useless Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) Interesting seeing some of the names on the old new manager threads and seeing where they are today, not many of them doing very well. Only names that I saw that were seriously being talked about that have had any kind of success since are Martinez, Rodgers, and Ranieri, and there were plenty against those, Martinez because Bruce had done better at Wigan than him, Rodgers because people didn't like his personality, and Ranieri because he'd been sacked a lot. I think it shows if you go for the same old managers who've failed elsewhere then it's not going to get you very far. Edited June 21, 2020 by useless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Assuming we go down - I don't see us getting a proven manager - if there is such a thing - there's a fair few who have got promoted - yet bombed in the prem. And the few that thrive in the prem will be beyond our reach. Eddie Howe - should Bournemouth come down with us ? JT - a good outside bet - although the non celebration of our goal today - might not be well received. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, hippo said: Assuming we go down - I don't see us getting a proven manager - if there is such a thing - there's a fair few who have got promoted - yet bombed in the prem. And the few that thrive in the prem will be beyond our reach. Eddie Howe - should Bournemouth come down with us ? JT - a good outside bet - although the non celebration of our goal today - might not be well received. Yep he did look quite disappointed when ours went in i noticed that. Just a delayed little clap for the camera's but looked like he felt like i have several hundred times this season watching us either miss a sitter, concede or give the ball away needlessly. As for a new manager i think, if it's possible now FFP has been quashed for a year, that we have a opportunity to see what the new owners are made of. Surely they cannot be happy with things as they stand? So now surely they could offer someone big bucks to come in? even if FFP is back next season couldn't they kind of pay them upfront so to speak? Same with some signings, couldn't you pay bumper wages but in-build it into the transfer fee so the entirety of the contract falls into the 12 months with no FFP? Surely some clever accounting could work something out there? Goodness knows but for me we need someone who can move us on a level or two now and just be too good for the Championship so we can do a Newcastle and rip the division a new one. Edited June 21, 2020 by danceoftheshamen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyh29 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 With only 8 games to go Big Fat Sam is probably the only available manager with a track record of performing miracles That we could get .( for keeping Sunderland up that year he deserves manager of the century ) not sure about him long term but for 8 games I’d give him the job , I’d have given it to him months ago to be honest , Smith should been gone in Jan at the latest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Not sure what the point of giving the job to Terry would be, as he's been part of this season's failure and I can't think of an example of a manager failing but then the assistant has taken over and been a success. Not sure about Eddie Howe either, he's another manager that's done well at a smaller club, but in that sense is similar to Lambert and Smith, I think we need someone who'd proven they can handle being in charge of a big club, and if that's not possible i.e if we're relegated, then I think we should go for someone who's at least had some success in one of the top leagues in Europe, we need someone a bit more proven than the managers we've gone for since O'Neill left. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 12 minutes ago, danceoftheshamen said: Yep he did look quite disappointed when ours went in i noticed that. Just a delayed little clap for the camera's but looked like he felt like i have several hundred times this season watching us either miss a sitter, concede or give the ball away needlessly. As for a new manager i think, if it's possible now FFP has been quashed for a year, that we have a opportunity to see what the new owners are made of. Surely they cannot be happy with things as they stand? So now surely they could offer someone big bucks to come in? even if FFP is back next season couldn't they kind of pay them upfront so to speak? Same with some signings, couldn't you pay bumper wages but in-build it into the transfer fee so the entirety of the contract falls into the 12 months with no FFP? Surely some clever accounting could work something out there? Goodness knows but for me we need someone who can move us on a level or two now and just be too good for the Championship so we can do a Newcastle and rip the division a new one. I've been saying for a few years we need to land a manager we have no right to land. We still seem to be taking punts on managers and hope they grow into the villa job. Not easy but a "better Dean Smith" won't cut it for me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 1 minute ago, useless said: Not sure what the point of giving the job to Terry would be, as he's been part of this season's failure and I can't think of an example of a manager failing but then the assistant has taken over and been a success. Not sure about Eddie Howe either, he's another manager that's done well at a smaller club, but in that sense is similar to Lambert and Smith, I think we need someone who'd proven they can handle being in charge of a big club, and if that's not possible i.e if we're relegated, then I think we should go for someone who's at least had some success in one of the top leagues in Europe, we need someone a bit more proven than the managers we've gone for since O'Neill left. That's exactly where i am at too. Time to get serious now and get some proven quality in instead of doing this "on a hope & a prayer" thing we keep doing... it clearly does not work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, useless said: Not sure what the point of giving the job to Terry would be, as he's been part of this season's failure and I can't think of an example of a manager failing but then the assistant has taken over and been a success. Not sure about Eddie Howe either, he's another manager that's done well at a smaller club, but in that sense is similar to Lambert and Smith, I think we need someone who'd proven they can handle being in charge of a big club, and if that's not possible i.e if we're relegated, then I think we should go for someone who's at least had some success in one of the top leagues in Europe, we need someone a bit more proven than the managers we've gone for since O'Neill left. I don't think Terry would do very well either. I was talking more in terms of probality than being any good. Edited June 21, 2020 by hippo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, danceoftheshamen said: That's exactly where i am at too. Time to get serious now and get some