Summer transfer window 2021

[Philosopher]

24 minutes ago, Panto_Villan said:

Surely by that logic Jed Steer should be out on his ear? But I think it'd be pretty crazy if we were breaking the bank trying to buy another keeper as good as Martinez right now. Arsenal tried having two good keepers at the same time but had to sell us Martinez because he didn't want to sit on the bench any more. Didn't they have to rush out and buy some god-awful Icelandic keeper to replace him who turned out to be a distaster?

There's nothing wrong in having experienced players come in who are good at their jobs but won't throw their toys out of the pram and look to move on if they're not picked every week. If there's a clearly better option on the table then that's fine and we should go for that instead (maybe Max Aarons if he was going to be cheap and was happy to sit on the bench), but if not then someone like Bertrand could be perfect for us imo. Allows us to spend our transfer kitty elsewhere without destroying our season if Targett breaks his leg.

We had Heaton competing with Martinez. 

You only buy back ups when you have a genuine world class performer in your first team in that position. As getting in a player good enough to compete / displace is virtually impossible.

I personally don't rate Bertrand that highly. Solid left back at his best, but not top class. Now he is 31 and losing his pace hell no!

[skarroki]

Bertrand won't go down in Value because we're signing him for £0. He's not a Micah Richards, he's not signing on a 4 year contract on crazy wages. If the wages are stupid obviously it's a no go. 

I was only suggesting him as a name to throw into the mix, but the general response seems to be that we would rather go into the season with Targett and whoever plays LB in the academy as our only options instead of bringing in an England international who has previously kept Targett out the side and has played consistently in the Prem for a decade. 

Or we sign this 20-23 year old player who will be as good as Targett and come in on less wages than Bertrand and increase in value sat on the bench. Who is that player? Genuinely curious because I can't think of someone. Aarons is a good suggestion but I think he's better at RB and not as good as Cash

[MotoMkali]

3 minutes ago, paul514 said:

Oyarzabel is Grealish level.

Holland did it yesterday as well no Koopmeiners, Gravenbach, Mallen got like 2 minutes on the pitch and Wjindal got like 25 mins.

I agree Oyarzabal is grealish level. I'm sure if you go to page 100 or so in this thread you will see me banging the drum of trying to break the bank to get him. 

But Llorente and Olmo are far more capable as creators than Sterling and Foden. 

[Cosmik Debris]

Isak for Sweden looks a good player, 21 years old , strong quick and good ball control. 

[Philosopher]

8 minutes ago, MotoMkali said:

Tbf Spain have a lot more creative talent than England. Although why you would play morata over Moreno I have no idea. 

No way. We have loads of creative talent. Jack, Foden, Sancho, Mount, Rashford, and Sterling. That's serous quality. England don't lose out in comparison. England on paper, only the central defenders lose out to Spain, but our strikers are better!

I'd take Jack ahead.of any creative talent at this tournament.

[ccfcman]

1 minute ago, Philosopher said:

I'd take Jack ahead.of any creative talent at this tournament.

I'd love to view life through such an optimistic shade of rose! He's really, really good but be a shade realistic with yourself too! 
 

[MotoMkali]

7 minutes ago, Philosopher said:

No way. We have loads of creative talent. Jack, Foden, Sancho, Mount, Rashford, and Sterling. That's serous quality. England don't lose out in comparison. England on paper, only the central defenders lose out to Spain, but our strikers are better!

I'd take Jack ahead.of any creative talent at this tournament.

And the only one who can consistently create goals for others is Sancho who underperforms for England. The fact is Spain are so stacked with Talent they left a guy who got 13 assists in La Liga at home. Llorente got 12 goals and 11 assists. Olmo got 10 assists. Foden got 5. Sterling got 8. Mount got 6.

The Spaniards have a level of creative talent England can't match in anyone but grealish and Sancho. 

Spain have easily the best overall squad in the tournament. They are so good they can leave **** Sergio ramos at home. And take 24 players instead of 26.

