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Premier League 2019-2020 Thread


Enda

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13 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

well it's my opinion. the optimism gauge on here was about as low as it could be before the virus hit. reputable journos had smith to be sacked if we lost to chelsea. i know it was a long time ago but i remember that southampton away game...that was a side destined for the drop. calling off the season, or playing it with relegation scrapped is our only hope IMO.

yes everything you say COULD happen...my opinion is that we are one of the 3 worst sides in the league, and the other 2 are in the relegation zone with us and my point simply is that if we end up in the championship next season, it wont be because of some ridiculous expected points calculation, it will be because us, bournemouth and norwich have been largely crap this season

Yeah and we know the board better than the Journo's and whether you think Smith has done a good job or not, I'd be surprised if you think that the owners/board members were going to let go of Smith before the end of the season, if at all.

"it will be because us, bournemouth and norwich have been largely crap this season" so have Brighton, West Ham and Watford. 

Look at the stats below of Watford's league position, can you seriously say they have been better than us this season?

If the Season was ended after the 27th game they would've been 19th, could anybody have argued they deserved to be relegated based on their placing then? 

Yet now, just in a snapshot, they are outside of the relegation zone, they deserve to stay up and we are worse than them and deserve to be relegated..............................absolute joke!

 

watford.JPG

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The PL. media and fans forums have made the resolution of the 2019/20 season seem like a hugely complicated problem .... but it's not.

Twenty clubs signed up to the competition rules prior to the season starting and they are clear and unequivocal.

Thirty eight matches, 19 home matches, 19 away matches, will decide finishing positions on which the awarding of title winners, European competition positions, relegated clubs and prize money will be decided and there can be no deviation from these legally binding rules. An act of God may void the season, but it cannot legally be used to rewrite the rules of the competition at this late stage without the full agreement of the twenty clubs who signed in good faith prior to the start of this season's competition. This will not happen.

We can discuss the health and moral arguments until we are blue in the face, but it won't change the unalterable legal document that the Premier League and it's 20 clubs have signed up to.

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11 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

I think if the Virus never happened The Blades would have slapped us at VP and DS would be under severe pressure.

In our last games we were bad beyond belief. Some of the worst i've ever seen of a Villa team.

We are just delaying the inevitable if it get's voided. I see no signs in this team getting any better over time. It's Paul Lambert all over again.

Southampton got smashed by Leicester 9-0 and looked the worst PL I had ever seen but now are 14th on 34 points and look half decent.  The season isnt a run of form, it's a season of games played home and away, and teams go on runs, good and bad.  Yes we have been awful recently but Smith's teams do have runs, we do have some good players and a great player in Grealish.  We have it in our locker to win games.  McGinn would've been back.  Yes if you extended our form to the end of the season then we would've been relegated but you cant do that because teams form outside the big teams do fluctuate dramatically. 

Doesn't matter if we are one of the worst Villa teams you have seen either, we have a game in hand and another 9 games to play.  We have spent more time this season outside of the bottom 3 than inside the bottom 3.  Watford have spent 90% of their time in the bottom 3 but the snapshot now they are out.

As for the "no signs of getting better over time" I think that's just a silly comment and comparison for many reasons.

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5 minutes ago, nick76 said:

If you think competent businesses arent looking at what their clients are thinking then you are deluding yourself.  Football is unique in two ways, one they have loyalty from their customer at levels few other companies/industries have even the likes of Apple and secondly they have access for free to what their clients are thinking.  I'm sure they have a intern collating summaries of what the websites like this are saying to the likes of Purslow, even Purslow glancing once in a while or somebody senior at the Villa.  It's been done at every company I've worked at, understanding from our customers directly or secretively/indirectly what they are thinking.  Whether they agree or do something with it is a different thing, that part I agree but like anything if there is enough consensus then you are more likely to see action than inaction by businesses.

well i have to say you're deluding yourself if you think the PL cares about the fans. that has been evident for some time. furthermore the UK makes up only a portion of worldwide viewing figures...we are but a small few of billions of 'clients' they have. the majority of whom are not in this country. their priority is delivering their service to their majority...those in asia, the US, africa, etc. the loyal fans that attend matches of the teams are bottom of the pile. hence why i stand by how they will not be in the least bit concerned about what the likes of us think.

i do agree that villa will take feeds from pages on here, social media etc with regards to opinions on manager/player performances, but the decisions on how the season will be completed will be largely out of purslow's hands. and, with the greatest respect to purslow, he wont take our view into account at the meetings with the PL and other clubs. he will do what's best for the club, not what appeases fans the most.

we dont have a view on player contract obligations, sponsor deals that are in place etc. we have no idea how much money the club stands to lose by not playing its games. every time you see an advertisement pop up on those digital advertising boards during games, that's a sponsor deal being fulfilled. that's sponsor money that was taken into account for FFP, that last i heard, we only just had our head above. this is no longer happening, and we could be royally **** by not playing our games. it will be spun such as "we want to prove our worth in the league" but in reality, it could be financially necessary.

