Ollie Watkins

[Follyfoot]

16 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

Jedi was a world class penalty taker. I think he only missed 1 in his career. Will always remember that last one he ever took where he stared down the Albion fans in the playoff semifinal. 

I do not think he has ever missed one, might be wrong

[Follyfoot]

3 minutes ago, Follyfoot said:

I do not think he has ever missed one, might be wrong

Just checked, 14 our of 14 in his career, quite unbelievable

[tezzaleed]

On 01/12/2020 at 16:39, Delphinho123 said:

He was poor last night and this isn't the first time.

I'm a fan, but these performances will see him benched if he doesn't improve. 

I agree with that but I accept until wes is back we have no other option and will wes ever recover.   As for watkkns being miles ahead of wes I disagree.  watkins has shown flashes of what he can be but never convinces in front of goal and has missed as many as wes for me.   wes however flattered to deceive a lot of his villa career as well but the way he played in that last game before Ben mee did him was awesome.  on a level with carew and still so young.  his potential is or was awesome.  we may never see that now but I'm still hoping he'll come back push on and become a villa legend.

[Okonokos]

1 hour ago, Keyblade said:

Jedi was a world class penalty taker. I think he only missed 1 in his career. Will always remember that last one he ever took where he stared down the Albion fans in the playoff semifinal. 

I have so much respect for him for that penalty. He came on with 20 seconds left and he still had the nerve to score that penalty with literally his first touch. Gave the fans a determined nod after scoring too. Turned out to be his last touch as a player. Will always love him for it.

[Rightdm00]

26 minutes ago, tezzaleed said:

I agree with that but I accept until wes is back we have no other option and will wes ever recover.   As for watkkns being miles ahead of wes I disagree.  watkins has shown flashes of what he can be but never convinces in front of goal and has missed as many as wes for me.   wes however flattered to deceive a lot of his villa career as well but the way he played in that last game before Ben mee did him was awesome.  on a level with carew and still so young.  his potential is or was awesome.  we may never see that now but I'm still hoping he'll come back push on and become a villa legend.

Watkins is already at 6 goals in 9 Prem games. Wes scored 5 in 21.   Not trying to slander Wes, he can still do a job for us but the difference in class is obvious.  Watkins is by far the better striker.  

Not going to happen but if you project out Watkins is on pace for 24 goals.  I honestly only give him 2-3 seasons before he gets snapped up for an obscene offer.  He is by far the best striker the club has had since Benteke and give him season or two and he will leave him in the dust as well. 

[VillaChris]

7 hours ago, Follyfoot said:

Just checked, 14 our of 14 in his career, quite unbelievable

Came remember him scoring a hat trick for Australia although one of them may have been a free kick. Also scored two penalties for Aussies in 2018 world cup v Denmark and France.

[VillaChris]

Ollie has done fine so far.

Not really sure who he gets dropped for btw from the current options so bit of a moot point until we sign another one in January and they might not be as good.

[Dave-R]

5 hours ago, tezzaleed said:

I agree with that but I accept until wes is back we have no other option and will wes ever recover.   As for watkkns being miles ahead of wes I disagree.  watkins has shown flashes of what he can be but never convinces in front of goal and has missed as many as wes for me.   wes however flattered to deceive a lot of his villa career as well but the way he played in that last game before Ben mee did him was awesome.  on a level with carew and still so young.  his potential is or was awesome.  we may never see that now but I'm still hoping he'll come back push on and become a villa legend.

Both very different players and both can be ace for us, we should utilise both as much as we can.

I disagree with how you see Watkins, he runs himself all over the park, he has the ability and as a striker you cant always be on fire, you have your ups and downs. Watkins will take some time properly getting used to the league and its players, he does have the eye for the goal he proved that at Brentford. If Watkins can get used to the players in this league and we service him much better than what we are doing, he will do absolutely fine he will. Remember service to the lad is not anywhere the level we could be giving him yet, we should be sending more balls through the centre to him yet we are sending cross after cross which most hit the first defender, it's not something that's Watkins fault. In fact since Barkley came in there has been a surge in servicing Watkins but now hes out it's been alot less again.

As for Wes I fear for him because the same will happen to that lad, where we see a goal here and there and the blame will be laid at him as much as what some of you are doing with Watkins.

When we cross we should be hitting them hard and low behind the defending line, Watkins needs the ball at his feet instead everyone is hit over the lads head, Trez isnt even at back post again for the ones that end up at back post.