I would take Grealish over anyone as well. But old cocknose refuses to play our 2 best attacking players. 

Edited June 14, 2021 by MotoMkali

[paul514]

10 minutes ago, MotoMkali said:

I agree Oyarzabal is grealish level. I'm sure if you go to page 100 or so in this thread you will see me banging the drum of trying to break the bank to get him. 

But Llorente and Olmo are far more capable as creators than Sterling and Foden. 

Yea if we have a big budget I would be making a call to his agent..

I like Foden, his numbers aren't fantastic but he is a very good player.

As for Sterling and Rashford they aren't creative players IMO.

With wide forwards I think you get two types...

1. Players like Grealish, Foden, Sancho
2. Players like Rashford and Sterling.

1 Is creators, 2 is goal scorers, they are more direct and look to get behind the defenders.

Liverpool for example play with 2 in Salah and Mane. City play with 1

[MotoMkali]

1 minute ago, paul514 said:

Yea if we have a big budget I would be making a call to his agent..

I like Foden, his numbers aren't fantastic but he is a very good player.

As for Sterling and Rashford they aren't creative players IMO.

With wide forwards I think you get two types...

1. Players like Grealish, Foden, Sancho
2. Players like Rashford and Sterling.

1 Is creators, 2 is goal scorers, they are more direct and look to get behind the defenders.

Liverpool for example play with 2 in Salah and Mane. City play with 1

Why do people say foden is a creator. He just isn't. He has terrible key pass statistics and got an average number of assists for a winger. Traore got more than him.

[Philosopher]

12 minutes ago, skarroki said:

Bertrand won't go down in Value because we're signing him for £0. He's not a Micah Richards, he's not signing on a 4 year contract on crazy wages. If the wages are stupid obviously it's a no go. 

I was only suggesting him as a name to throw into the mix, but the general response seems to be that we would rather go into the season with Targett and whoever plays LB in the academy as our only options instead of bringing in an England international who has previously kept Targett out the side and has played consistently in the Prem for a decade. 

Or we sign this 20-23 year old player who will be as good as Targett and come in on less wages than Bertrand and increase in value sat on the bench. Who is that player? Genuinely curious because I can't think of someone. Aarons is a good suggestion but I think he's better at RB and not as good as Cash

Lots of good left backs around, nobody is saying not to sign a left eback. What we are saying is not a good solution. A temporary stop gap at best.

Targett has had a good season, but is limited. I believe we need a good viable pacy alternative. We need someone more dynamic for me. 

[Philosopher]

10 minutes ago, ccfcman said:

I'd love to view life through such an optimistic shade of rose! He's really, really good but be a shade realistic with yourself too! 
 

OK so maybe Mbappe is a head of Jack. But otherwise who is better than Jack. Torres, Olmo, Foden, Insigne, Dembele, Gnabry, Havertz, Pogba, Silva all quality but I'd have Jack before all of them.

[ccfcman]

8 minutes ago, Philosopher said:

OK so maybe Mbappe is a head of Jack. But otherwise who is better than Jack. Torres, Olmo, Foden, Insigne, Dembele, Gnabry, Havertz, Pogba, Silva all quality but I'd have Jack before all of them.

Joshua Kimmich has created as many goals as Jack from a defensive position. Coman has matched his output but played far less, Sancho scored more but with nearly identical time played, Oyarzabal beats all of these players in goals + assists. Small sample size and all different players even if they do occupy similar positions.

I'd have Jack over anyone with my Villa hat on, but I don't have the England blinkers  

Jack is probably the most complete midfielder, save for maybe Kimmich but he's also the most defensively minded.

Edited June 14, 2021 by ccfcman

[skarroki]

32 minutes ago, Cosmik Debris said:

Isak for Sweden looks a good player, 21 years old , strong quick and good ball control. 

Big fan of Isak but I think he'll be looking to move to a club higher than us if he leaves Sociedad.

