kurtsimonw Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 From 2000 to 2013 the amount of clubs going in to administration, some multiple times, was completely mental. Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 2 hours ago, kurtsimonw said: Given that Bolton and Bury are the first clubs in 6 years to go in to administration, I'd argue they're proof that the EFL/FFP does a great job rather than the opposite. For reference, the previous 6 years to that, 23 clubs went in to administration. No league clubs have actually gone under, though. We're looking at two clubs completely disappearing - one of which is one of the founding league clubs. That isn't doing a great job, at all. It isn't preventing anything, other than debt riddled clubs looking even more unattractive than before as you can't just pump money in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 5 minutes ago, bobzy said: No league clubs have actually gone under, though. We're looking at two clubs completely disappearing - one of which is one of the founding league clubs. That isn't doing a great job, at all. It isn't preventing anything, other than debt riddled clubs looking even more unattractive than before as you can't just pump money in. Clubs haven't gone under because people have bought them. Unfortunately, the EFL can't hold a gun to someones head and force them to buy a club. So if someone comes in at the last minute and saves these clubs, which would also have nothing to do with the EFL, they'd suddenly be doing a good job again? Makes no sense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted August 27, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted August 27, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, kurtsimonw said: Clubs haven't gone under because people have bought them. Unfortunately, the EFL can't hold a gun to someones head and force them to buy a club. So if someone comes in at the last minute and saves these clubs, which would also have nothing to do with the EFL, they'd suddenly be doing a good job again? Makes no sense. Previously, clubs got saved often at the last minute because of good value/punching below their weight fan-base wise etc., so a new owner could come in and dump, say, £10m on a League One project and see their money back pretty easily over the next 3 seasons. Now, they can't do that and clubs are levied with points deductions still - so everything is a lot less attractive and the new owners are not so forthcoming. In part, this is due to FFP and, in part, due to terrible owners (gg EFL). The richer clubs can spend more, the bigger leagues get massive amounts of money and the smaller clubs will simply start to go bust if they fail at their attempts to be a better club. Great job, FFP. Edited August 27, 2019 by bobzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 16 minutes ago, bobzy said: smaller clubs will simply start to go bust if they fail at their attempts to be a better club. Great job, FFP. That doesn't really make sense. All FFP does is mean they can only make a certain amount in losses. Villa didn't even fail FFP and nearly went bust. You think allowing clubs to spend even more, and fail, is somehow helping them stay afloat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Not looking good for Bury, group that was meant to be taking them over have now pulled out of the deal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Tragic that both of these clubs are on the brink. Their owners are not making it easy for someone to rescue them are they? So sad for the fans. Nat Lofthouse was born on 27/8, what a day for this to be happening to his club who won the FA Cup in 1958 and were founder members of the Football League. These two clubs are both former FA Cup winners, surely there is a way of saving them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyrusr Posted August 27, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted August 27, 2019 13 minutes ago, John said: Tragic that both of these clubs are on the brink. Their owners are not making it easy for someone to rescue them are they? So sad for the fans. Nat Lofthouse was born on 27/8, what a day for this to be happening to his club who won the FA Cup in 1958 and were founder members of the Football League. These two clubs are both former FA Cup winners, surely there is a way of saving them? Sadly I think both clubs have been given a number of extensions because there was something positive. Given that now both clubs appear not to have anything concrete to work on, they will be kicked out and inevitably liquidated. Feel for the fans of both clubs. They don't deserve this. This isn't down to FFP As has been pointed out, very few teams have gone into administration over the last few years, with a limit on spending this has helped. Sure, FFP has other significant issues, but this issue isn't symptom of those. This is an issue with the "Fit and Proper Test". How on earth do these, and many others, pass this test? There are also many, many other owners which have certainly raised an eyebrow as to how they have passed, but they have carried on. Think EFL/Premier League need to have a serious review of this rule. These aren't just businesses that these people are owning, they are institutions, cornerstones of the community. For 2 clubs to go in similar circumstances on the same day is appalling. