Ratings & Reactions: Villa v Spurs

[markavfc40]

17 hours ago, TRO said:

 

You say he was stating the obvious, i take that as an endorsement, but forgive me for confusing that with some of the posts that are reluctant to embrace our current failings, only under duress as a legitimate case for concern and a roll out of mitigation as a case of acceptance.....little wonder posts like mine are so repeated.

you have not made it clear, you can see it ,at all, even though you may well do, thats the frustration.

I don't accept those shotfalls as inevitable, under the circumstances, and I am far from being the only one......sorry.

 

I'd imagine only a blind person could try and deny we don't have defensive deficiencies and even then if you'd not watched us just knowing we have conceded 2 goals a game will tell you that we are poor defensively. I think you are creating a straw man here as I have definitely made it clear that we have defensive issues. I have also listed numerous reasons as to why we have those deficiencies and I'd be confident in saying it is not down to one single reason.

The bottom line for me this season has always been staying up I'd have bitten your hand off for 17th in August and I'd obviously still do the same now. Expecting us to struggle I knew we'd have issues either defensively, scoring goals or both. As it turns out ours is defensively. Now you may say I am being dismissive of those issues but I am simply more accepting of them than perhaps you are as given the state we were in when we got promoted, given the amount of players we had to bring in and given the make up of that squad at the start of the season in terms of ability, potential and experience I knew it would be a struggle. I am actually relieved that 26 games in we are still well in the mix to stay up and in fact outside the bottom 3. That isn't me being dismissive of our deficiencies that is me accepting that having a major deficiency, either defensively, scoring or both, was a likely reality when I acknowledged we would struggle this season given the uphill battle we faced when we got promoted.

Anyway I have gone way off topic here as this is a reaction thread to us coming within seconds of taking a deserved point off the champions league runners up.

Edited February 18, 2020 by markavfc40

[VillaFaninLondon]

58 minutes ago, TRO said:

He has to demonstrate he can make us more difficult to beat.

The powers that be will be closer to what happens at Bodymoor heath and will have a handle on whether there is a case to say, its likely to get better....If this stays the same, I fear for Dean, because its not sustainable to progress.

for me the contrast in reaction to our defeat by Dean, which had a general tone of "hard done by" and inevitability.......to the sheer anger from Frank Lampard after his defeat to Man Utd......Frank was clearly annoyed with some of his players, without "hanging them out"....His facial expression, spelt out, wait till i get them on the training ground.

I think sometimes you have to show, than anger and aggression in Defeat, otherwise, it becomes all to acceptable.....Dean always looks a bit irritated to a defeat to me as opposed to defiant and not accepting it again next match.....maybe its just my perception.

You're possibly on to something in that he probably doesn't ever stick a rocket up the arse of the players, as say a Nigel Pearson would. But my biggest concern with him is he's never, ever shown he can organise his team's defence. Brentford had an awful defence under him, as did Walsall, as do we. He's also never managed at the top level until this year, and his limitations as a tactician are being laid to bare which is partially why we are where we are. I would like us to aim for a high profile managerial candidate whether we stay up or not, while giving Dean a golden handshake and thanking him for all he's done. 

[VillaFaninLondon]

21 minutes ago, Lichfield Dean said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/51547261

"South Korea forward Son, 27, will have surgery this week after fracturing his arm during Sunday's 3-2 win at Aston Villa, in which he scored twice."

So, he breaks his arm in the first minute, carries on, wins the game for them and then is out for the rest of the season.

Really?

Typical.

[TRO]

1 hour ago, markavfc40 said:

I'd imagine only a blind person could try and deny we don't have defensive deficiencies and even then if you'd not watched us just knowing we have conceded 2 goals a game will tell you that we are poor defensively. I think you are creating a straw man here as I have definitely made it clear that we have defensive issues. I have also listed numerous reasons as to why we have those deficiencies and I'd be confident in saying it is not down to one single reason.

The bottom line for me this season has also been staying up I'd have bitten your hand off for 17th in August and I'd obviously still do the same now. Expecting us to struggle I knew we'd have issues either defensively, scoring goals or both. As it turns out ours is defensively. Now you may say I am being dismissive of those issues but I am simply more accepting of them than perhaps you are as given the state we were in when we got promoted, given the amount of players we had to bring in and given the make up of that squad at the start of the season in terms of ability, potential and experience I knew it would be a struggle. I am actually relieved that 26 games in we are still well in the mix to stay up and in fact outside the bottom 3. That isn't me being dismissive of our deficiencies that is me accepting that having a major deficiency, either defensively, scoring or both, was a likely reality when I acknowledged we would struggle this season given the uphill battle we faced when we got promoted.