proven quality in instead of doing this "on a hope & a prayer" thing we keep doing... it clearly does not work. Do you think the hierarchy have this in their locker though ? - the shortlist was rumoured to be Smith or Theiry Henry last time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 1 minute ago, hippo said: I've been saying for a few years we need to land a manager we have no right to land. We still seem to be taking punts on managers and hope they grow into the villa job. Not easy but a "better Dean Smith" won't cut it for me. Totally agree Hippo. Time to show what this club is about... we are trying to operate in a way you would expect Norwich, Wigan or Bournemouth (With all due respect to those clubs) to operate. This club is a bigger fish than that and needs to operate like the Arsenals, Evertons, Tottenhams & Newcastles... Just look at the difference in managers those clubs have splashed out on compared to us. I know they have no FFp issues but i think we have underplayed the managers role massively and instead gone all out on this moneyball player thing which clearly does not work thus leaving not enough left for a top manager. Newcastle got it right... They dropped and forked out a fortune on the Fat Waiter and with very little work on the actual team they walked it. West Brom have done the same this season... Leeds are doing it with Bielsa!!! We need a Big manager to handle a club of this size. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chindie Posted June 21, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted June 21, 2020 It'd be nice to pick up a proven top manager. A shame we won't. Smith will go November time when the wheels have fallen off the promotion campaign already, and then we'll probably give Terry the job. Which will be a disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danceoftheshamen Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 4 minutes ago, hippo said: Do you think the hierarchy have this in their locker though ? - the shortlist was rumoured to be Smith or Theiry Henry last time. I don't know is the honest answer. Lerner made the exact same mistakes, moneyball players, lesser managers other than MON... but apparently it was Ellis who got him in i believe? This club is one of the stalwarts of English football and is still being run like a corner shop regards managers. I understand we had issues with FFP and i'll give the new owners leeway with regard to this season as it kind of came from nowhere and they had little option with FFP and the exodus of players we had to endure. But now they need to step up and sort this managerial position out if Dean fails. I hope he pulls through of course but this club works best with some big names here to match the stature of it. Even Ellis knew this & i was far from his biggest fan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 There's a lot of big name managers out of work at the moment, if we'd have stayed up maybe someone like Jardim is someone we could have gone for, has a reputation for working with youngsters which is something that I think our owners will look for, probably very ambitious, but that's what we need to be. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Marco Rose would be one of my shouts to replace Smith in the summer and build upon the foundations being laid. https://www.holdingmidfield.com/marco-rose-borussia-monchengladbach-gladbach-tactics-tactical-analysis/ Quote The basic ideas behind my playing philosophy are emotionality, hunger and being active,” he explains. “We want to be very active against the ball, sprint a lot. We want to win high balls and have short ways to the goal. We don’t want to play high and wide, but fast, dynamic and actively forward. This all sounds really awesome, but it’s gonna take time to develop these things.” Rose utilised a 4-4-2 diamond at Salzburg and has expressed his preference for it: “I’ve always played a diamond when I’ve had the opportunity to do it, bringing in two strikers. Our system, even when we play with all three up front, is something like a diamond.” 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimzk5 Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 7 minutes ago, thabucks said: Marco Rose would be one of my shouts to replace Smith in the summer and build upon the foundations being laid. https://www.holdingmidfield.com/marco-rose-borussia-monchengladbach-gladbach-tactics-tactical-analysis/ That's the same spiel Smith came out with when he got the job 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Not sure really. Only thing certain is it'd be much more interesting pool of candidates if we stayed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 It's a dilemma of difficult circumstance from which there is no escape because of mutually conflicting conditions, which means a catch 22 situation, because if we manage to survive we probably won't sack Smith, and if we go down, then it will be very difficult to attract the high profile manager that people want, if we're a championship club, might be possible to go for someone who's had success somewhere like Holland, France or Portugal, or maybe even Italy or Spain, and want a gateway into the Premier league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 (edited) Would imagine David Wagner will be out of a job soon given how Schalke have ended the season. If we were to change managers in next few months he'd probably be interviewed although his stock has certainly fallen in 18 months. He still did overachieve a fair bit at Huddersfield overall. I've mentioned Carlos Carvahal before. I know he didn't get Sheff Weds up but they finished top 6 twice in his two full seasons. He's done well at Rio Ave, 6th currently in the league. Edit: Seems there's a link to him going to Norwich. Would be really surprised if they sacked Daniel Farke given how little they spent in the summer. Slavisa Jokanovic currently managing in Qatar. Not earth shattering candidates but they're all relatively proven in championship at getting promoted or finishing top 6. Would feel a bit like when WBA got in Bilic and you instantly knew they'd be in mix for top 2. If we want the really good ones though we need to stay as a premier league club. Edited June 21, 2020 by VillaChris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrchnry Posted June 21, 2020 Share Posted June 21, 2020 Throw money at Gallardo and stop wasting money on managers we hope will come good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gurru991 Posted June 21, 2020 Visiting Supporter Share Posted June 21, 2020 1 hour ago, tonyh29 said: With only 8 games to go Big Fat Sam is probably the only available manager with a track record of performing miracles That we could get .( for keeping Sunderland up that year he deserves manager of the century ) not sure about him long term but for 8 games I’d give him the job , I’d have given it to him months ago to be honest , Smith should been gone in Jan at the latest 8 games might be too few games for even Fat Sam to do his thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts