PaulC Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Just now, HanoiVillan said: But how good would Grealish, Mount or Sterling be if they had to play with a medicine ball and against opponents who could lunge in with both feet off the ground? And how good would Pele be if he was playing with a modern ball and protected by modern referees? End of the day, it's just not possible to compare across eras that far apart. yes and we all moaned about the pitch at Leeds but some of the pitches in the 60s and 70s were far far worse. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One For The Road Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 5 hours ago, PaulC said: No chance hes the GOAT. Exactly. That's the point he is making. That he isn't the GOAT. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slowandlow Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 8 hours ago, Genie said: Not really way off. I think the point is he sustained a very high level over many years. Only a 50-67% over exaggeration in your original comment. Maybe it's this kind of exaggeration that contributes to others feeling hes over rated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, slowandlow said: Only a 50-67% over exaggeration in your original comment. Maybe it's this kind of exaggeration that contributes to others feeling hes over rated? You seem to be struggling with the basic maths. His career from starting at United to leaving Real Madrid was 15 years. Then he had LA Galaxy/AC Milan/PSG. Within those first 15 years he’s been one of the best wingers in the world for around a decade (imo). Either side of that main period he was still extremely good. This is how the ~15 years of being an incredible player comes from, and includes around a decade as world class. It doesn’t include time in the States as although he still appears to be extremely good the opposition is too questionable to draw meaningful conclusions about his performances (bit like Pele...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slowandlow Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 (edited) 29 minutes ago, Genie said: His career from starting at United to leaving Real Madrid was 15 years. So his first 3 or 4 years at man yoo where he made about 10 apps is included I've seen you dig holes in off topic with some of your weak ass arguments. Just accept you got the timeframes wrong lol Edited March 8, 2021 by slowandlow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 (edited) 36 minutes ago, slowandlow said: So his first 4 years at man yoo where he made about 10 apps is included I've seen you dig holes in off topic with some of your weak ass arguments. Just accept you got the timeframes wrong lol Even if you start from 95/96 season it leaves 11 seasons which start and end with title wins (with more title wins, European cup, domestic cups, and a shed load of individual awards). You can keep convincing yourself he wasn’t all that though if it makes you happier. Edited March 8, 2021 by Genie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 5 hours ago, One For The Road said: Exactly. That's the point he is making. That he isn't the GOAT. I think the original point from Zatman was that we are always told he's the GOAT but in reality very few of us in europe got to see him play bar a handful of world cup games You can drag the state of the pitches and things like that in to it but no one here saw Pele play vs ponte preta in the Sao Paulo state championship in 1961 to say or know if the pitch was good or not, in 1958 he was unplayable in the state championship, scored a record 58 goals... Not one of us saw it, we're just told he was unplayable, there's not even crazy amounts of film to watch You can look at his stats and look at what he won, look at the hype around him, look at his WC performances but you can't say you saw enough of him to really judge him as the best ever Its harsh because that's not his fault 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 2 hours ago, villa4europe said: I think the original point from Zatman was that we are always told he's the GOAT but in reality very few of us in europe got to see him play bar a handful of world cup games You can drag the state of the pitches and things like that in to it but no one here saw Pele play vs ponte preta in the Sao Paulo state championship in 1961 to say or know if the pitch was good or not, in 1958 he was unplayable in the state championship, scored a record 58 goals... Not one of us saw it, we're just told he was unplayable, there's not even crazy amounts of film to watch You can look at his stats and look at what he won, look at the hype around him, look at his WC performances but you can't say you saw enough of him to really judge him as the best ever Its harsh because that's not his fault Theres an ex villa player that played with him at Santos. Steve Hunt. Theres a number of people in their 70s like Harry Redknapp who will say hes the greatest. We can only except what we see but there are people still alive who played against him and we should listen to them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, PaulC said: Theres an ex villa player that played with him at Santos. Steve Hunt. Theres a number of people in their 70s like Harry Redknapp who will say hes the greatest. We can only except what we see but there are people still alive who played against him and we should listen to them That's what I mean though, harry redknapp never watched him play in the flesh in the Sao Paulo state championship when he was setting goalscoring records He's seen him play 10 to 20 times at best and that's only for brazil Someone has told him he's the greatest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 1 minute ago, villa4europe said: That's what I mean though, harry redknapp never watched him play in the flesh in the Sao Paulo state championship when he was setting goalscoring records He's seen him play 10 to 20 times at best and that's only for brazil Someone has told him he's the greatest I meant New York cosmos with Steve Hunt. Do you need to see him play for his club side. He was obviously oustanding for them. It was Jamie that mentioned Pele as the greatest because of his dad. His dad would have played against him several times in the USA. So people like these have some insight a lot more than we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 This is brilliant. Steve Hunt Steve Hunt pays tribute to former NY Cosmos team-mate Pele - YouTube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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