The Next Level

[KentVillan]

2 hours ago, Delphinho123 said:

It's been bugging me for a while now and whilst the obvious answer is...''You can always improve', how do we get to the next level as a club and what positions do we strengthen in the Summer? I'm so in awe of the job Smith is doing and love so many of our players at the moment, I'm finding it hard to see who we replace in our current starting XI.

Great post. Was thinking exact same thing.

I think we will just add competition for places, and then challenge the current first XI to “keep their place”.

That’s how Smith has always done it before. If you’re playing well, you keep your place - with a handful of exceptions (Hause being the main one, arguably AEG too).

So look at the bench for the main replacement targets:

• Left back upgrade on Neil Taylor
• Right back upgrade on Elmo / Guilbert 
• RCB replacement for Engels
• LCB replacement for Hause (maybe, although I think he has done well as a squad player - depends if he decides to move for first team football)
• DCM replacement for Nakamba
• Wingers in for Trez / AEG
• Another striker (although Barry will be pushing for a start in the next couple of years)

Only positions where I don’t really see much need are GK and Number 10, since Jack can play 10 if necessary and Smith’s happy to play without a 10 if Ross and Jack both unavailable.

But yeah I think we will replace weak squad players and create competition for places, with the existing XI either keeping their place on merit or becoming squad players.

Obviously that will all change if we lose key players to bigger clubs.

[rubberman]

Left Back, Right Back and 1 centre back.

1 DM (assuming Luiz stays). Personally would be tempted to see if we can improve on Barkely for the money he'll cost, but will give him a few more weeks to get back up to speed.

1 striker

1 (fast) winger.

If we get European football of some sort next season and we will also be in a really good position to have good cup runs and we want to push on up the league, there is going to be plenty of playing time for a squad at the level or above our current first team. But don't expect this to happen in one window.  

[Indigo]

Yeah, echo what a few have said already in that I don't think there's anyone in the starting XI I'd be choosing to replace, more so add competition in areas where it's lacking. Sanson isn't being signed as a "squad player", he's being signed as a quality addition that can challenge both McGinn and Barkley and not mean that we have a steep drop in standard once you get to the bench.

With that in mind I'd probably be prioritising left back, centre back (possibly right back I guess? Just given the circumstances of Elmo's contract/Guilbert's situation) and a striker assuming Wesley doesn't suddenly reach a level he'd yet to pre-injury.

[MotoMkali]

LW - Grealish should be Cam longterm. 

St- Watkins finishing is poor and so is his passing accuracy. He is great at pressing and holding the ball up but we could maybe improve on him although this is a much more long term position that the others. Especially since we also have wesley in the wings. 

Rw- Is traore the long term solution he certainly has class but he needs to improve his right peg before being the long term answer to that position.

Cdm- McGinn is clearly our weak spot at the minute. His positioning is exceedingly poor and against good teams his passes are too risky which results in him turning the ball over too quickly and putting us under pressure. Sanson may be the answer he may not be. 

Lb- We definitely need more depth. Originally I would have said he was the player we needed to replace but this season he has arguably been our most impactful player behind jack and Martinez. Both goals against city came when he was off the pitch for instance.

[lapal_fan]

I'd also like us to try and hit Watkins sooner in channels.  Watch the last few games, he makes good runs between defenders, but we usually miss the opportunity.

If we start hitting those passes sooner, you've made Ollie into a 20 goal a season striker.

I guarantee Ings is telling his midfielders to hit him into channels sooner.

[pete101]

Think the answer is in the first post, keep hold of the players , most are young and are gonna improve dramatically in the years to come , Konsa is the one that is improving at the highest rate and might be hardest to hold onto, with sanson purchase I can see us reverting back to system we played on promotion where jack and sjm were playing as 8s , this time keep jack wide and sanson in his position

[paul514]

3 hours ago, StefanAVFC said:

I don't think we need to improve our starting XI.

If we want to be at the next level, we need a squad; two quality players at every position. Look at the Spurs', Uniteds, City's. They can rotate and not weaken their first XI.

