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Summer transfer window 2021


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6 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

We're not getting Tammy. I'll refer to this post after window closes

Well we aren't going to sign 98% of the players mentioned in this thread.  So it will be a pretty boring thread if we can't discuss any of them and how that might change the way we line up...

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3 minutes ago, allani said:

Or is it?  Maybe its a 4-2-3-1 or a 4-2-2-1-1.  Gives us at least 3 different plans without having to make a single substitution.  There is no way that Ollie can't play the role that Ross was supposed to play this season but with about 4 times the goal threat.

Like I say it would be very fluid. That would be the beauty of it. It’s very progressive and even if it’s only a suggestion I think it’s a good one. Some top teams now are playing without a recognised centre forward, so why not interchangeable centre forwards?

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10 hours ago, TRO said:

I couldn't have put it any better......absolutley spot on.

Kante's reading of the game, his anticipation and positional sense, sets him aside from most players....but equally he is not shy of getting his foot in, to disrupt play......for a dot, he causes trouble for opponents.

That is the key, to that position, causing an effect to disrupt oppositions intentions of play.....He does it with aplomb.

I still favour a more powerful specimen in that role, but would not say no to Kante....I too do not have a problem with Luiz, except to say, I don't not see the level of player to compare with Kante, despite them both being on the slight side.....Douglas may prove me wrong, but at present, I see a player, with more attacking tendency.....Dougie is not in the same class as Kante without the ball.

In most statements in football there is always and exception, thankfully you have the articulation to see that, and thus have described the situation to a tee.

Comparing anyone to kante in this generation is like comparing people to makelele a few years back. Kante is on a different level and has been for a while. We can't really hope to sign anyone who *already* has all those attributes. We might luck out though and manage to get someone with the potential to get close and coach them there.

That could be luiz but I think he's naturally more forward thinking, he might grow into the role of destroying the oppositions attacks but I think his brain is more creative. Kante has both and is special for that very reason. If it's not Luiz and it's not nakamba (nakamba is more a destroyer than a creator) then we either have to do it like 99% of teams and find a good blend in the middle with different players or get really lucky with a kid who in a couple of years turns out to be something special himself.

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26 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

We're not getting Tammy. I'll refer to this post after window closes

I reckon someone could well mention this post if he signs for us. Provided anyone can be bothered. 

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8 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

Based on observation. When has Smith started 442 with 2 strikers?

as I mentioned, he has said before he is not against playing two strikers. When he brings Davis on we play 442 all be it only when we are losing and late (ish) in the game.

Not denying he sets us up to play 433 and the majority of our tactics have been based on that, but I think that has been partly to do with Davis not being a natural finisher and Wes being injured/returning from injury. People moan about lack of Plan B/tactical inflexibility, so having another decent striker so we can switch to 442 would make sense.

Either way we can't go another season with only one striker capable of actually scoring. Traore can play as a striker but as others have pointed out he doesn't really hold the ball up well so a lone striker role seems unsuited.

Relying on Wes or Davis again as back ups to Ollie is a huge gamble and I think Barry is not yet ready to be a regular (maybe he'll get some game time in the cups).


 

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4 minutes ago, VillanousOne said:

as I mentioned, he has said before he is not against playing two strikers. When he brings Davis on we play 442 all be it only when we are losing and late (ish) in the game.

Not denying he sets us up to play 433 and the majority of our tactics have been based on that, but I think that has been partly to do with Davis not being a natural finisher and Wes being injured/returning from injury. People moan about lack of Plan B/tactical inflexibility, so having another decent striker so we can switch to 442 would make sense.

Either way we can't go another season with only one striker capable of actually scoring. Traore can play as a striker but as others have pointed out he doesn't really hold the ball up well so a lone striker role seems unsuited.

Relying on Wes or Davis again as back ups to Ollie is a huge gamble and I think Barry is not yet ready to be a regular (maybe he'll get some game time in the cups).


 

If Wes isn't deemed capable to perform this season we'll sign back up. Not 40m Tammy though. 

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Just now, Kiwivillan said:

If Wes isn't deemed capable to perform this season we'll sign back up. Not 40m Tammy though. 

Nah, if Wes isn’t deemed right, we’ll sign Tammy or somebody of that standard

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1 minute ago, nick76 said:

Nah, if Wes isn’t deemed right, we’ll sign Tammy or somebody of that standard

We won't spend 30-40m on a backup striker and we won't play 2 strikers and Watkins won't change from lone striker. I'm sorry that's the reality. 

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1 hour ago, VillanousOne said:

You have insider knowledge or just blind guessing? Tammy has no future at Chelsea and loved it at Villa.

It's hard to put transfer priorities into perspective as even for those making the decisions, what they want, want we need, what we can afford and what is available are rarely the same thing.

We have first team gaps such as (arguably) a specialist defensive midfielder and a more consistent left winger (for you Anwar haters).

but we chronically need someone who can deputise forGrealish when he is injured, especially if the shin issues are likely to reoccur.

But we also need another striker, as Olly will get injured or suspended, and Davies and Wes don't yet seem capable deputies, plus Dean has said he actually wants to play 442 and other formations, so signing someone like Tammy would make a lot of sense, plus Ollie won't rage quit if he has to play with another striker or out wide, only at Villa has he been the lone striker.

I am sure Tammy did like it here but the fact is he didnt want to leave Chelsea last 2 seasons and we have upgraded. No chance in hell we are paying 40 million for a back up centre forward which he would be at this stage

I dont think is many teams that have splashed 100 million on a 3 striker forward line especially not a midtable team

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36 minutes ago, VillanousOne said:

That's your opinion of Smith's opinion, not fact.