Anyway I have gone way off topic here as this is a reaction thread to us coming within seconds of taking a deserved point off the champions league runners up.

fair enough....there you have said it....it was the reluctant acknowledgment imo, I was struggling with.

I value your opinions Mark, as I do Terry's, it was nothing Personal.

[TRO]

1 hour ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

You're possibly on to something in that he probably doesn't ever stick a rocket up the arse of the players, as say a Nigel Pearson would. But my biggest concern with him is he's never, ever shown he can organise his team's defence. Brentford had an awful defence under him, as did Walsall, as do we. He's also never managed at the top level until this year, and his limitations as a tactician are being laid to bare which is partially why we are where we are. I would like us to aim for a high profile managerial candidate whether we stay up or not, while giving Dean a golden handshake and thanking him for all he's done. 

I accept, He is still learning too.....but i see no signs of any work game in game out, on the defending from the team.

I just sit here pondering, how long do these things take to learn?.....its like "Nero fiddles while Rome Burns"

I also accept its fine margins, a draw would have changed the reactions, no doubt....but I still don't see the urgency.

[TRO]

2 hours ago, sne said:

Sorry but this line is brought out from time to time and IMO it's just used to trivialize any and all relevant critique against him.

Bla, bla ,bla blind hate... One should not need to bring up that John McGinn was signed while Bruce was manager or that we beat Wolves every time one has issue with something Bruce did or did not do.

I don't see the need to bring up our promotion when I have issues with how our defense and midfield looks this season.

We all know the history and the circumstances.

I get that Bruce was your guy and it's OK for you to criticize him but not for us. Even when we have the same same critique. 

It's like when a fan from another team says something against Villa. Even if I agree with him it' still not OK  

But he is not my Guy......I prefer Dean Smith.

what do you mean? John McGinn should not be brought up, it was a crucial part of a Managers remit then.....to balance the lack of defenders we had......its the good and the bad.....The Wolves game was under his watch, why wasn't it to his credit?....you want it all loaded on your own side to make the case for discredit bomb proof.......even in a court of law, you have a defence and a prosecution, to here both sides.....you just don't like what you hear in his defence.

I have no issue with folk criticising him for his job, but their failure to see any good, is disappointing granted. Most of the critique lacked balance IMO

If a critic stated their case of his boring style and cautious approach and balanced it by saying, but  his win ratio was 45% and 25 wins in a season failed to get us up by the odd goal, but he brought in some fine players, blah,blah......you wouldn't here a squeak out of me.

Its the personal vitriol, that I was  opposed to.....and If any manager of ours finds difficulty in the future, I hope to god, no one throws a cabbage towards him like that....I thought it was a sleight on our club, quite frankly

Edited February 18, 2020 by TRO

[sne]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

But he is not my Guy......I prefer Dean Smith.

I have no issue with folk criticising him for his job, but their failure to see any good, is disappointing granted. Most of the critique lacked balance IMO

If a critic stated their case and balanced it by saying his win ratio was 45% and 25 wins in a season failed to get us up by the odd goal and he briught in some fine players, blah,blah......you wouldn't here a squeak out of me.

Its the personal vitriol, that I was  opposed to.....and If any manager of ours finds difficulty in the future, I hope to god, no one throws a cabbage towards him like that....I thought it was a sleight on our club.

Fair enough.

But you still have the current Newcastle manager as your avatar 

[TRO]

11 minutes ago, sne said:

Fair enough.

But you still have the current Newcastle manager as your avatar 

Thats me......you puddin'

That has tickled me, I hope you are the only one who thinks that?

From a distance,  it could be construed granted.

I have a similar frame, but I would like to think I am better looking, which cannot be established from that shot....it was taken on a tour of the ground, with my Grand Kids.

Edited February 18, 2020 by TRO

[sne]

1 minute ago, TRO said:

Thats me......you puddin'

From a distance,  it could be construed granted.

I have a similar frame, but I would like to think I am better looking, which cannot be established from that shot.

Hahaha! Sorry mate 

[TRO]

4 minutes ago, sne said:

Hahaha! Sorry mate 

That was brilliant.

you have made me really chuckle.....but fair play for your candidness/Honesty

.......................we better get back on topic.