Dont get me wrong Watkins has missed some, but so have many other players as well that could of resulted in goals, our whole conversion percentage on goals to chances, I wonder what it is because it has to be low ish for all the chances we get a game.

We need to be more sharp in front of goal yes but at same time we need to be better at defending and crossing, three things I'd like to see improved with Villa, surgical, Defending and Crossing at the wings to be more on point and more sent through the middle to Watkins feet.

Tammy or alot of other strikers with the quality of crosses from the wings, would struggle I reckon to score a crap ton of goals because of the way we play at sending near every ball to the flank. 

[paul514]

6 hours ago, Rightdm00 said:

Watkins is already at 6 goals in 9 Prem games. Wes scored 5 in 21.   Not trying to slander Wes, he can still do a job for us but the difference in class is obvious.  Watkins is by far the better striker.  

Not going to happen but if you project out Watkins is on pace for 24 goals.  I honestly only give him 2-3 seasons before he gets snapped up for an obscene offer.  He is by far the best striker the club has had since Benteke and give him season or two and he will leave him in the dust as well. 

I don’t know about that, he is playing in a better team also.

Watkins is on the wings too much for me leaving few options to centre the ball 

[MotoMkali]

6 hours ago, Rightdm00 said:

Watkins is already at 6 goals in 9 Prem games. Wes scored 5 in 21.   Not trying to slander Wes, he can still do a job for us but the difference in class is obvious.  Watkins is by far the better striker.  

Not going to happen but if you project out Watkins is on pace for 24 goals.  I honestly only give him 2-3 seasons before he gets snapped up for an obscene offer.  He is by far the best striker the club has had since Benteke and give him season or two and he will leave him in the dust as well. 

As many like to point out about wes, watkins has scored in only 3 games one of which is a pen (although obviously wrongfully disallowed last Monday). So his record is a tad deceiving. 

[QldVilla]

Not sure how some have come to their conclusions with Watkins on penalties. He struck the ball well, beat the keeper, just went a fraction too high. But it was his technique that let him down, he’s not bottling it. When he hit that ball he was leaning too far back, if he was forward 3-4 degrees and the ball goes in the top right hand corner.

Players aren’t perfect it’s constant self analysis and the coaches coaching. Watkins just needs to spend some time on the training ground and correcting his technique. 

[Stevo985]

2 hours ago, QldVilla said:

Not sure how some have come to their conclusions with Watkins on penalties.

He's scored 2 from 6

2 hours ago, QldVilla said:

He struck the ball well, beat the keeper, just went a fraction too high. But it was his technique that let him down, he’s not bottling it. When he hit that ball he was leaning too far back, if he was forward 3-4 degrees and the ball goes in the top right hand corner.

But he wasn't. He missed. Again.

[QldVilla]

41 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

He's scored 2 from 6

But he wasn't. He missed. Again.

Geez thanks scoop. Doesn’t take away from the point that a little hard work and technical correction will correct those stats.

[Stevo985]

31 minutes ago, QldVilla said:

Geez thanks scoop. Doesn’t take away from the point that a little hard work and technical correction will correct those stats.

It's all well and good saying "if he's done this he would have scored". He didn't. And it wasn't a one off. He's missed 66% of his penalties. That's an appalling record, albeit a relatively small sample size.

Maybe he can correct it. But this isn't some 18 year old starlet. He's 24. Maybe he just isn't that good at penalties?

Either way I doubt he'll be on them for Villa anymore

Edited December 4, 2020 by Stevo985

[Dave-R]

33 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

It's all well and good saying "if he's done this he would have scored". He didn't. And it wasn't a one off. He's missed 66% of his penalties. That's an appalling record, albeit a relatively small sample size.

Maybe he can correct it. But this isn't some 18 year old starlet. He's 24. Maybe he just isn't that good at penalties?

Either way I doubt he'll be on them for Villa anymore

I wouldn't say anymore, he will prob be on them if were ahead by a couple but for time being while we need the points I cant see Watkins taking any, but who knows.

[tom_avfc]

Just now, Dave-R said:

I wouldn't say anymore, he will prob be on them if were ahead by a couple but for time being while we need the points I cant see Watkins taking any, but who knows.

