Summer Goners 2020

[Junxs]

Just now, Zatman said:

that is Jota.

Luiz and Davis counted as Under 21 players this season but 2 of the players on the list are already gone as think Drinkwater is finished

Daaamn easy to forget how young Luiz is (just turned 22 in May), hes going to be very good next season, guess along with Davis he no longer qualifies as an under 21 going into next seasons squad.

Ok, so 22 players, lose the 3 loanees takes to 19, then add Luiz, Davis, Wesley and Heaton brings us to 23. That gives us space for 2 signings before we have to start selling. 

[MotoMkali]

3 minutes ago, Junxs said:

Daaamn easy to forget how young Luiz is (just turned 22 in May), hes going to be very good next season, guess along with Davis he no longer qualifies as an under 21 going into next seasons squad.

Ok, so 22 players, lose the 3 loanees takes to 19, then add Luiz, Davis, Wesley and Heaton brings us to 23. That gives us space for 2 signings before we have to start selling. 

Luiz doesn't take a squad space next season eithernor does Davis. It is 21 at the start of the calendar year. Probably so someone who is born August 31st isn't looked over in favour of someone who is born on the first or September. 

[Junxs]

2 minutes ago, MotoMkali said:

Luiz doesn't take a squad space next season eithernor does Davis. It is 21 at the start of the calendar year. Probably so someone who is born August 31st isn't looked over in favour of someone who is born on the first or September. 

What a bizarre rule! so it's OK to overlook someone who was born on the 31st December over someone who was born January 1st? Have to draw the line somewhere I realise, but would have made more sense for the dates to coincide with the season rather than a calendar date that has nothing to do with the season starting 8-9 months later. 

[MrBlack]

42 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Drinkwater, Daniel Noel
Eissa, Ahmed Elmohamady Abdelfattah Aly
El Ghazi, Anwar
Engels, Bjorn Lionel G.
Gonzalez, Tomas, Borja
Grealish, Jack
Guilbert, Frederic
Hassan, Mahmoud Ahmed Ibrahim
Hause, Kortney Paul Duncan
Hourihane, Conor
Konsa, Ezri Ngoyo
Lansbury, Henri George
McGinn, John
Mings, Tyrone Deon
Nakamba, Marvelous
Nyland, Orjan Haskjold
Peleteiro Ramallo, Jose Ignacio
Reina Paez, Jose Manuel
Samatta, Mbwana Ally
Steer, Jed John
Targett, Matthew Robert
Taylor, Neil John

LOSE

Drinkwater

Borja

Lansbury

Jota

Reina

Taylor

 

ADD

Wesley

Heaton

(Douglas Luiz and Davis stay in but unregistered)

 

Leaves space for 7 signings, all of which need to be quality.

Plus replacing whoever we lose outside the above like for like (as best possible)

[Sulberto21]

45 minutes ago, MrBlack said:

LOSE

Drinkwater

Borja

Lansbury

Jota

Reina

Taylor

 

ADD

Wesley

Heaton

(Douglas Luiz and Davis stay in but unregistered)

 

Leaves space for 7 signings, all of which need to be quality.

Plus replacing whoever we lose outside the above like for like (as best possible)

Noah Okafor and Patson Daka two guys I've proposed are younger than 21 yet will drive up the quality of the squad. So that still leaves 7 spots.

[Pez1974]

If the match day squad stays at 20 next season, with 5 subs allowed - won't they increase the squad from 25? Given that most squads has 3x GKs (and you'd only need one of those on the bench), 
Or will they use it as an excuse to promote the U21s? Meaning the rich clubs start hoovering up all the youngsters. 

 

[fightoffyour]

12 hours ago, Junxs said:

What a bizarre rule! so it's OK to overlook someone who was born on the 31st December over someone who was born January 1st? Have to draw the line somewhere I realise, but would have made more sense for the dates to coincide with the season rather than a calendar date that has nothing to do with the season starting 8-9 months later. 

Season dates change though don't they, extreme case in point this year. I suppose it's much easier just to look at someones year of birth than trying to figure out if they were born before the start of the current season on these dates 21 years ago.

 

6 hours ago, Pez1974 said:

If the match day squad stays at 20 next season, with 5 subs allowed - won't they increase the squad from 25? Given that most squads has 3x GKs (and you'd only need one of those on the bench), 
Or will they use it as an excuse to promote the U21s? Meaning the rich clubs start hoovering up all the youngsters. 

 

They might have to/probably should increase the squad size to accommodate the bigger bench/more subs.

But...just start hoovering up the youngsters?! This has been going on for years and years! 

[Pez1974]

1 hour ago, fightoffyour said:

They might have to/probably should increase the squad size to accommodate the bigger bench/more subs.

But...just start hoovering up the youngsters?! This has been going on for years and years! 

Absolutely - but with so many more players on the bench, and more getting on the pitch - clubs can promise these youngsters a lot more game time now. The likes of Man City can literally rotate half their team for games, knowing the likes of Sterling, De Bruyne, Aguero can all come on in the 2nd half and change the game if it ain't going well. In their place, these youngsters get 20 starts a season and Man City keep all their key players fresh.  

