bickster Posted January 8, 2023 Moderator Share Posted January 8, 2023 54 minutes ago, Chindie said: This is becoming a worrying global plague. I look forward to the sensible answers to how this is the lefts fault. Well they keep posting it in multiple topics if that helps 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted January 13, 2023 Share Posted January 13, 2023 The new government in Israel is the stuff of nightmares. Must be among the worst in the world as far as right wing ultra nationalist, religious zealots go. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAuthority Posted January 13, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 13, 2023 Just now, sne said: Must be among the worst in the world as far as right wing ultra nationalist, religious zealots go. Hasn't this always been the case? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sne Posted January 13, 2023 Share Posted January 13, 2023 Just now, TheAuthority said: Hasn't this always been the case? Yeah kinda. But this new one is apparently a whole new level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeVillan Posted January 13, 2023 Share Posted January 13, 2023 2 hours ago, sne said: Yeah kinda. But this new one is apparently a whole new level. Apparently? You were dead certain a moment ago. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seat68 Posted January 13, 2023 Share Posted January 13, 2023 27 minutes ago, TreeVillan said: Apparently? You were dead certain a moment ago. "Must" in that sentence alludes to a question. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted January 13, 2023 Share Posted January 13, 2023 6 hours ago, sne said: The new government in Israel is the stuff of nightmares. Must be among the worst in the world as far as right wing ultra nationalist, religious zealots go. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAuthority Posted January 24, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 24, 2023 Good podcast from John Stewart and Anne Applebaum. Nuanced and well worth an hour. Gloriously free from the usual extreme hysteria that passes for "debate" these days. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-problem-with-jon-stewart/id1583132133?i=1000595185227 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakemineVanilla Posted January 24, 2023 Share Posted January 24, 2023 On 13/01/2023 at 05:13, sne said: The new government in Israel is the stuff of nightmares. Must be among the worst in the world as far as right wing ultra nationalist, religious zealots go. I understand that the ultra-orthodox have a much higher birthrate than secular jews and tend to be more right-wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutByEaster? Posted January 27, 2023 Moderator Share Posted January 27, 2023 On 24/01/2023 at 09:42, MakemineVanilla said: I understand that the ultra-orthodox have a much higher birthrate than secular jews. F**kers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maqroll Posted January 28, 2023 Author Share Posted January 28, 2023 7 murdered in a synagogue after multiple Palestinians were murdered by Israeli police. Netanyahu and his psychotic cohorts will ramp their genocide up a notch now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delboy54 Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 I always find it odd the the Jews were persecuted by the nazis (facism I.e. politically extreme right wing), yet Israel which has a predominantly Jewish population is also seen as an extreme right wing country. Am I missing something...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolta Posted January 28, 2023 Share Posted January 28, 2023 (edited) 52 minutes ago, delboy54 said: I always find it odd the the Jews were persecuted by the nazis (facism I.e. politically extreme right wing), yet Israel which has a predominantly Jewish population is also seen as an extreme right wing country. Am I missing something...? Nope. Or maybe only that two different points in time exist! And that being Jewish doesn't mean you can't be politically extreme. And that being Jewish is one thing and Israel and it's politics is another. Edited January 28, 2023 by Rolta 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyjsg Posted January 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 28, 2023 50 minutes ago, delboy54 said: I always find it odd the the Jews were persecuted by the nazis (facism I.e. politically extreme right wing), yet Israel which has a predominantly Jewish population is also seen as an extreme right wing country. Am I missing something...? Right Wing really means hardline conservative views and it’s more about being anti anything that is different to your (normally religious views). There was an interesting point made on the Rest Is History podcast that Nazi’s are considered the height of evil (and understandably so) but the numbers killed in their belief is considerably less than those in the name of socialism (Stalin, Pol Pot). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted January 28, 2023 Moderator Share Posted January 28, 2023 1 hour ago, andyjsg said: an interesting point made on the Rest Is History podcast that Nazi’s are considered the height of evil (and understandably so) but the numbers killed in their belief is considerably less than those in the name of socialism (Stalin, Pol Pot). That’s not really right is it? Either in terms of the numbers, or in terms of compiling Russia and Cambodian deaths and contrasting those with Nazi Germany’s. Stalin had something like half a million people killed, PolPot maybe 2 or 3 times that, but even together it’s way less than the holocaust. It’s all incredibly grim, whatever. Add in Iran, Iraq, Syria, Burma, Malaysia, large parts of Africa…regimes killing huge numbers of people to cling to power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyjsg Posted January 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 28, 2023 59 minutes ago, blandy said: That’s not really right is it? Either in terms of the numbers, or in terms of compiling Russia and Cambodian deaths and contrasting those with Nazi Germany’s. Stalin had something like half a million people killed, PolPot maybe 2 or 3 times that, but even together it’s way less than the holocaust. It’s all incredibly grim, whatever. Add in Iran, Iraq, Syria, Burma, Malaysia, large parts of Africa…regimes killing huge numbers of people to cling to power. Not sure, but the historian Tom Holland definitely said it on their Rise of the Nazis podcast last week. My point was more about the motivations being pretty much the same - getting rid of those that don’t fit or don’t believe in their message and usually blaming them for the woes. A playbook currently being run by Tories/GOP/Front Nationale etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Follyfoot Posted January 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 28, 2023 1 hour ago, blandy said: That’s not really right is it? Either in terms of the numbers, or in terms of compiling Russia and Cambodian deaths and contrasting those with Nazi Germany’s. Stalin had something like half a million people killed, PolPot maybe 2 or 3 times that, but even together it’s way less than the holocaust. It’s all incredibly grim, whatever. Add in Iran, Iraq, Syria, Burma, Malaysia, large parts of Africa…regimes killing huge numbers of people to cling to power. Historians estimates range from 8-61 million perished whilst JS was batting That’s one hell of a number Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted January 28, 2023 Moderator Share Posted January 28, 2023 13 minutes ago, andyjsg said: My point was more about the motivations being pretty much the same Were they the same? The Stalinist purge and PolPot/Khmer Rouge stuff was kind of around paranoid internal dissent suppression and maintaining power, whereas the Nazi genocide was about (in their terms) racial superiority and removing deviants from the gene pool. Stalin and Pol Pot killed their own citizens in huge numbers kind of regardless of the factors the Nazis took into account. I’m no historian so could be wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted January 28, 2023 Moderator Share Posted January 28, 2023 1 minute ago, Follyfoot said: Historians estimates range from 8-61 million perished whilst JS was batting That’s one hell of a number Yes. Death from all causes, though rather than “just” murdering them. Same with Pol Pot, many died from starvation and so on 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyjsg Posted January 28, 2023 VT Supporter Share Posted January 28, 2023 27 minutes ago, blandy said: Yes. Death from all causes, though rather than “just” murdering them. Same with Pol Pot, many died from starvation and so on There was an awful lot of purging which is essentially the same thing, bad people trying to “purify”, wether that’s racism or not following the line, it’s still all really awful. Personally I don’t really see a difference, it should all be called out and stopped. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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