I don't think there's many players in our squad who I'd back to score from the spot ahead of him to be honest. I haven't seen any of his previous penalties for Brentford but he's had two penalties for us, one of which I'd argue was unstoppable as he hit it hard into the side netting. The second penalty is half a crossbar's width away from being another unsaveable penalty. 

I'm just not sure there's anyone I'd give them to ahead of him. Jack is the obvious one but has missed one last season. At the end of the day if Watkins is the best penalty taker on the training pitch I'm not sure that missing by that margin is enough to see him not take penalties in the future.

[YouUnastanFren]

I want whoever has the best record from the hundreds they hopefully take in training to be our first choice. If that's Watkins then he gets my vote.

2 from 6 is a terrible record but if he's scoring 9/10 in training then he should still get the next one IMHO.

[Dave-R]

2 minutes ago, tom_avfc said:

I don't think there's many players in our squad who I'd back to score from the spot ahead of him to be honest. I haven't seen any of his previous penalties for Brentford but he's had two penalties for us, one of which I'd argue was unstoppable as he hit it hard into the side netting. The second penalty is half a crossbar's width away from being another unsaveable penalty. 

I'm just not sure there's anyone I'd give them to ahead of him. Jack is the obvious one but has missed one last season. At the end of the day if Watkins is the best penalty taker on the training pitch I'm not sure that missing by that margin is enough to see him not take penalties in the future.

Well yeah I agree with you, I felt the one that rattled the bar would of knocked the keeper over the line with the ball or at most knocked him out.

If Watkins can learn to stop smashing them so much and do some places with less power hed be okay. I myself am happy for him to continue on taking penaltys. I think Watkins will know what he did wrong and Smith will also say look Ollie, slow it down and bring the power down a notch or two and you'll be fine and he will.

I think some people are lacking confidence in him and to be honest I'm shocked because hes a fine footballer capable of so much more and I think he will keep improving in all directions.z

We didnt buy him because he didnt have an eye for a goal and Smith knows him.

[KenjiOgiwara]

26 minutes ago, tom_avfc said:

I don't think there's many players in our squad who I'd back to score from the spot ahead of him to be honest. I haven't seen any of his previous penalties for Brentford but he's had two penalties for us, one of which I'd argue was unstoppable as he hit it hard into the side netting. The second penalty is half a crossbar's width away from being another unsaveable penalty. 

I'm just not sure there's anyone I'd give them to ahead of him. Jack is the obvious one but has missed one last season. At the end of the day if Watkins is the best penalty taker on the training pitch I'm not sure that missing by that margin is enough to see him not take penalties in the future.

It's a fair point. I actually prefer penalties which are hit with power. My problem is largely that penalties is not only a technical endevour. When you miss penalties often, like Ollie does, it becomes a mental thing. If you walk up to the spot kick and there's doubt in your mind, that's when you really are ****. If people think he looks confident taking them, fair enough. I'm not sure he does. 

What I'm sure about is that I don't want Grealish taking them which was suggested on one of the Villa podcasts. Grealish is an outstanding player, but he has never been a player that strikes the ball well and cleanly. I'd much prefer Barkley. 

[tom_avfc]

4 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

It's a fair point. I actually prefer penalties which are hit with power. My problem is largely that penalties is not only a technical endevour. When you miss penalties often, like Ollie does, it becomes a mental thing. If you walk up to the spot kick and there's doubt in your mind, that's when you really are ****. If people think he looks confident taking them, fair enough. I'm not sure he does. 

What I'm sure about is that I don't want Grealish taking them which was suggested on one of the Villa podcasts. Grealish is an outstanding player, but he has never been a player that strikes the ball well and cleanly. I'd much prefer Barkley. 

I think the mentality aspect is a valid point. I would argue that a player who isn't confident doesn't aim penalties hard and at top corners in the way that Watkins has taken his two for us so far. He stepped up and struck a hard penalty towards the top corner of the goal and got it wrong by the smallest margin possible. 

Obviously what effect this has on his penalty taking going forwards is something which nobody knows. If he's still striking them well and scoring in training I'd say missing one out of two penalties for us by hitting the crossbar isn't enough to convince me that he has mentality issues with penalties.

With regards to missing penalties often I'd also point out that his missed penalties which are being included here go back to November 4th 2017. I'd argue that Ollie Watkins today is not the same player as Ollie Watkins over three years ago. In fact his previous penalty miss before West Ham was over a year earlier. He's scored a hell of a lot of goals since then and is doubtless more experienced and technically a better player now than he was.