[Tomaszk]

Dortmund have a buy-back in place with Isak. They'll be using it whenever they sell Haaland.

[Philosopher]

14 minutes ago, MotoMkali said:

And the only one who can consistently create goals for others is Sancho who underperforms for England. The fact is Spain are so stacked with Talent they left a guy who got 13 assists in La Liga at home. Llorente got 12 goals and 11 assists. Olmo got 10 assists. Foden got 5. Sterling got 8. Mount got 6.

The Spaniards have a level of creative talent England can't match in anyone but grealish and Sancho. 

Spain have easily the best overall squad in the tournament. They are so good they can leave **** Sergio ramos at home. And take 24 players instead of 26.

I would take Grealish over anyone as well. But old cocknose refuses to play our 2 best attacking players. 

Foden is up there. Sterling numbers historically are excellent. Mount is more than just a creator. Maddison had 11 goals and 10 assists last season. Not in the squad. Also it is well accepted that the Premier league as a whole is the most competitive league in the world so the number from the Spanish league don't quite carry the same weight. Also Rashford got 21 goals and 15 assists last season. 11 goals and 11 assist just in the league. Sterling in a bad season for home scored 14 and assisted 12. 10 and 8 in the league only.

It's too easy to sell our own players short. Familiarity breeds contempt.

 

[Philosopher]

32 minutes ago, ccfcman said:

Joshua Kimmich has created as many goals as Jack from a defensive position. Coman has matched his output but played far less, Sancho scored more but with nearly identical time played, Oyarzabal beats all of these players in goals + assists. Small sample size and all different players even if they do occupy similar positions.

I'd have Jack over anyone with my Villa hat on, but I don't have the England blinkers  

Jack is probably the most complete midfielder, save for maybe Kimmich but he's also the most defensively minded.

Jack runs games there aren't stats for that. Best dribbler in the world after Messi. I am biased, but Jack is really special. Goals and Assists aren't the whole picture.

[Philosopher]

59 minutes ago, paul514 said:

Yea if we have a big budget I would be making a call to his agent..

I like Foden, his numbers aren't fantastic but he is a very good player.

As for Sterling and Rashford they aren't creative players IMO.

With wide forwards I think you get two types...

1. Players like Grealish, Foden, Sancho
2. Players like Rashford and Sterling.

1 Is creators, 2 is goal scorers, they are more direct and look to get behind the defenders.

Liverpool for example play with 2 in Salah and Mane. City play with 1

I see this a little differently. The first group play in front of defenses in tight spaces, the second group run between and behind the lines.

The second group create just as many assist and opening as the other group. Rashford had prem goals and 11 prem assists last season. Sterling 10 and 8. Ferran Torres is also more of a group 2 type. Sterling is also good in tight spaces, with is low centre of gravity.

[VillaChris]

6 hours ago, TRO said:

But someone has to do the ugly stuff.....its non negotiable......someone has to do it.....and when they do, they have to be appreciated, for doing it.

its a wise team, that respects the opposition.

if a team doesn't have that someone, they are likely to concede goals.

just my humble opinion, too.

We can probably sign McTominay for about 2m after his performance today!

[VillaChris]

6 hours ago, pas5898 said:

Zaha will cost 50million + and at his age will have limited resale value. 

As we are behind commercially, thats not sustainable. 

I think Zaha would be Collymore esque if we signed him. Would look good on paper but would ruin a stable dressing room as imagine his reactions on the pitch when we pass to Jack when he's unmarked on the other side.

Not worth it at all.

[VillaChris]

1 hour ago, Cosmik Debris said:

Isak for Sweden looks a good player, 21 years old , strong quick and good ball control. 

He isn't moving from being a first choice at top 6 club in Spain who've just won the cup to be Ollie's backup I'm afraid.

Talk Dortmund have a buy back on him aswell. Edit: Mentioned on previous page.

Quaison might not have been a bad pick up but seems he's moving to Serie A.

Edited June 14, 2021 by VillaChris