Wesley Moraes

[KenjiOgiwara]

11 minutes ago, KentVillan said:

Wesley is in his 5th season of professional football.

After 5 seasons of professional football, Drogba was 24 years old and had 18 professional goals - most scored in Ligue 2

And? What does this even mean? Should we sign a bloke who started playing last weekend cause he might look better than Drogba did at the same time? The time Wesley has spent in football is totally and utterly irrelevant for his performances at the given moment. This is pro football and AVFC, not a god damn charity for lesser developed footballers. 

Wesley will never be in the Drogba bracket. Ever. There's hoping a player will develop and living in fantasy land.  

[birdistheword]

6 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

And? What does this even mean? Should we sign a bloke who started playing last weekend cause he might look better than Drogba did at the same time? The time Wesley has spent in football is totally and utterly irrelevant for his performances at the given moment. This is pro football and AVFC, not a god damn charity for lesser developed footballers. 

Wesley will never be in the Drogba bracket. Ever. There's hoping a player will develop and living in fantasy land.  

Well the Brazil manager deems him good enough for a call-up...

Edited November 9, 2019 by birdistheword

[KentVillan]

6 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

And? What does this even mean? Should we sign a bloke who started playing last weekend cause he might look better than Drogba did at the same time? The time Wesley has spent in football is totally and utterly irrelevant for his performances at the given moment. This is pro football and AVFC, not a god damn charity for lesser developed footballers. 

Wesley will never be in the Drogba bracket. Ever. There's hoping a player will develop and living in fantasy land.  

I was just pulling you up on the incorrect claim you made: "if you look at Drogba's early days football it's clear he's on another planet relative to Wesley."

Calm down.

[KenjiOgiwara]

3 minutes ago, birdistheword said:

Well the Brazil manager deems him good enough for a call-up...

Good for him. I hope he gets better and becomes quality. But bringing Drogba into the discussion is just ridiculous.  

But we all can list shit players with national caps or CL medals. Doesn't mean much. 

[KenjiOgiwara]

Just now, KentVillan said:

I was just pulling you up on the incorrect claim you made: "if you look at Drogba's early days football it's clear he's on another planet relative to Wesley."

Calm down.

It's not incorrect haha. He was. If you claim otherwise you simply haven't watched him at that stage. Drogba might have been raw in his early 20s, but he was direct, strong, had a shot, could run with the ball past defenders and pull some very x factor'esque moves. And Wesley hasn't got any of this. Simply put, you have no idea what you're talking about. 

[smg]

Called up to the Brazil squad, can’t be true because he is sh*t, I read it on here many times.

[KentVillan]

7 minutes ago, KenjiOgiwara said:

It's not incorrect haha. He was. If you claim otherwise you simply haven't watched him at that stage. Drogba might have been raw in his early 20s, but he was direct, strong, had a shot, could run with the ball past defenders and pull some very x factor'esque moves. And Wesley hasn't got any of this. Simply put, you have no idea what you're talking about. 

He was playing in Ligue 2 for Le Mans. And I'm guessing you were about 5 years old at the time.

[PieFacE]

This thread reminds me so much of the Benteke thread when he first signed for us and didn't hit the ground running. Looking back at some of the comments in there, it's quite funny how similar they are. Not saying Wes will have the same goal ratio as him, but it does show we can be too quick to write off players. Give the lad time.

[KenjiOgiwara]

7 minutes ago, KentVillan said:

He was playing in Ligue 2 for Le Mans. And I'm guessing you were about 5 years old at the time.

I am aware. Doesn't change he was a much better player than Wesley. 

Pretty sure I could have taught you a fair few things at 5 as well, so no worries. 

[Laughable Chimp]

1 hour ago, Dave-R said:

It's not hard to see he has strengths, he just has to use them and move past his weaknesses that he's displaying. When Wes had that period against Liverpool where he was chasing the ball down and the fans were going wild, you can more than see that Wesley is trying to develop a new style of play. Wes certainly  doesn't look like the player he was in his videos for his old club, he looks as though he's trying to remake himself and that's ok. Wes does have to find a way past the parts of the game that are making him frustrated, the bits that end up with him on the floor and the kodjia like play where he goes missing and stops fighting for the ball.