[MrBlack]

Is it confirmed that the 5 subs rule will still be in place next year? The PL is allowed to take up the option,  but I didn't think they'd confirmed that they would.

Madness that the IFAB allowed it to roll on, given part of the reasoning behind allowing it this year must have been due to the urgent restart with no preseason, and an expectation that playing into summer season may result in higher temperatures. The rule needs binning, as do the water breaks.

On topic, I dont see them increasing the squad size to cater for it, but even if they did, 7 quality signings (as per my last breakdown post) to is probably still more than we can afford, so doubt it would help us.

[fightoffyour]

3 minutes ago, MrBlack said:

Is it confirmed that the 5 subs rule will still be in place next year? The PL is allowed to take up the option,  but I didn't think they'd confirmed that they would.

Madness that the IFAB allowed it to roll on, given part of the reasoning behind allowing it this year must have been due to the urgent restart with no preseason, and an expectation that playing into summer season may result in higher temperatures. The rule needs binning, as do the water breaks.

On topic, I dont see them increasing the squad size to cater for it, but even if they did, 7 quality signings (as per my last breakdown post) to is probably still more than we can afford, so doubt it would help us.

I think the increased bench, subs and water breaks will be here to stay even after this season now, unfortunately.

The only one I don't mind is the bigger bench, which brings the rule in line with international tournaments and some (most/all?) other European leagues. it allows more options depending on how the game is going and doesn't limit your sub options because the bench is filled with RBs just in case there's a flurry of defensive injuries mid-game.

[MrBlack]

10 minutes ago, fightoffyour said:

I think the increased bench, subs and water breaks will be here to stay even after this season now, unfortunately.

The only one I don't mind is the bigger bench, which brings the rule in line with international tournaments and some (most/all?) other European leagues. it allows more options depending on how the game is going and doesn't limit your sub options because the bench is filled with RBs just in case there's a flurry of defensive injuries mid-game.

Ah,  do I not miss those days. 

A bigger bench is definitely the lesser of the evils for me, but even then it takes out an element of skill from picking the subs a manager is likely to need in a game. On the other hand it stops a club getting directly penalised for bad luck...such as an injury to a player for which they have no direct replacement on the bench because they only have 9 there.  Still another slight favour for the existing top 6 though, but not as outrageous as the 5 subs rule. 

Drinks breaks really kill the flow of the game. Are they really necessary? Can't players take drinks off the sidelines at any point during the game if the ball has gone out and they're dying of thirst after running around for 20 minutes? Genuine question  i'm sure I've seen players do that in matches before taking a thow-in, and definitely following a physio assessment for a non injury?

[Stevo985]

I guess there's two questions here. Who do we think SHOULD go (as in be actively looking to get rid of) and who do we think WILL go.

For those who should go I would say

Jota
Lansbury
Baston
Kalinic
Nyland
Engels (just because I think something has happened behind the scenes)
Drinkwater
 

I think we could lose all of those and it will really make no difference. They barely play now (or don't at all) so would be no harm getting rid of them

 

Others who I think WILL go

Grealish (Would love him to stay but I think it's time)
Reina (Would be great to keep as backup for a season given his experience but I don't think we'll keep him)
Trezeguet (I think he's shit but he's probably worth keeping for depth. But I have a feeling he'll go to Turkey or something)
 

 

Then there's a final few like Samatta, Taylor and Steer who I wouldn't be bothered if they left but we should probably hang on to so we don't have too much overhaul. Taylor for example is crap, but Targett is fine imo as our starting LB so keep Taylor as backup and we don't have to buy another LB. If we let Taylor go we probably need to sign another one.

[blunther]

21 minutes ago, MrBlack said:

Ah,  do I not miss those days. 

A bigger bench is definitely the lesser of the evils for me, but even then it takes out an element of skill from picking the subs a manager is likely to need in a game. On the other hand it stops a club getting directly penalised for bad luck...such as an injury to a player for which they have no direct replacement on the bench because they only have 9 there.  Still another slight favour for the existing top 6 though, but not as outrageous as the 5 subs rule. 

Drinks breaks really kill the flow of the game. Are they really necessary? Can't players take drinks off the sidelines at any point during the game if the ball has gone out and they're dying of thirst after running around for 20 minutes? Genuine question  i'm sure I've seen players do that in matches before taking a thow-in, and definitely following a physio assessment for a non injury?

The drinks break will be here to stay, and I would put a lot of money on it being used as an advertisement break midway through each half within a couple of years. 

[blunther]

21 minutes ago, MrBlack said:

Ah,  do I not miss those days. 

A bigger bench is definitely the lesser of the evils for me, but even then it takes out an element of skill from picking the subs a manager is likely to need in a game. On the other hand it stops a club getting directly penalised for bad luck...such as an injury to a player for which they have no direct replacement on the bench because they only have 9 there.  Still another slight favour for the existing top 6 though, but not as outrageous as the 5 subs rule. 