 

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There's still a very reall possibility of the season being cancelled and the table as it stands now being taken as the final table with the current bottom three going down and Liverpool being awarded the title, it's what has happened in Scotland and France and in non league football in this country as well, only league that has cancelled their season but not relegated those in the relegation places has been the Dutch league, but they've also not crowned anyone champions, so it seems from other countries that it's either one thing or the other, no title and no relegation, or title awarded and those in the relegation places relegated, and I can't see them not giving the title to Liverpool.

I think if it came down to a vote it's what most teams would vote for, only those in the bottom three would have a real motivation to vote against it, only thing that may save us if it came down to such a vote, is that perhaps some teams might vote against it so that they may protect themselves from being relegated should they themselves find themselves in the bottom three in a future season which cannot being completed.

Hopefully we decide  to do things a little differently to the other leagues.

 

 

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2 hours ago, nick76 said:

Nope! Sorry just don’t see it happening...the ideas change day by day of what’s going to happen.  The chances of the season finishing is extremely low we know that but no way will they relegate based on current standings or ppg.

The integrity of the league thing is just a myth now any way this ends.

They are just going to finish this the least painful way, which means season ends now, no relegation.

We will see who is right, i hope you are. My point is that villa should make it as hard as possible for it to be decided ppg and if it is then we should have the ability to play our game in hand, its insurance for us and Sheffield 

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5 minutes ago, tomav84 said:

well i have to say you're deluding yourself if you think the PL cares about the fans. that has been evident for some time. furthermore the UK makes up only a portion of worldwide viewing figures...we are but a small few of billions of 'clients' they have. the majority of whom are not in this country. their priority is delivering their service to their majority...those in asia, the US, africa, etc. the loyal fans that attend matches of the teams are bottom of the pile. hence why i stand by how they will not be in the least bit concerned about what the likes of us think.

i do agree that villa will take feeds from pages on here, social media etc with regards to opinions on manager/player performances, but the decisions on how the season will be completed will be largely out of purslow's hands. and, with the greatest respect to purslow, he wont take our view into account at the meetings with the PL and other clubs. he will do what's best for the club, not what appeases fans the most.

we dont have a view on player contract obligations, sponsor deals that are in place etc. we have no idea how much money the club stands to lose by not playing its games. every time you see an advertisement pop up on those digital advertising boards during games, that's a sponsor deal being fulfilled. that's sponsor money that was taken into account for FFP, that last i heard, we only just had our head above. this is no longer happening, and we could be royally **** by not playing our games. it will be spun such as "we want to prove our worth in the league" but in reality, it could be financially necessary.

 

Going over your points.

Yes I agree about overseas clients, do you really think playing the games at St George's park will get that interest? moving from stadiums to those pitches, no fans.......the interest will be limited and that's if all the star players play.  Will Sky/BT/Foreign broadcasters also accept less the quality they have paid for, I'm not sure and I doubt the clubs will get all money.  Negotiations about that fee will take weeks to agree anyway for the money we are talking about, these contracts arent agreed in days.

Largely out of Purslow's hands, I'm not sure I agree with that...there are twenty clubs and I bet he is far more influential  than at least 5 or 10 of them...while his influence will likely be less than Man U and Liverpool, he wont be at the back of the class.

"Do best for the club" so considering that why do you think he let Villa be relegated as a serious option.  He will be back channelling conversation and groups to throw that option off the table.

Again sponsorship deals, that makes this a whole lot harder because sponsors arent/wont get what they paid for....will they accept a lower quality product ie BCD football at St Georges park or other venues, for the price they paid?  Unlikely and then that starts another round of negotiations....more time lost.  What sponsorships will be allowed as different grounds have different amounts of available space.......it's just becoming so messy.

There will be some leeway for FFP, too many clubs will fail because of this virus now, it's thrown things like that into chaos.  I have a finance background and our industry is already talking about a new way of reporting from EBITDA to EBITDAC, which is an acronym for Earnings Before Interest, Tax, Depreciation, Amortisation and Coronavirus.  That means we can drop costs that are related to coronavirus below the assessed line.  So that maybe someway around the FFP issue by governing bodies and clubs.  Obviously audited so it isnt abused but would cover your sponsorship's and wages issue somewhat. 

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2 minutes ago, nick76 said:

Going over your points.