I've seen in every game that Wes is trying alot of new things  and at times his link up play has been nice. So to has is unselfish behaviour been a nice bit of play, there have been a few occasions he could of gone for goal yet played it off to his teammate. While he has gotten frustrated at some players, there have been some that just couldnt handle him, he does have a strength where he could terrorise defenders, he just need to realise it more and do that.

I think people need to support him more, don't understand why not, he's our player and we should be offering all the support he can grab. There have been those fans that are or have been so against Wesley being our striker. Some of the things that have been said by fans in other media sites are uncalled for, point blank he's a villa player and untill those behind putting him in the team and stop seeing him as our first striker, stop supporting him as our lone striker, we should also be behind him 1000%.

I'll be honest, I really don't see the strengths that some people are talking about. The only thing I've honestly been impressed with so far, is his movement and poacher's instinct which I don't know why doesn't get talked about more. He's decent at being in the right position at the right time to score for us. The other stuff like strength, link-up play, even finishing I just don't see it, at all, hell aside from finishing I don't even think Wesley is better than Davis at this stuff. Davis certainly uses his strength better on the pitch even if you argue that he is technically weaker and it doesn't feel like there's much difference with our link-up play in the final third whenever Davis is on the pitch instead of Wesley. I know I'm not the only one sharing this perception of him, so I can feel the frustration of some of the other posters here who have the same perception of him as me because it feels like we're not even watching the same player out there.

Him doing something well for one game also doesn't make it a strength of his. I'll be the first to admit that Wesley was doing good against Lovren aerially in the Liverpool match but that doesn't magically make it into his strength when he's been poor at it for more games than he's actually been good at it for us.

I get that he has potential, but you don't put a player with nothing but potential up front for a side battling relegation in the premier league. Its entirely possible Wesley never actually gets better. There have been plenty of players in football who it seemed like had great potential but for one reason or another didn't come good, just as there's players who've come good. No one really knows how good they'll become, that's why its called potential. Well, I guess we don't really have a choice at this point tbh since its really just Kodjia who can sub for him so not sure what's the point.

Edited November 9, 2019 by Laughable Chimp

[Keener window-cleaner]

1 hour ago, Farlz said:

Called up to the Brazil squad 

Is this true?! Absolutely fantastic! He seems to be someone who perhaps more than others needs confidence, this will give him a massive boost! I must admit that I have so far not really come to grips with if I think he has great technique or if he looks a bit fumbly with the ball at his feet, but getting called up to the full Brazil squad isn't to play with , with their tradition, samba style football and plenthora of good players, it's an amazing achievement!

On top of that his value must have gone up a step now as well. Hopefully he will impress and get some minutes as well. 

[Zatman]

fair play to him getting into the Brazil squad, can only be good for his confidence. Think I trust Tite opinion over a number of negative Villa fans 

[VillaChris]

Wow that's mad.

I could fully understand Luiz getting a call up as he's a key part of their under 23/Olympic side but Wesley has really come from nowhere to play for Brazil so a great story and hopefully will give him a massive boost for tomorrow as dream come true obviously.

It's a little bit like when Crouch first got a call up for England when he was still at Southampton and people couldn't stop laughing but his international goal record was very good in the end.

He's been hit and miss so far so think he might struggle with the step up in quality but good luck for him.

One thing it should really help us, any out of favour Brazil player might be looking to us as a decent move in January. Lucas Paqueta for example who's in and out of AC Milan team currently. These are the sort of call ups that will help sell the club to many players in world football.

[villa4europe]

2 friendlies out of a tournament cycle, looking at different players, it's good management, he's 1 of 5 uncapped players in the squad

Maybe Brazil don't give bang average players 50 caps vs the dregs of Eastern Europe before deciding they're not good enough... 

[PompeyVillan]

Bloody Hector, we've gone from having never had a Brazilian player to having two Brazilian internationals. That is an incredible early sign of the potential of Wesley and Douglas Luiz. They just need caps now to confirm their status. 

To say I'm impressed is an understatement.