Drinks breaks really kill the flow of the game. Are they really necessary? Can't players take drinks off the sidelines at any point during the game if the ball has gone out and they're dying of thirst after running around for 20 minutes? Genuine question  i'm sure I've seen players do that in matches before taking a thow-in, and definitely following a physio assessment for a non injury?

The drinks break will be here to stay, and I would put a lot of money on it being used as an advertisement break midway through each half within a couple of years. 

[Stevo985]

3 minutes ago, blunther said:

The drinks break will be here to stay, and I would put a lot of money on it being used as an advertisement break midway through each half within a couple of years. 

The drinks break is just because we're playing in summer. They should do it by temperature but they seems to just be using it as a blanket "it might be hot so we'll have a break". It's not new, other tournaments have used drinks breaks in hot weather before.

I don't think that will stay.

 

Unfortunately I do think the 5 subs will stay.
It's **** stupid and I hate it. The bigger the benches and the more subs you can use the more advantage it gives to the bigger clubs. It's a shit rule 

[blunther]

2 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

The drinks break is just because we're playing in summer. They should do it by temperature but they seems to just be using it as a blanket "it might be hot so we'll have a break". It's not new, other tournaments have used drinks breaks in hot weather before.

I don't think that will stay.

 

Unfortunately I do think the 5 subs will stay.
It's **** stupid and I hate it. The bigger the benches and the more subs you can use the more advantage it gives to the bigger clubs. It's a shit rule 

It's ridiculous. You can now change half of the outfield. It's like an international friendly.

 

I think the drinks break will stay because imagine how much the TV companies can sell a minute of advertising for midway through a half in a big match. Will be much more than half time ads because it's not enough time for people to leave, so they have a captive audience. And we all know that money rules football these days. Surprised it hasn't happened years ago.

[Villan_of_oz]

People wanting a big clear out are mad, however many we sell we need the ins to be at +3 to balance the squad or we'll be in the some strife as this year.

If we sell 7 we'll need to buy 10 minimum. So I think the most we want to bring in is 6-7 (at the most), so I reckon the most we can sell are 3-4 players.

Unless they were not part of the squad. There could be a few on loan etc that come back and get moved on.

[fightoffyour]

30 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

I guess there's two questions here. Who do we think SHOULD go (as in be actively looking to get rid of) and who do we think WILL go.

For those who should go I would say

Jota
Lansbury
Baston
Kalinic
Nyland
Engels (just because I think something has happened behind the scenes)
Drinkwater
 

I think we could lose all of those and it will really make no difference. They barely play now (or don't at all) so would be no harm getting rid of them

 

Others who I think WILL go

Grealish (Would love him to stay but I think it's time)
Reina (Would be great to keep as backup for a season given his experience but I don't think we'll keep him)
Trezeguet (I think he's shit but he's probably worth keeping for depth. But I have a feeling he'll go to Turkey or something)
 

 

Then there's a final few like Samatta, Taylor and Steer who I wouldn't be bothered if they left but we should probably hang on to so we don't have too much overhaul. Taylor for example is crap, but Targett is fine imo as our starting LB so keep Taylor as backup and we don't have to buy another LB. If we let Taylor go we probably need to sign another one.

Pretty much spot on.

Taylor is crap but I wouldn't have thought we'll be buying another LB to be a starter ahead of Targett, who I quite like anyway, and I don't see the point in buying a replacement backup who will just be stuck on a longer contract. So unless we have a youth LB ready to step up to the bench, or we could get someone like Antonee Robinson, then Taylor stays by default.

Similar to the RB position, where I quite like Guilbert but he is more likely to be replaced, especially considering his cost vs Targett. Elmo is much more capable as a backup than Taylor though and has been dependable this season. Not a priority here, but if we could get Max Aarons, say, then we should and Elmo could be let go.

Trez I would keep as a sub for this season because we already need to buy 2 starting wingers as a main priority, so it would be difficult to buy a 3rd in the same window without someone knowing they won't play every match. Besides his marketability in Egypt will still be good for the club and means he'll retain resale value whatever happens this season.

Samatta I would also keep, he might find some better form and score some headers if we have decent wingers, and he's another option for a side that is already too short on strikers.

Edited July 28, 2020 by fightoffyour

[Sulberto21]

You could say Suso is a summer goner!!!

[Powehi]

Lovre Kalinić -sell, maybe 2m if lucky?
Ørjan Nyland - sell, maybe 3m if lucky?
Pepe Reina - loan return
Neil Taylor - sell to championship club, 3m if lucky?
James Bree - sell to championship club, 4.5m if lucky?
Danny Drinkwater - loan return 
Jota - sell, maybe 3m if lucky?
Scott Hogan - release

They for me are the ones that offer no benefit by sticking around or are not worth inquiring as to keeping on. Projected total of 15.5m in fees, but I'd take 10m for the lot if offered now.

Feels good to not have an excess of dead wood for once though!

Edited July 29, 2020 by Powehi