Emi
Heaton

Cash
XXXX

Konsa
XXXX

Mings
XXXX

Targett
XXXX

Luiz
XXXX

McGinn
Sanson

Barkley
Grealish

Traore
Trez / XXXX

Grealish
El Ghazi / XXXX

Watkins
XXXX

Basically replace every XXXX. That's the way to the next level.

I read the entire thread and this is the post I agree with on what positions to buy for, I don't agree we don't need to upgrade.

When I say I want to buy squad players it is for consistency when players drop form or get injured; these players should be playing more games in the cup competitions and IF we reach a european competition that automatically requires more quality players for a squad as it is nearly impossible to  do well in all the competitions without resting players.

What is vital is you purchase players that fit into the current group (obviously) and they are genuine competition for the existing player, preferably with room to improve and being young.

If I were to fill in those XXXX's I would go for 

RB Aarons (Norwich)
LB Wijndal (AZ)

CB Tuanzebe (Man Utd)
CB Simakan (Strasbourg)

DCM Sangare (PSV)

ACM Olise (Reading)
WF Brandt (Dortmund)
WF Buendia (Norwich)
CF Edouard (Celtic)

That assumes we don't buy Barkley

[TheAuthority]

I love how players are improving under Dean and his coaching staff. Pretty much every player that Dean has worked with has improved. Unless I'm missing someone?

I think we'll see the best of Cash and Ollie next season. This is only Ollie's 2nd season as a center forward!

[MattVillaPortsmouth]

To me,  to progress we need a couple of things, firstly consistency (top ** and/or Europe) or to win something - so providing we continue our form, summer should be looking to consolidate/establish/maintain our position, the top top players won’t come to sit on bench, so at moment for me it’s 1 big signing I summmer and replace Elmo, Taylor, Guilbert with younger versions these don’t have to be world beaters, just better but not just squad fillers.

These replacements need to either be capable of covering a player in first eleven or even better offer something different (our best players are not always our best eleven for a particular match) - so a big nasty CDM, or a defensive winger, or a technical striker 

The marque signing is either a Barkley replacement if not him, or him. 
 

Then it’s 1 or 2 bigs a year plus reap the rewards of our new invigorated youth set up.

[ender4]

It does become a lot harder to improve our first 11 going forward.   
 

Less players to choose from, wage demands much much higher, transfer fees much larger, and better quality want to be playing in the Champions League.

Will we hit that famous glass ceiling or can we somehow break through with the next level of players?

[ender4]

We really really need to qualify for Europe to attract the next level players.

[sharkyvilla]

We need to avoid the usual fate of teams who improve massively and end up having their players poached by bigger teams.  I have a hunch we won't have much trouble because Jack will set the example by sticking with us.  Luiz is the only one I worry about with the release clause but if we bought the clause out and gave him a whopping contract it would signal intent.  Apart from Martinez, I think Luiz is the closest to becoming world class (Jack already is imo) in the squad.

Each summer there's no real reason why we can't keep spending the same sort of money but on fewer players.  This should mean we could even go and get an upgrade on Barkley for £50-60m if we wanted.  Add a Louie Barry or two from the youth ranks then we will be flying.

[wilko154]

1 hour ago, MotoMkali said:

St- Watkins finishing is poor and so is his passing accuracy. He is great at pressing and holding the ball up but we could maybe improve on him although this is a much more long term position that the others. Especially since we also have wesley in the wings. 

He's probably the best finisher I've seen at Villa Park since Benteke. His finish for the disallowed goal on Saturday, the finish against Arsenal and the finish against Liverpool were all exceptional.

[MotoMkali]

Just now, wilko154 said:

He's probably the best finisher I've seen at Villa Park since Benteke. His finish for the disallowed goal on Saturday, the finish against Arsenal and the finish against Liverpool were all exceptional.

Sometimes his takes are really nice but we can't act like he hasn't missed some sitters. Statistically speaking he is the 2nd worst finisher in the league by xG only De bruyne  is worse. If you take away their missed penalties then they aren't so bad but still watkins is like 1.5 goals under his xG value. 