Edited February 18, 2020 by TRO

[sne]

Just now, TRO said:

you have made me really chuckle.....but fair play for your candidness/Honesty

Honestly thought it was a picture of the new tanned and slim Bruce that we got when he first signed for us  

Might be time for me to finally get glasses...

[TRO]

1 minute ago, sne said:

Honestly thought it was a picture of the new tanned and slim Bruce that we got when he first signed for us  

Might be time for me to finally get glasses...

I've got the number for spec savers.

we better stop now.

Edited February 18, 2020 by TRO

[VillaFaninLondon]

1 hour ago, TRO said:

I accept, He is still learning too.....but i see no signs of any work game in game out, on the defending from the team.

I just sit here pondering, how long do these things take to learn?.....its like "Nero fiddles while Rome Burns"

I also accept its fine margins, a draw would have changed the reactions, no doubt....but I still don't see the urgency.

Correct. And the simple fact is if he can't get those things fixed this far into the season then I fear he never will. 

 

I've no idea what the owners' plans are but my view is we’ve been far too accepting a club for too long. Were Southampton accepting when they got rid of Adkins (who had won them back to back promotions) and appointed Pochettino? No they weren’t, but they wanted success and identified a man to get them that. It worked. Wolves didn’t mess about when Lambert proved to be totally inept and appointed Nuno, who has taken them to Europe within 2 years after they were a bottom half Championship team. Leicester sacked a manager who had gone and won them the PL, everyone outside the club was aghast, but it was the right decision for them to progress as a football club and now look where they are. We're not talking about Man United, or Chelsea, or City here either - we're talking about clubs who had been in the Championship a lot longer than us, in fact those clubs had slipped as low as League 1 relatively recently.

 

We have to do what is best for Aston Villa. If we want to compete with the better teams in this league we need a manager with know-how, with ideas, who can improve the team tactically and individually and most of all get the team to fight every week to win. We’ve finally got owners with the financial resources to take this club far, we can’t waste that opportunity by idly sticking by when it’s clear someone isn’t good enough. It’s a dog eat dog world if you want success and we have to start showing that attitude as harsh as that may sound. 

Edited February 18, 2020 by VillaFaninLondon

[jonjon]

On 17/02/2020 at 05:04, villalad21 said:

This is why I never wanted Dean Smith in the first place.

His teams simply cannot defend. Ask any Brentford or Walsall fan and they'll tell you the same thing.

Look how much Brentford have defensively improved after he left.

We now have the best Goals Against record in the Championship and the sixth best out of 92 clubs, seeing our defensive problems under DS the DOF's were fairly quick in replacing most of our defensive line up at the start of this season, they made some shrewd buy's with players they had been scouting for a long time, and at the moment, fingers crossed, it has paid off. 

As an outsider it seemed that Villa spent a lot of money at the start of the season very quickly, do you think it was panic buying? because Villa wouldn't have had a lot of timed to scout and evaluate them, reading through your forum it appears that many of you are disappointed with some of the players acquired, am I right, or barking up the wrong tree?, just out of interest it would be nice to hear some thoughts of you Villa fans on your recruitment system, good and bad.

[StefanAVFC]

We simply had to buy players because we didn't have a squad, never mind a squad for a PL season.

I'm not convinced we panic bought, but we bought 10+ players. Some shrewd and some not so much.

[villalad21]

1 hour ago, jonjon said:

We now have the best Goals Against record in the Championship and the sixth best out of 92 clubs, seeing our defensive problems under DS the DOF's were fairly quick in replacing most of our defensive line up at the start of this season, they made some shrewd buy's with players they had been scouting for a long time, and at the moment, fingers crossed, it has paid off. 

As an outsider it seemed that Villa spent a lot of money at the start of the season very quickly, do you think it was panic buying? because Villa wouldn't have had a lot of timed to scout and evaluate them, reading through your forum it appears that many of you are disappointed with some of the players acquired, am I right, or barking up the wrong tree?, just out of interest it would be nice to hear some thoughts of you Villa fans on your recruitment system, good and bad.

I get that. But even last season you could see defensive improvement after Dean left. And that's before any major transfers.

Edited February 20, 2020 by villalad21

[Vive_La_Villa]

2 hours ago, StefanAVFC said:

We simply had to buy players because we didn't have a squad, never mind a squad for a PL season.

I'm not convinced we panic bought, but we bought 10+ players. Some shrewd and some not so much.

Exactly. It was either act quickly or risk not even being able to field a full team for the opening game of the season. I think a lot of people have forgotten how many players we had at the start of the summer.  People seem to forget quickly in football.