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The FFP thread


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19 minutes ago, Czarnikjak said:

The average interest on their stadium bonds is about 2.5%, which equates to about £25m interest each year.

Most of those bonds have long maturity well into 2030s. I don't actually expect them to repay this debt in full at that time, when the existing bonds near expiration they will simply refinance and keep paying interest. This is standard practice.

Overall it was an excellent investment for them. They didn't spend a single penny of owners money to increase their revenues by about £100m per year at a cost of £25m yearly interest.

 

Ah ok thank you for explaining it. So the debt is manageable and worth it - unlike Barca’s and UTD’s which is just greed based debt… 

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Ive been to the new Spurs Stadium for the NFL games and it is a total different beast compared to the other Footy Stadiums in the country.

It has been built with the food etc selling opportunities in mind.  They are not Carts or some shack wedged in (Like Villa).

You walk in and the lower area is open with Bars etc.  A Big wide space allowing fans to meet and drink before the game and after the game.  Those bars reopen after the game to allow the fans to spend more money celebrating or to cry in their beer.

As you go up into the higher areas of the ground their are other specific kiosks built in selling different rages of food.  Burgers etc in one and say pretzels in another.  Also they at end of the Curve their are vip style area bars with more comfortable seats and big windows so yu can still see the pitch from the corners.

It is very impressive.  The Spurs Stadium was built with investment from the NFL for the London games (It has two pitches that can be rotated, one NFL one proper football, two sets of changing rooms for same reason).   They took the knowledge from America of building a Stadium that not only allows the fans to see the game but also part with their cash.

 

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31 minutes ago, NIVillan said:

Ive been to the new Spurs Stadium for the NFL games and it is a total different beast compared to the other Footy Stadiums in the country.

It has been built with the food etc selling opportunities in mind.  They are not Carts or some shack wedged in (Like Villa).

You walk in and the lower area is open with Bars etc.  A Big wide space allowing fans to meet and drink before the game and after the game.  Those bars reopen after the game to allow the fans to spend more money celebrating or to cry in their beer.

As you go up into the higher areas of the ground their are other specific kiosks built in selling different rages of food.  Burgers etc in one and say pretzels in another.  Also they at end of the Curve their are vip style area bars with more comfortable seats and big windows so yu can still see the pitch from the corners.

It is very impressive.  The Spurs Stadium was built with investment from the NFL for the London games (It has two pitches that can be rotated, one NFL one proper football, two sets of changing rooms for same reason).   They took the knowledge from America of building a Stadium that not only allows the fans to see the game but also part with their cash.

 

I have too and it is annoyingly excellent. It just shows what villa park as the historical stadium cannot provide and the revenue we do lose through that.

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1 hour ago, Pissflaps said:

I have too and it is annoyingly excellent. It just shows what villa park as the historical stadium cannot provide and the revenue we do lose through that.

Cost of class.

I currently prefer our traditional home, but not sure I'll always feel that way off it becomes a means of holding us back (e.g if we're not easily able to retrofit things to meet Uefa standards etc)

To be fair, Archibald Leitch was having a bit of an off day when he designed white hart lane compared with Villa Park, and then spurs butchered it beyond recognition so probably a fair bit easier to say good bye to that stadium.

Edited by MrBlack
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Its frightening how easy Man City are able to generate profit from selling their fringe players that never even kicked the ball for them in anger.

Sales this summer alone (so far):

Angelino - £16.2m

Harrison - £11.5m

Nmecha - £7.2m

Sancho - £11.2m

Thats staggering £46.1m from FFP balance freed up for new signings (plus another £12m of Aguero wages off the books).

 

For some context, signing a "hypothetical" £100m player on 200k per week wage costs £30m per year from FFP standpoint (£100m fee + £50m wages = £150m divided by 5 years contract lenght equals £30m FFP cost per year)  

 

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3 minutes ago, Czarnikjak said:

For some context, signing a "hypothetical" £100m player on 200k per week wage costs £30m per year from FFP standpoint (£100m fee + £50m wages = £150m divided by 5 years contract lenght equals £30m FFP cost per year)  

£200k a week!

I'd imagine any "hypothetical" £100m footballer would be in a position to demand parity with KdB's £385k a week.

 

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On 15/06/2021 at 16:26, S-Platt said:

Villa would make more money from food if the ques were not so big!!  They should buy up all the burger vans around the ground!

I've been to the new spurs ground and the biggest difference really is that they are perfectly set up to socialise before and after games. Huge gangways and places to meet, bars with seating and a massive amount of food offerings. I went for a cup game with some friends from work, we were there for 6 hours.

Unfortunately the design of villa park makes it impossible to follow suit, they need to consider how they make money around the group if they want to compete.

