Ratings & Reactions: Villa v Brighton

[weedman]

11 hours ago, TRO said:

I don't disagree......but the team were too passive, they lacked aggression, particularly in midfield.

The first Brighton goal, was unbelieveable in terms of organisation, quite remarkable......and its not the first time..what do we learn?

our lack of consistency is an issue....home form is a real problem.

Surely the first goal is a problem with being overly aggressive? You can't complain they didn't show enough aggression and we're too passive then complain when they went in too aggressively and got left exposed. You can get caught out when pressing.

If you want the team to play aggressively and on the front foot then they're going to get caught out like the first goal from time to time. I think that first goal was terrible defensively, but you have to accept that playing this style is going to leave us open to that from time to time, it even happens to Man City and Liverpool (against us) and they have some of the best defensive players in world football. Our defenders aren't as good as that and will occasionally get caught out 

I was never a Bruce basher, but I'd take the occasional goal like that given away to play this pressing style than the timid all out defensive hope to nick a goal on the counter of our previous style, which leads to its own defensive errors itself. Got to take the good with the bad, and since playing this way we've had far more good than bad 

[TRO]

5 hours ago, weedman said:

Surely the first goal is a problem with being overly aggressive? You can't complain they didn't show enough aggression and we're too passive then complain when they went in too aggressively and got left exposed. You can get caught out when pressing.

If you want the team to play aggressively and on the front foot then they're going to get caught out like the first goal from time to time. I think that first goal was terrible defensively, but you have to accept that playing this style is going to leave us open to that from time to time, it even happens to Man City and Liverpool (against us) and they have some of the best defensive players in world football. Our defenders aren't as good as that and will occasionally get caught out 

I was never a Bruce basher, but I'd take the occasional goal like that given away to play this pressing style than the timid all out defensive hope to nick a goal on the counter of our previous style, which leads to its own defensive errors itself. Got to take the good with the bad, and since playing this way we've had far more good than bad 

I totally disagree......we had 4 players commited to the area where the ball was played to Wellbeck.....Luiz lost his duel, by being too slow and too passive and the result was a pass to Wellbeck who was clean through.

deploying players to a zone is not aggression,( and when its both centre backs on the wing, its madness) its what you do when you get there, is whether its aggressive or not.

If You are saying its a trade off for playing our style of football, with the players we have defending, you might be right.....but if we have aspirations of more consistency, we need to address these issues.

Despite some possible contrary opinions about my preferred style of football , I too do not want to play Bruce style football, what I want is for us to defend more professionally than we do at times like this.......Its natural that we will concede goals from time to time, the best teams in the world do.....but its the manner of some of the ones we concede thats questionable....and some of the errors are repeated time and again.

Edited November 23, 2020 by TRO

[PaulC]

13 hours ago, TRO said:

Another player like jack harrison given the freedom of Villa park.....he is good player, but we have to get tighter on these wide players.

In Jack and Traore you have two players who don't really do a lot of that. You can afford one but not two. Otherwise we need another holding midfield in there. I agree the balance was wrong. 

[KAZZAM]

For me Dean lost us the game when he bought Traore on. We should of replaced Barkley with Nakamba and play a flat 3 man midfield. We should of just been tough to beat and less attacking and also try to soak up their attacks. We were clearly depleted in energy in the midfield from the internationals and the load needed to be shared around alot more.

I worry Dean just doesn't learn and fails to adapt and why he'll never be a top manager I hope this isn't true but time will obviously tell. 

Edited November 23, 2020 by KAZZAM

[PaulC]

On the other hand I think that with the amount of games played, a small gap between the end and start of seasons and these three match international breaks you are going to get inconsistencies. We don't have a big squad in terms of quality.  7th position with 5 wins and 3 defeats I am more than happy with. 

[villalad21]

42 minutes ago, KAZZAM said:

For me Dean lost us the game when he bought Traore on. We should of replaced Barkley with Nakamba and play a flat 3 man midfield. We should of just been tough to beat and less attacking and also try to soak up their attacks. We were clearly depleted in energy in the midfield from the internationals and the load needed to be shared around alot more.

I worry Dean just doesn't learn and fails to adapt and why he'll never be a top manager I hope this isn't true but time will obviously tell. 

I do get the feeling we have gone back to that "You score 4 we'll score 5" sort of approach.

At least against the lesser sides.

[villalad21]

I wouldn't say Brigton is a counter attacking side.

Potter identified our weakness and exploited it. It's a thing good coaches do.

