villalad21 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 12 minutes ago, M_Afro said: I know you may argue that we did compete in the Championship last year with Smith but we really didn’t. 10 game winning run aside we were pretty poor. We were lucky to beat WBA in the semi ( despite playing against 10 men in both legs which is a common weakness) and to beat Derby in the final. The next appointment is massive. It is so demoralising when the exec get it wrong. It just commits you to another cycle of disappointment. Inspiration please We had McGinn, Abraham, Grealish, Tuanzebe and Mings as our spine. I don't know if people realize how strong core of players that is at that level. The Bruce cycle had ended. Any manager with that set of players at that level would have a very good chance at making the top 6.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratvillan Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Disagree with both posts. Semi finals we were poor, we qualified for the final, then won it. That is a great spine, but we were 13th I think when smith took over - an impressive improvement to reach play offs. Every manager would have a chance - smith did it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 5 minutes ago, Stratvillan said: Disagree with both posts. Semi finals we were poor, we qualified for the final, then won it. That is a great spine, but we were 13th I think when smith took over - an impressive improvement to reach play offs. Every manager would have a chance - smith did it. But it was still very tight in the league when he took over. If i remember correctly we were only 4-5 points off the top 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 (edited) Last season from the time Smith came in only Norwich and Sheffield United took more points than us, and with Sheffield United it was only three more points and bearing in mind we rested everyone on the last day of the season, so we did compete. We didn't sign Mings until the end of January and both Tuanzebe and Grealish missed over two months of the season, if they had have stayed fit I think there's a very good chance we would have been promoted automatically. Spoiler 1 Norwich 34 22 10 2 78:42 36 76 2 Sheffield Utd. 34 18 10 6 57:28 29 64 3 Aston Villa 34 17 10 7 62:41 21 61 4 Leeds 34 19 3 12 51:41 10 60 5 Derby 34 15 11 8 54:41 13 56 6 West Brom 34 16 8 10 56:45 11 56 7 Hull City 34 15 9 10 56:49 7 54 8 Bristol City 34 15 9 10 43:39 4 54 9 Preston NE 34 14 10 10 49:43 6 52 10 Middlesbrough 34 14 9 11 35:35 0 51 11 Swansea 34 14 6 14 53:53 0 48 12 Birmingham 34 12 11 11 51:46 5 47 13 Nottm Forest 34 13 8 13 44:41 3 47 14 Brentford 34 13 7 14 53:45 8 46 15 Sheff Wed 34 11 12 11 41:44 -3 45 16 Blackburn 34 12 6 16 50:54 -4 42 17 Stoke City 34 7 18 9 28:34 -6 39 18 Reading 34 8 14 12 34:46 -12 38 19 QPR 34 10 7 17 44:52 -8 37 20 Wigan 34 8 11 15 37:48 -11 35 21 Millwall 34 8 10 16 35:45 -10 34 22 Rotherham 34 5 14 15 43:64 -21 29 23 Ipswich 34 4 10 20 25:59 -34 22 24 Bolton 34 4 5 25 19:63 -44 17 Edited March 1, 2020 by useless 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 I think that's part of the problem though. We weren't far off playoffs and it was still early. Without Jack we just collapsed. Now, every team would miss their best player, but promotion was more to do with Jack's return than it was any other player/manager. We were an average midtable Championship side without him. Problem is, any player will struggle to have as much solo impact in the Premier League, and that's as big a reason we're struggling. If Jack doesn't put in a 9/10 performance we tend to not get anything. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 (edited) Except that we spent two seasons previously in the championship with Grealish and didn't get promoted, and didn't look anywhere near getting promted with Grealish in the side in the third season until Smith was appointed. Edited March 1, 2020 by useless 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 8 minutes ago, kurtsimonw said: I think that's part of the problem though. We weren't far off playoffs and it was still early. Without Jack we just collapsed. Now, every team would miss their best player, but promotion was more to do with Jack's return than it was any other player/manager. We were an average midtable Championship side without him. Problem is, any player will struggle to have as much solo impact in the Premier League, and that's as big a reason we're struggling. If Jack doesn't put in a 9/10 performance we tend to not get anything. No we weren't far off at all. People are talking like we were 10-15 points off drift. We were there or thereabouts. And you're right. We were horrendous after Jack got injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KentVillan Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Can’t believe people are spending cup final day debating this! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M_Afro Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Last season his record without Grealish was terrible. His record with Grealish was excellent. That suggests we do not rely upon tactics but moments of brilliance from a very gifted player. All teams would have missed Jack but not to the extent that we did. His job is to get results when players are injured. He has always failed to do this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M_Afro Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 2 minutes ago, KentVillan said: Can’t believe people are spending cup final day debating this! You are right of course. I will stop now. 45 minute spin class to remove all negativity and I will return focused on stuffing the City. UTV 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fightoffyour Posted March 1, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted March 1, 2020 23 minutes ago, villalad21 said: No we weren't far off at all. People are talking like we were 10-15 points off drift. We were there or thereabouts. And you're right. We were horrendous after Jack got injured. Steve?! 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 2 minutes ago, M_Afro said: Last season his record without Grealish was terrible. His record with Grealish was excellent. That suggests we do not rely upon tactics but moments of brilliance from a very gifted player. All teams would have missed Jack but not to the extent that we did. His job is to get results when players are injured. He has always failed to do this! Delofeu got injured yesterday but Watford just got on with it without him, no excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfTimePost Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Just now, fightoffyour said: Steve?! Beat me to it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparrow1988 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 31 minutes ago, fightoffyour said: Steve?! Nah it's his son Alex. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomaszk Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 3 hours ago, sparrow1988 said: Nah it's his son Alex. Nah that's the other guy, the one who writes desciples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 4 hours ago, KentVillan said: Can’t believe people are spending cup final day debating this! Really? You can’t? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 If we go down I'm inclined to believe that Smith won't be the man to get us back up, let alone keep us up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparrow1988 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 2 hours ago, Mantis said: If we go down I'm inclined to believe that Smith won't be the man to get us back up, let alone keep us up. So just to clarify, are you saying that if we go down and Smith remains in charge you think we will be relegated from the Championship? Because that's how I read your post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mantis Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Just now, sparrow1988 said: So just to clarify, are you saying that if we go down and Smith remains in charge you think we will be relegated from the Championship? Because that's how I read your post. No, I meant, keep us up in the Premier League if/when we come back up. Apologies for the ambiguity! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexicon Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 We can take heart from the performance today and hopefully channel that positively into the remaining games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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