[wilko154]

I think we are now at the point where we could go out and spend big money on a statement signing this Summer. Which position we go for would be upto Smith; and it will mostly depend on who leaves. When I say a statement signing I'm talking dropping £40-60 million on a player; taking a teams best player who will become one of our best players instantly. Think of us buying Zaha from Palace, Ings from Southampton, Rice from West Ham (I'm not saying we will go for these players or that they would join us; it's more the intention)

If we don't sign Barkley we could go big on a player in that position.

If Man City take Luiz we could use that money plus more to go big on a player in that position.

 

The problem you have in upgrading players is that our current players won't be happy sitting on the bench each week; just look at Hourihane this season. You're then left with two options; you either rotate the team every few weeks in the way that Man City do, or you bring in younger players as the backups for each position to progress their way into the first team. I think we will follow the latter model.

[Zhan_Zhuang]

44 minutes ago, wilko154 said:

I think we are now at the point where we could go out and spend big money on a statement signing this Summer. Which position we go for would be upto Smith; and it will mostly depend on who leaves. When I say a statement signing I'm talking dropping £40-60 million on a player; taking a teams best player who will become one of our best players instantly. Think of us buying Zaha from Palace, Ings from Southampton, Rice from West Ham (I'm not saying we will go for these players or that they would join us; it's more the intention)

If we don't sign Barkley we could go big on a player in that position.

If Man City take Luiz we could use that money plus more to go big on a player in that position.

 

The problem you have in upgrading players is that our current players won't be happy sitting on the bench each week; just look at Hourihane this season. You're then left with two options; you either rotate the team every few weeks in the way that Man City do, or you bring in younger players as the backups for each position to progress their way into the first team. I think we will follow the latter model.

I agree and think this is possible.

However it would break the wage structure which might upset the apple cart, I'm not saying it's wrong as we must improve the first eleven.

Maybe a £30-40 million player is more likely. But who?

 

[villa4europe]

2 hours ago, ender4 said:

We really really need to qualify for Europe to attract the next level players.

I'll go another way... 

We really need to qualify for Europe in order to give the youngsters an opportunity to break through, looking at these kids coming through at arsenal for sure and then a lesser extent some of the Chelsea ones the vast majority of them made their debuts vs a club a can't spell from the furthest flung of Eastern Europe in a EL dead rubber

Saka, Smith Rowe, bellerin, maitland niles, Nelson, nketiah, zouma, gilmour, rashford, Greenwood, foden all make their debuts in europe, no doubt several more that I've missed

[Made In Aston]

7 hours ago, StefanAVFC said:

That's exactly what I said. But I'm not talking about squad players who just come in and do a job. I'm talking about equal quality. Look at City. On the wings, Sterling, Mahrez, Foden, Torres, Silva. I wouldn't say any of those are squad players, they all play equally.

You contradict yourself, as all those players are world class. Out of our wingers, only Grealish could be considered in that category. Bringing in someone as good as Traore won't take us to the next level. 

[smg]

2 hours ago, MotoMkali said:

Sometimes his takes are really nice but we can't act like he hasn't missed some sitters. Statistically speaking he is the 2nd worst finisher in the league by xG only De bruyne  is worse. If you take away their missed penalties then they aren't so bad but still watkins is like 1.5 goals under his xG value. 

I love statistics especially those that can show De Bruyne is the worst finisher in the league. Do Sheffield Utd, West Brom, Fulham, Newcastle all have better finishers than De Bruyne and Watkins. 

[MotoMkali]

Just now, smg said:

I love statistics especially those that can show De Bruyne is the worst finisher in the league. Do Sheffield Utd, West Brom, Fulham, Newcastle all have better finishers than De Bruyne and Watkins. 

It is to do with the number of Goals they should have scored compared to the number of goals they have scored. 

Those teams players barely have an expected goal between them. 

As I said the statistic is skewed by penalties so De Bruyne having missed (3?) penalties is obviously really bad but watkins has missed one so he should have scored close to another 2 goals with the chances he has had (not including those offside ones)