[TRO]

2 hours ago, KAZZAM said:

For me Dean lost us the game when he bought Traore on. We should of replaced Barkley with Nakamba and play a flat 3 man midfield. We should of just been tough to beat and less attacking and also try to soak up their attacks. We were clearly depleted in energy in the midfield from the internationals and the load needed to be shared around alot more.

I worry Dean just doesn't learn and fails to adapt and why he'll never be a top manager I hope this isn't true but time will obviously tell. 

I think he needs to invest in a top quality DM, at least one.....and a centre back that keeps his position and is dominant.

Edited November 23, 2020 by TRO

[TRO]

28 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

I wouldn't say Brigton is a counter attacking side.

Potter identified our weakness and exploited it. It's a thing good coaches do.

but that weakness you talk about, seems a close kept secret on here......I see rare ventures in to our defensive frailties.

attacking seems to be the answer to everything and while it is great on the eye, when its working, the defensive side seems taboo.

[villalad21]

2 hours ago, TRO said:

the defensive side seems taboo.

It's a price you have to pay with Dean's system.

He has abandoned the post lock down tactics. It's there for everyone to see.

We are incredibly similar to Leeds. This season will be very hit and miss. I just hope we can avoid big defeats as it can suck the confidence out of the players.

[AVTuco]

19 hours ago, TRO said:

I don't disagree......but the team were too passive, they lacked aggression, particularly in midfield.

The first Brighton goal, was unbelieveable in terms of organisation, quite remarkable......and its not the first time..what do we learn?

our lack of consistency is an issue....home form is a real problem.

They did, but it's mostly because Jack wasn't being aggressive... no-one else provides it in any meaningful way, so when Jack's got an off day we're passive. And we'll lose.

We definitely are inconsistent, who knows which Villa turns up against West Ham, I have no idea.

[Zatman]

17 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

It's a price you have to pay with Dean's system.

He has abandoned the post lock down tactics. It's there for everyone to see.

We are incredibly similar to Leeds. This season will be very hit and miss. I just hope we can avoid big defeats as it can suck the confidence out of the players.

most clean sheets in the Premier League, none conceded away from home

Exactly like Leeds

[villalad21]

13 minutes ago, Zatman said:

most clean sheets in the Premier League, none conceded away from home

Exactly like Leeds

We're not as open against the bigger sides.

Against Soton, Leeds and Brighton we've conceded 9 goals 

9 goals conceded in 3 games is just horrific 

Edited November 23, 2020 by villalad21

[barry'sboots]

I said in the pre-match thread that if SJM has an off day, the whole team to do so.  He sets the tempo and drives the midfield on for us.  Luiz is a great player - calm, composed and elegant - BUT he is not, as yet, the type of figure that can drive a team.

I felt SJM was relatively poor again - maybe understandable given the energy that he dispelled during the 3 international games and the emotional high/partying that will have followed the first game.  The issue is that we do not have anybody else that can do what SJM does for the team.  I see Nakamba as a straight swap for Dougie as the main sitter and neither of them are a driving 8's.  Hourihane is certainly not a dynamic 8.  The only one that maybe can, at this stage, is Ramsey - maybe he needs to get his chance?  I do feel that, sometimes, we are too slow to blood/trust our best youngsters whereas others around us, e.g. Everton and Leeds in the game against us, are much quicker to give them a chance.

The way we play needs energy in CM and we need to find a way to get it in there when SJM cannot. 

[Zatman]

3 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

We're not as open against the bigger sides.

Against Soton, Leeds and Brighton we've conceded 9 goals 

9 goals conceded in 3 games is just horrific 

Liverpool conceded 11 goals to Villa, Leeds and Sheffield United

Klopp Out

[villalad21]

5 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Liverpool conceded 11 goals to Villa, Leeds and Sheffield United

Klopp Out

Yeah and it looks like they have addressed it now.

[Zatman]

3 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Yeah and it looks like they have addressed it now.

yesterday was the 1st clean sheet since before the Villa game

[villalad21]

9 minutes ago, Zatman said:

yesterday was the 1st clean sheet since before the Villa game

3 goals conceded in the last 4 games.

I'd say that's a decent improvement. With a lot of key injuries even.

Edited November 23, 2020 by villalad21

[Zatman]

2 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

3 goals conceded in the last 4 games.

I'd say that's a decent improvement. With a lot of key injuries even.

conceded to the worst attack in the league, a David Moyes team as well.

Top stuff

[PaulC]

4 hours ago, Zatman said:

conceded to the worst attack in the league, a David Moyes team as well.

Top stuff

Didn't concede to the team that put 5 past man city though