[VillaChris]

1 minute ago, villa4europe said:

2 friendlies out of a tournament cycle, looking at different players, it's good management, he's 1 of 5 uncapped players in the squad

Maybe Brazil don't give bang average players 50 caps vs the dregs of Eastern Europe before deciding they're not good enough... 

Reading a few Tim Vickery articles in last year seems Brazil are searching for a plan B targetman option as they do struggle to break down mass defences at times (had two 0-0s in the Copa America) so yeah will try him out and see if he's good enough to play in the world cup qualifiers starting in March.

[KenjiOgiwara]

45 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said:

I'll be honest, I really don't see the strengths that some people are talking about. The only thing I've honestly been impressed with so far, is his movement and poacher's instinct which I don't know why doesn't get talked about more. He's decent at being in the right position at the right time to score for us. The other stuff like strength, link-up play, even finishing I just don't see it, at all, hell aside from finishing I don't even think Wesley is better than Davis at this stuff. Davis certainly uses his strength better on the pitch even if you argue that he is technically weaker and it doesn't feel like there's much difference with our link-up play in the final third whenever Davis is on the pitch instead of Wesley. I know I'm not the only one sharing this perception of him, so I can feel the frustration of some of the other posters here who have the same perception of him as me because it feels like we're not even watching the same player out there.

Him doing something well for one game also doesn't make it a strength of his. I'll be the first to admit that Wesley was doing good against Lovren aerially in the Liverpool match but that doesn't magically make it into his strength when he's been poor at it for more games than he's actually been good at it for us.

I get that he has potential, but you don't put a player with nothing but potential up front for a side battling relegation in the premier league. Its entirely possible Wesley never actually gets better. There have been plenty of players in football who it seemed like had great potential but for one reason or another didn't come good, just as there's players who've come good. No one really knows how good they'll become, that's why its called potential. Well, I guess we don't really have a choice at this point tbh since its really just Kodjia who can sub for him so not sure what's the point.

[villa4europe]

7 minutes ago, VillaChris said:

Reading a few Tim Vickery articles in last year seems Brazil are searching for a plan B targetman option as they do struggle to break down mass defences at times (had two 0-0s in the Copa America) so yeah will try him out and see if he's good enough to play in the world cup qualifiers starting in March.

Makes sense but England seem beyond that line of thinking 

[KentVillan]

52 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said:

I'll be honest, I really don't see the strengths that some people are talking about. The only thing I've honestly been impressed with so far, is his movement and poacher's instinct which I don't know why doesn't get talked about more. He's decent at being in the right position at the right time to score for us. The other stuff like strength, link-up play, even finishing I just don't see it, at all, hell aside from finishing I don't even think Wesley is better than Davis at this stuff. Davis certainly uses his strength better on the pitch even if you argue that he is technically weaker and it doesn't feel like there's much difference with our link-up play in the final third whenever Davis is on the pitch instead of Wesley. I know I'm not the only one sharing this perception of him, so I can feel the frustration of some of the other posters here who have the same perception of him as me because it feels like we're not even watching the same player out there.

Him doing something well for one game also doesn't make it a strength of his. I'll be the first to admit that Wesley was doing good against Lovren aerially in the Liverpool match but that doesn't magically make it into his strength when he's been poor at it for more games than he's actually been good at it for us.

I get that he has potential, but you don't put a player with nothing but potential up front for a side battling relegation in the premier league. Its entirely possible Wesley never actually gets better. There have been plenty of players in football who it seemed like had great potential but for one reason or another didn't come good, just as there's players who've come good. No one really knows how good they'll become, that's why its called potential. Well, I guess we don't really have a choice at this point tbh since its really just Kodjia who can sub for him so not sure what's the point.

It's not "nothing but potential" though, is it? He's already won two matches for us.

[BOF]

Football aside (as counter-intuitive as that sounds) I'm made up for the bloke. The journey he's been on. And now he's in the full Brazil squad. It's absolutely bonkers. His family must be off the chart proud of him. I just hope from our perspective that it's a fillip for his Villa career. The goals are there, ironically. We just need the other stuff now. Keep up the good work Wes.