I think he has started 2 strikers once since he got to Villa that was Davis and Samatta at the end of last season maybe Liverpool or Chelsea

 

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35 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

Based on observation. When has Smith started 442 with 2 strikers?

Leicester won the league with it when Shakespeare was there didnt they?  I wouldn't rule it out.  These days I'm not really sure 4-3-3, 4-5-1, 4-4-2 really exist anyway, they're all slightly different versions of the same thing.

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3 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said:

Leicester won the league with it when Shakespeare was there didnt they?  I wouldn't rule it out.  These days I'm not really sure 4-3-3, 4-5-1, 4-4-2 really exist anyway, they're all slightly different versions of the same thing.

but Leicester had Ngolo Kante, probably the last team in the last 15 years to win the league playing 4-4-2 and not sure any teams have won Champions League in that time playing the same system.

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1 minute ago, nick76 said:

Nah, if Wes isn’t deemed right, we’ll sign Tammy or somebody of that standard

Agreed. That’s the whole point of building a strong squad. You don’t have to have them as reserves waiting in the wings, because we’re perhaps not in a position at this moment to have £40m players on the bench. However you have to find a way of using players in a way that is perhaps a little more flexible to include top players in different ways. 

This attitude that we can only have 11 good players and the rest have to be backup players who aren’t as good is backwards thinking. We will never consistently progress thinking that way. It will get harder from now onwards as the standard of players needed goes up, but if we really intend to become a club that consistently competes for trophies and be a top club then we have to think like a top club. 

As fans we have to dare to dream, which isn’t easy given what has happened over the years. Those that pull the strings at the club have the job of making those dreams come true.  Possibly for the first time in my 50+ years of supporting the club, I believe we have owners who have the ambition, skills and finances to take us to the very top. In NSWE we have dream makers. 

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Just now, Kiwivillan said:

We won't spend 30-40m on a backup striker and we won't play 2 strikers and Watkins won't change from lone striker. I'm sorry that's the reality. 

Maybe, maybe not.  We’ve never had two quality fit strikers under Smith leadership from Tammy to Wes to Samatta to Ollie (obviously not counting Davis).  He’s never had the choice to play two up top and maybe that’s his choice or maybe not  or as we are progressing and building a squad you have two quality options for rotation, injury, form, tactics.  If we go into the season with one recognised striker then we are silly again and you can see from Wolves how it killed their season with a poor back up.  I don’t think you can scrimp and save in the goal scoring striker and your GK.  You may be able to compensate in other positions but I don’t think you can in those.  

If Ollie gets Ben Mee’d early on, our season will be shattered without a quality alternative. If we are lucky and doesn’t happen then what great competition we have upfront....the choices, ideas, formations....just options....like a big eight team have....Cavani, Greenwood, Martial...Aguero, Jesus....Werner, Tammy, Giroud...Salah, Firminio, Mane, Jota...Kane, Son, Moura, Bale, Vinicius...Aubemenyang, Lacazette, Nketiah....to name few.

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14 minutes ago, Zatman said:

I think he has started 2 strikers once since he got to Villa that was Davis and Samatta at the end of last season maybe Liverpool or Chelsea

 

Hasn’t had the option though if he wanted, he obviously doesn’t favour Davis so had no options to do anything else.  I agree he loves 433 but he’s had no option to play anything else

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1 minute ago, nick76 said:

Hasn’t had the option though if he wanted, he obviously doesn’t favour Davis so had no options to do anything else.  I agree he loves 433 but he’s had no option to play anything else

yeah but the one time he did play it was Davis and Samatta which was desperation. He had options of Kodjia and Tammy and never did it even vs teams we could destroy, even when both started Kodj played out wide

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5 minutes ago, DaveAV1 said:

Agreed. That’s the whole point of building a strong squad. You don’t have to have them as reserves waiting in the wings, because we’re perhaps not in a position at this moment to have £40m players on the bench. However you have to find a way of using players in a way that is perhaps a little more flexible to include top players in different ways. 

This attitude that we can only have 11 good players and the rest have to be backup players who aren’t as good is backwards thinking. We will never consistently progress thinking that way. It will get harder from now onwards as the standard of players needed goes up, but if we really intend to become a club that consistently competes for trophies and be a top club then we have to think like a top club. 

As fans we have to dare to dream, which isn’t easy given what has happened over the years. Those that pull the strings at the club have the job of making those dreams come true.  Possibly for the first time in my 50+ years of supporting the club, I believe we have owners who have the ambition, skills and finances to take us to the very top. In NSWE we have dream makers. 

I agree, we have to stop thinking of back up players and start thinking of a squad and players fight for their position.  It means if our first XI isn’t playing well we can change it up.  We can rest players who look tired or out of form or injured or suspended.  If we don’t then it’s hard to be expecting us to fight for top 8 placing or cup trophies because our competition is already there. 

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2 minutes ago, Zatman said:

yeah but the one time he did play it was Davis and Samatta which was desperation. He had options of Kodjia and Tammy and never did it even vs teams we could destroy, even when both started Kodj played out wide

But you answered your own point.  You would never play Davis and Samatta unless you were desperate.  Smith had Tammy, then Wes, the Samatta, then Ollie. He hasn’t had two quality fit strikers available at the same time.  Kodj had lost the plot by then and Smith doesn’t favour Davis.  I still think, even if he prefers only one striker, to go into a season with one quality ready striker is madness and we’ve just seen what happened to Wolves when they gambled...sold Jota and then Jimenez got injured and it killed their season before it had started because they had to rely on the kid Silva and Jose

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