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1 hour ago, cheltenham_villa said:

I've been to the new spurs ground and the biggest difference really is that they are perfectly set up to socialise before and after games. Huge gangways and places to meet, bars with seating and a massive amount of food offerings. I went for a cup game with some friends from work, we were there for 6 hours.

Unfortunately the design of villa park makes it impossible to follow suit, they need to consider how they make money around the group if they want to compete.

It’s a very good point. 

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The ground is too constricted on 3 sides to do much in terms of expansion… When Purslow mentioned a 2-10 year multi stage plan, I’m sure they’ll be reviewing how the internal spaces can be reconfigured. What they should have done/do is put the lower concourse’s toilets underground - freeing up valuable space for expanded kiosks and general circulation space… 

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2 hours ago, thabucks said:

The ground is too constricted on 3 sides to do much in terms of expansion… When Purslow mentioned a 2-10 year multi stage plan, I’m sure they’ll be reviewing how the internal spaces can be reconfigured. What they should have done/do is put the lower concourse’s toilets underground - freeing up valuable space for expanded kiosks and general circulation space… 

I could imagine they'd buy some of the houses around the ground to get extra space for expansion. 

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4 hours ago, MotoMkali said:

Actually there's load of room to the south and west. And obviously a lot to north where the main car park and the villa store is. 

Screenshot_20210718_033851_com.google.earth~2.jpg

I think expansion will come but I also think villa could do much without it. Given the road closures around the ground, they could set up outside food and drinks places and encourage people to socialise before and after games. Maybe then need to push more of the parking away from the ground and start to use those places for large marquee's?

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5 hours ago, MotoMkali said:

Actually there's load of room to the south and west. And obviously a lot to north where the main car park and the villa store is. 

Screenshot_20210718_033851_com.google.earth~2.jpg

The South and West?

The park has an absolute protected status - we had to turn cartwheels with the council to get to have the Trinity Road stand straddle the road and have supports in the park.

Any expansion will need to be behind the North Stand or through demolishing the houses on Witton Lane, we've no chance of pushing out on the other sides.

 

 

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Exactly there is no space for expansion with the exception of the north stand. And even then that is actually limited a bit when you look at past plans. The slope of that stand going straight back, with no movement possible sideways to reduce the gradient means we only gain a small amount capacity wise from a rebuild.  

Of course the facilities and corporate would improve, but it's just one stand out of 4. We can't do much to the other 3. Compulsory purchases to the houses on witton lane seems a long shot.

 

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3 hours ago, OutByEaster? said:

The South and West?

The park has an absolute protected status - we had to turn cartwheels with the council to get to have the Trinity Road stand straddle the road and have supports in the park.

Any expansion will need to be behind the North Stand or through demolishing the houses on Witton Lane, we've no chance of pushing out on the other sides.

 

 

I didn't realise the park was protected but we could probably expand into the southern car park although that would be an absolute pain with basically no parking near the ground. 

Also I imagine we will be trying to be able to utilise that space and hope the city council agrees with us. I mean an expansion would provide a lot of jobs in the local area as well just because of the need for construction workers and for it to be finished in a timely manner. On top of if we add like a food court, a few pubs and some proper restaurants. And of course a hotel. 

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I'm sure if we bought some of the peoperties on Bevington Road and turned them over to the park we could then buy some of the edge of the park around Villa Park? 

Not that I think we need to extend that side anyway. 

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17 hours ago, Czarnikjak said:

Its frightening how easy Man City are able to generate profit from selling their fringe players that never even kicked the ball for them in anger.

Sales this summer alone (so far):

Angelino - £16.2m

Harrison - £11.5m

Nmecha - £7.2m

Sancho - £11.2m

Thats staggering £46.1m from FFP balance freed up for new signings (plus another £12m of Aguero wages off the books).

 

For some context, signing a "hypothetical" £100m player on 200k per week wage costs £30m per year from FFP standpoint (£100m fee + £50m wages = £150m divided by 5 years contract lenght equals £30m FFP cost per year)  

 

 

Yep. It's like the bulls*** Chelsea model of just having 80 players on your books that you buy as academy teenagers, loaning 50 of them out every season and effectively getting other clubs to develop them for you to a tidy profit.

Firstly, the ability to circumvent FFP by doing this should be stopped. There should be rules about how many players you can have out on loan at any given time.

Secondly, if it's allowed, we should be doing it as well.

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20 minutes ago, ThunderPower_14 said:

Secondly, if it's allowed, we should be doing it as well.

I think we are trying to emulate it to a degree by hoovering every talented 16 year old In the country. But we are not there yet and it will take few years to build up the rooster and the reputation required to pull this off.

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3 hours ago, Czarnikjak said:

I think we are trying to emulate it to a degree by hoovering every talented 16 year old In the country. But we are not there yet and it will take few years to build up the rooster and the reputation required to pull this off.

What's Belotti got to do with it?

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