing goes the other way too, it'll be a reason to criticise if we don't do it 

* the additional prize money will result in additional player bonuses 

 

[SuperTed]

Now back to the elite premier league games, with that clash of the titans checks notes Sheffield United vs Crystal Palace

[VillaChris]

3 minutes ago, useless said:

Of course finising top half matters, Dean Smith himself said in his interview yesterday that that's our aim. People saying it doesn't matter now, but I'm sure if we manage it they will bring it up often enough in praise of Smith and how far he's brought us, suddenly a top half finish will matter and mean something then.

We're allowed to set targets, it seems some are scared to have any kind of ambition because if it doesn't work out it will somehow reflect badly on the manager.

 

Spot on.

However more than happy with 55 points if we get there, just ridiculously unlucky if that isn't even good enough for 10th.

[VillaChris]

2 minutes ago, SuperTed said:

Now back to the elite premier league games, with that clash of the titans checks notes Sheffield United vs Crystal Palace

3pm seems to be the slot this season for the premier league game of the weekend that no one cares about, likes of Palace seem to have played at that time regularly.

[sidcow]

29 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Derby stay up with ONE point from their last 7 games.

Indeed stretch it back and they've won once in last 15 games.

Even SHA haven't stayed up with that sort of record over last 5 years.

Not like they were even miles clear of bottom 3 at any point.

Typical championship.

I was just coming on to write something similar. 

Certainly made a good fist of staying up didn't they. 

LOST

LOST

LOST

LOST

DRAW

Inspirational escape. 

[useless]

The whole point of competing in the league is to finish as high as possible, if you're going to say that it dosesn't matter if we finish 11th or 9th then when does it stop, going by that logic you might as well say that there's no difference between finishing seventh or seventeenth because you don't win or lose anything in either scenario, would be no point in most teams even taking part in the season.

A top half finish would be symbolic as much as anything else, the last time we managed it was ten years ago, if we don't do it not the end of the world, but something to aim and hope for in the mean time.

[villalad21]

Leeds have a much easier run in.

They'll probably finish above us

[PieFacE]

4 minutes ago, useless said:

The whole point of competing in the league is to finish as high as possible, if you're going to say that it dosesn't matter if we finish 11th or 9th then when does it stop, going by that logic you might as well say that there's no difference between finishing seventh or seventeenth because you don't win or lose anything in either scenario, would be no point in most teams even taking part in the season.

A top half finish would be symbolic as much as anything else, the last time we managed it was ten years ago, if we don't do it not the end of the world, but something to aim and hope for in the mean time.

In my humble opinion, finishing between 12th-9th doesn't matter for us as a club. Regardless of where we finish (on the assumption we finish between 9th-12th), it still shows huge progress on last season. We've also had to play 9 or 10 games without our best player and captain too. So taking those factors into consideration, I couldn't really give a monkeys where we finish. That's not to say I wouldn't take enjoyment from finishing 9th, just that looking at the big picture of where we are as a club, it means nothing. 

We should be aiming for a top half finish, we should be going into every game trying to win. but it matters not if we fall short.

Edited May 8, 2021 by PieFacE