Yes I agree about overseas clients, do you really think playing the games at St George's park will get that interest? moving from stadiums to those pitches, no fans.......the interest will be limited and that's if all the star players play.  Will Sky/BT/Foreign broadcasters also accept less the quality they have paid for, I'm not sure and I doubt the clubs will get all money.  Negotiations about that fee will take weeks to agree anyway for the money we are talking about, these contracts arent agreed in days.

the PL could argue that they're still getting the product they paid for

2 minutes ago, nick76 said:

"Do best for the club" so considering that why do you think he let Villa be relegated as a serious option.  He will be back channelling conversation and groups to throw that option off the table.

i agree he'll want relegation taken off the table...of course he will...but he doesn't need to look on VT to know that's what the fans want

5 minutes ago, nick76 said:

Again sponsorship deals, that makes this a whole lot harder because sponsors arent/wont get what they paid for....will they accept a lower quality product ie BCD football at St Georges park or other venues, for the price they paid?  Unlikely and then that starts another round of negotiations....more time lost.  What sponsorships will be allowed as different grounds have different amounts of available space.......it's just becoming so messy.

per my earlier point, they may be able to say that they've met their contractual obligation on the basis that the advertising boards are still showing the companies that have paid for them on the telly. all they lose is the 40k or so watching in the stadiums.

all this is speculation, and playing devils advocate. i want us to stay up...it's just my opinion that our best chance is if we dont have to play football to do so!

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It would be hard for them to say they are getting what they paid for but as you or somebody else has said we dont know the elements of those contracts.  With big sponsors there are likely to be milestones, conditions and tiers on payments, it would rarely be a flat fee.

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48 minutes ago, useless said:

There's still a very reall possibility of the season being cancelled and the table as it stands now being taken as the final table with the current bottom three going down and Liverpool being awarded the title, it's what has happened in Scotland and France and in non league football in this country as well, only league that has cancelled their season but not relegated those in the relegation places has been the Dutch league, but they've also not crowned anyone champions, so it seems from other countries that it's either one thing or the other, no title and no relegation, or title awarded and those in the relegation places relegated, and I can't see them not giving the title to Liverpool.

I think if it came down to a vote it's what most teams would vote for, only those in the bottom three would have a real motivation to vote against it, only thing that may save us if it came down to such a vote, is that perhaps some teams might vote against it so that they may protect themselves from being relegated should they themselves find themselves in the bottom three in a future season which cannot being completed.

Hopefully we decide  to do things a little differently to the other leagues.

 

 

Theres a rule in there league which states if league ends it stays how it is with champions and relegation,PL doesnt have that rule so cant compare it.

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Theres 6 or 7 teams are against finishing the season at neutral venues. The Premier League need 14 teams to approve it. The conundrum is that the Premier League do not want a 23 team league next season wit added fixture congestion. Around me the builders are back working. There is no safe distances taking place.  People are fed up and just want to get back to work. 

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1 hour ago, nick76 said:

As for the "no signs of getting better over time" I think that's just a silly comment and comparison for many reasons.

Do you think we've improved as a team since the opening fixture against Spurs?

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11 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Do you think we've improved as a team since the opening fixture against Spurs?

Yes, then no, then the roller-coaster kicked in... 

We're back to being a gamblers nightmare of a team, you'd be mad to bet on villa, also think we have at times played better than the result we got

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19 minutes ago, PaulC said:

Theres 6 or 7 teams are against finishing the season at neutral venues. The Premier League need 14 teams to approve it. The conundrum is that the Premier League do not want a 23 team league next season wit added fixture congestion. Around me the builders are back working. There is no safe distances taking place.  People are fed up and just want to get back to work. 

People want to get back to work but the majority don’t think it’s safe to yet.  That’s a big difference. Just one of a number of polls proving that.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/02/fearful-britons-oppose-lifting-lockdown-schools-pubs-restaurants-opinium-poll

C79EE837-5301-407C-9548-3EC7E32301C5.jpeg

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Just now, nick76 said:

People want to get back to work but the majority don’t think it’s safe to yet.  That’s a big difference. Just one of a number of polls proving that.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/02/fearful-britons-oppose-lifting-lockdown-schools-pubs-restaurants-opinium-poll

Yes I know but Im speaking from a purely parochial point of view. People want to risk it so they can pay the bills and feed the family. 

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15 minutes ago, PaulC said:

Yes I know but Im speaking from a purely parochial point of view. People want to risk it so they can pay the bills and feed the family. 

But what has that got to do with football?  Footballers don’t need the money and won’t want to risk their health.

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17 minutes ago, PaulC said:

Yes I know but Im speaking from a purely parochial point of view. People want to risk it so they can pay the bills and feed the family. 

But do they?....fully understand paying bills and feeding family but we still have furloughing. The polls seem to suggest otherwise and I think it’s just a vocal minority wanting to risk it or breaking the rules.  The majority want the stay at home to continue.

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