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 2 hours ago, kurtsimonw said: That doesn't really make sense. All FFP does is mean they can only make a certain amount in losses. Villa didn't even fail FFP and nearly went bust. You think allowing clubs to spend even more, and fail, is somehow helping them stay afloat? Exactly. FFP means clubs can only make a certain amount in losses. So it limits clubs. If they fail, they get smacked with a points penalty which will weaken them further and they can’t then spend a load of money to correct the problem - it just spirals downwards. How is that a system that helps clubs stay afloat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LakotaDakota Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Does it even really matter though, most clubs who go bust seem to reform in some form a couple of weeks later, get chucked down a couple of leagues, pop an afc in front of their name & carry on regardless. Very few actually disappear completely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) 23 minutes ago, bobzy said: Exactly. FFP means clubs can only make a certain amount in losses. So it limits clubs. If they fail, they get smacked with a points penalty which will weaken them further and they can’t then spend a load of money to correct the problem - it just spirals downwards. How is that a system that helps clubs stay afloat? If a club is in trouble due to overspending. How can limiting their spending be the issue? Allowing them to spend even more would just compound the issue they have in the first place. I don't disagree with you on the points penalty, that shouldn't happen. But putting a limit on how much debt a club can get themselves in to is absolutely a good thing. If you took FFP away, with the increasing costs of players and wages, you'd have half a dozen clubs going in to administration every year. Which is why pre-FFP there were plenty of clubs going in to administration every year. I'm struggling to see how a club that can't afford to pay wages, should be given an opportunity to spend even more? Edited August 27, 2019 by kurtsimonw 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giro Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Sky sports were doing a countdown till five o'clock People losing their jobs here, so tasteless 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mottaloo Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) Slightly off topic but the bloke i bought my present house off is a massive Bury supporter. The clearing in the woods told all manner of lies to me about the place, such as boiler was knackered and couldn't supply hot water to the bath (short of me insisting on having a bath as part of my viewing then i can't be blamed for that one); garage roof leaked all over the place (i viewed 3 times all in clear weather); kitchen waste pipe floods inwardly when we get heavy rain; electricity fuse board needed replacing.....and also a few other items he hid. Yeah, i know. Buyer be aware. However, for his sake only, i hope Bury get ground in to the dust Edited August 27, 2019 by mottaloo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davkaus Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Giro said: Sky sports were doing a countdown till five o'clock People losing their jobs here, so tasteless BREAKING NEWS: They're scum. Boycott Sky. Anyone who gives money to these scumbags is part of the problem. If you can't get to the game, pirate it rather than giving these arseholes money. Edited August 27, 2019 by Davkaus 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtsimonw Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 16 minutes ago, Davkaus said: BREAKING NEWS: They're scum. Boycott Sky. Anyone who gives money to these scumbags is part of the problem. If you can't get to the game, pirate it rather than giving these arseholes money. Why are Sky part of the problem? Never really understood that tbh. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 Actually find this quite upsetting. I remember how it felt when it was us. We are lucky, those teams aren't. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 3 hours ago, LakotaDakota said: Does it even really matter though, most clubs who go bust seem to reform in some form a couple of weeks later, get chucked down a couple of leagues, pop an afc in front of their name & carry on regardless. Very few actually disappear completely Yes it really does matter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xela Posted August 27, 2019 Author Share Posted August 27, 2019 3 hours ago, LakotaDakota said: Does it even really matter though, most clubs who go bust seem to reform in some form a couple of weeks later, get chucked down a couple of leagues, pop an afc in front of their name & carry on regardless. Very few actually disappear completely I think Maidstone were the last league team to go into liquidation. Darlington & Hereford were already out the league when they went bust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genie Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 I wonder if a bunch of other clubs will follow suit, there must be a lot of clubs very close go the wind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts