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Tempering expectations


Greenfly

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Get the feeling there's still some fans lurking out there who don't rate/aren't having DS for whatever reason. Bit bonkers considering how well we've played in vast majority of games this season.

When you don't rate a manager some keep on setting the metric above what is a reasonable expectation e.g. he kept us up last season "yeah but we should've finished 10th given we spent 120m". We could finish 7th or 8th this season "yeah but we've got Super Jack, should be 3rd at least" etc even though said person probably did a pre season prediction for us to finish 14th or something. As I did.:ph34r:

Can only think some want a world famous manager in like Everton have with Ancelotti or that guy who manages Leeds....forgot his name as I rarely see it on here....but mad considering how good we've been in so many games so far.

Social media is always a pool of hype and completely wild and extreme views without any real context though. I always think it's 99% of people tweeting with the mentality of Jay from the Inbetweeners with all his brilliant BS claims in that.😂

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5 hours ago, Sam-AVFC said:

If any fans are allowed back in VP before the end of the season I'd be willing to bet money we hear some boos at some point. This is one of the most reasoned places to discuss Villa and there are still numerous people who only ever to post to criticise.

Yes this team has definitely benefited from not having fans in the ground

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3 hours ago, ender4 said:

The other thing is that we are actually joint 10th at the moment... so if we keep performing like we have been, 10th is probably a fair result.

Or joint 7th at the moment, with at least a game in hand of all but one of the teams, that are above or below us (other than two teams who are in the bottom six). Given that, I would take a top half finish as well, but 6th - 8th is not an unrealistic target now. None of the current top eight and probably Arsenal along with Wolves, would currently see a top six finish as being above them either. Whilst that should be a hope rather than an expectation for us, I am still thinking that we could sneak into that. A Champions League spot or winning the thing again? Few other than the odd over optimistic Villa fan wearing claret & blue glasses, would even entertain that idea, but I rather like my glasses and the wild ideas they give me.....:D

image.jpeg.a955090e48e2bdfe86c1aee69449fc0b.jpeg

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I think the majority of fans would be delighted with a comfortably mid table finish and continuing to show we can compete with any team. It would be fantastic progress from last season and something to continue to build on. 

Unfortunately there will always be certain fans that get a bit carried away and that leads to anger and disappointment when we fall short of their new expectations.  

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10 hours ago, romavillan said:

Great post, I'd go a bit further too and say that a lot of people who all of a sudden acting like we should bet everyone every week seem to be the same that were calling for Smith to go last season about this time of year and when we had the losing run in the Championship after the Forest 5-5. Whereas a lot of the people who were saying to keep the faith in Dean are those who've been consistently saying not to get too carried away with our early season form. It's pretty obvious that expecting our thin squad (we have little beyond a competitive well coached first eleven) to win every week will turn into being massively pissed off when we have the inevitable bad run and the usual overreactions about the head coach begin again.

It's not just Villa fans, it's all football fans these days, I really don't know how you can say that Smith hasn't earned our faith yet. He's done everything that has been asked of him, probably a year or two before the owners thought realistic and he's shown he can turn a bad run around twice. I think he will only get better and I think if we can build a team around Jack that grows together under his coaching this club has no limit. That is long term though and to keep it all together long term it would be good if the fanbase doesn't collectively shit the bed if we finish 12th this year.

I don't think it is that simplistic as to put it in to camps, opinions are too varied......folk have their opinions and they are not all exactly the same, despite some folk who disagree, think they are.....I guess that too is at all clubs....Folk alter opinions too as form fluctuates and aspirations change,thats quite Normal.

i.e Chelsea took a bashing from Keane and Souness tonight on Sky.....some of their fans will agree, some won't, some will roll out mitigating circumstances, despite well versed industry experts giving their views.

I think on the whole we are doing really well and when we do lose games, in the main we are always in the game.....but its still clear there is improvement to be made in due course.

Ps I guess as form changes opinions change, but that usually relates to the specific game being played.....as opposed to progress in general. I think where the main frustration creeps in is where one fan discusses the features in game and someone else counters about how good a season we are having, almost telling the fan they shouldn't be complaining......the incident is one thing the season as a whole is another. I think its quite fair to discuss  incidents or play that relate to missing goals or conceding them, to create witch hunts from them is a different thing.

Edited by TRO
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5 hours ago, John said:

Or joint 7th at the moment, with at least a game in hand of all but one of the teams, that are above or below us (other than two teams who are in the bottom six). Given that, I would take a top half finish as well, but 6th - 8th is not an unrealistic target now. None of the current top eight and probably Arsenal along with Wolves, would currently see a top six finish as being above them either. Whilst that should be a hope rather than an expectation for us, I am still thinking that we could sneak into that. A Champions League spot or winning the thing again? Few other than the odd over optimistic Villa fan wearing claret & blue glasses, would even entertain that idea, but I rather like my glasses and the wild ideas they give me.....:D

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I prefer to just try and win every game, which we do ( but not expecting that to happen) and just see where it takes us......form is what it is john that predictions are like bubbles in the air.....every game is tough in this league and top and bottom teams offer different challenges and hurdles....there is just no easy games...just games.

Edited by TRO
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1 hour ago, Kingman said:

Spot on, Remember a few moans and groans back in the MON days being pissed off for finishing 6th for 3 seasons 😂

That was actually a little different though. Comparative to other teams at the time we were hurling money at the squad which ultimately underperformed through his poor management and ridiculous signings for huge huge sums. 

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7 hours ago, Zhan_Zhuang said:

I can see it either way and it is difficult to know.

Yes we have had a really good start so it would be a shame if we don't capitalise on our placing and finish top half.

However before the season I was happy just to be comfortably free from a relegation scrap.

Last thing we should do is turn on Dean Smith, the progress we have made over the course of a short period in time is amazing.

I haven't seen or heard of anyone doing that....as far as I can see, he is being lauded this season.

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I'm perennially over optimistic since we got Smith as manager. I was posting on Aussie/Kiwi PL Fantasy football group last season we were top 10 material and got loads of shit. Now with signings I feel we're legit top 6 material. Often having running battles on FB with people calling some of our players shit. I think a lot of Villa fans are doom and gloom around the corner because of years of shit but I'm definitely glass half full now regardless of the odd bump in the road

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7 hours ago, Kingman said:

Spot on, Remember a few moans and groans back in the MON days being pissed off for finishing 6th for 3 seasons 😂

They weren't complaining about finishing 6th, they were complaining about the unsustainability of the team. MON was the cause of our later downfall through his reckless spending (on many players who were quite frankly bang average) and actually deserved the criticism. Signing Heskey when we were in a great position to get 4th, putting players like Beye, NRC and Sidwell on big wages when they offered very little to the first team, failing to replace Laursen or Barry sufficiently, failing to have an adequate scouting team in place to find the best players in Europe/South America, I could go on.

 

DS deserves praise this season but we don't want to be another team like MON's hitting a glass ceiling. Progression is key and we have to be improving all the time. Our owners are a lot more wealthy than Lerner was, but getting our signings right is key. This summer was a lot more successful than last and now we've improved this season I'd like to see them go up another level this summer (though would like us to be in the market in January too). That was what failed under MON as far too many of his signings failed in the sense they had absolutely no impact on making our team better and just sat on the bench on their £40k a week wages. 

Edited by VillaFaninLondon
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8 hours ago, Kingman said:

Spot on, Remember a few moans and groans back in the MON days being pissed off for finishing 6th for 3 seasons 😂

MON was a cheque book manager that achieved **** all before he left us in the lurch and then **** several other teams after us. 

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we're better than i thought we would be, playing far more enjoyable football too

but id still be happy to be the most boring team in the league this season, the team thats first to be unable to get europe or relegation

my main concern with the expectation is on a game by game basis, brighton at home is a prime example, the demand that we should beat them is slightly unfair, theres a perhaps unrealistic judgement as to whats an easy game which is followed by harsh criticism regardless of the context of the performance (i still think the leeds game was our only real stinker) burnley away at the end of the month will be the next one "got to win that one" but we haven't...just relax and enjoy it from here on out

its a topsy turvy season, yes we lost to brighton at home and if we want to progress then eventually we do have to win those kind of games but if its being balanced out by dicking liverpool then take the rough with the smooth, we are where we are and deserve to be we've just got there in an unexpected fashion

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MON deserved credit for getting us so far, but criticism for not getting us further. 

Considering the money we had, relatively speaking, we should have pushed on from our 6th places finish(es) and made that final step to the big leagues and in the end it was his transfer policy that was the biggest roadblock to that, imo.

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10 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

MON deserved credit for getting us so far, but criticism for not getting us further. 

Considering the money we had, relatively speaking, we should have pushed on from our 6th places finish(es) and made that final step to the big leagues and in the end it was his transfer policy that was the biggest roadblock to that, imo.

Honestly the success was Robertson's fingerprint by all accounts and this was proven to be correct when he parted ways with MON after Villa and MON managed teams after were absolute garbage. 

Also I think Lerner gets way too much stick because he got burnt by MON squandering so much money on junk signings on stupid wages especially at the end

Edited by Kiwivillan
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12 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

MON deserved credit for getting us so far, but criticism for not getting us further. 

Considering the money we had, relatively speaking, we should have pushed on from our 6th places finish(es) and made that final step to the big leagues and in the end it was his transfer policy that was the biggest roadblock to that, imo.

Yes. I remember the transfer window in which we bought Ivanhoe and Arsenal bought Arshavin who was quite good then. Unsurpisingly they finished above us.

MON assembled a team of promising youngsters and seasoned old pros but we always lacked that magic dust to unlock a team and nick a game. Like a Grealish. We were far better away from home than at Villa Park. I just remember a lot of draws versus teams we should have beaten. 

MON did not evolve his style of a meat and potatoes 4-4-2 with proper wingers and a big lad up front. It only really worked well on the counter attack.  O'Neill did not really do tactics he left that to Robertson who did not follow him after Villa. That is why he has done nothing of note since he flouched out of Villa Park whereas earlier in his career he was considered the successor to Fergie at United.

Edited by The Fun Factory
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