sidcow Posted May 2, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted May 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, nick76 said: My problem with a lot of these big private companies is that they never deliver. It sounds great now, they get some great publicity now but I bet you when it gets to the end of the year they are nowhere near the capacity needed or they say they are aiming for. Everybody forgets what they said, they get applause now and it sounds great but these companies rarely deliver. It's like me saying I'm aiming to lose 20 pounds in weight. This lockdown and understanding that being overweight could affect my health and recovery especially from these kind of viruses and therefore I understand my diet and fitness regime is not where it needs to be, that'll be working with my family to improve this considerably. Reality is that I'll probably be 5 pounds heavy by christmas. I'm a cynic but essentially I say dont tell me, show me. I don't see their shareholders being very happy if they piss away tens of millions of pounds making a vaccine which doesn't see the light of day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, sidcow said: I don't see their shareholders being very happy if they piss away tens of millions of pounds making a vaccine which doesn't see the light of day. No it'll see light of day but capacity will likely be well below and it wont be anywhere near the end of the year was my meaning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 4 minutes ago, sidcow said: The one thing scientists value above all else is their medical reputation. Not in a million years will a medical researcher be putting their name to unrealistic claims just to help out the Government with a bit of good news. Not totally convinced with that. Before this I would 100% agree with this but have heard some disturbing things during this and even at the highest level that American Dr Brix has finely balanced that line working on the American Taskforce and fronting with Donald Trump. Dr Fauci has been a legend but Dr Brix has been almost a bit political, even not rejecting some non-factual things. I think we've all become bush medical experts so maybe I'm off point but watching these things you see how medical scientists have been rejecting each others claims....and I'm not talking about speculation or such like but basic medicine which is a little concerning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted May 2, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted May 2, 2020 Just now, nick76 said: No it'll see light of day but capacity will likely be well below and it wont be anywhere near the end of the year was my meaning If you read the story their point is they think it will work and so they are working NOW on how they will mass produce it. Oxford are so convinced they are maxing out their capacity to make it NOW so they have a million vaccines, the most they can make, available in September. At that time of it's authorised those million are immediately available for use and AstraZeneca immediately put their might into mass producing it. If a small lab in Oxford can make a million doses in 6 months I would imagine a £20billion turnover global mega pharmaceutical corporation with hundreds of factories around the world can make a fair few in 3 months when they've got them all primed and ready to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 Just now, sidcow said: If you read the story their point is they think it will work and so they are working NOW on how they will mass produce it. Oxford are so convinced they are maxing out their capacity to make it NOW so they have a million vaccines, the most they can make, available in September. At that time of it's authorised those million are immediately available for use and AstraZeneca immediately put their might into mass producing it. If a small lab in Oxford can make a million doses in 6 months I would imagine a £20billion turnover global mega pharmaceutical corporation with hundreds of factories around the world can make a fair few in 3 months when they've got them all primed and ready to go. Lets hope so, the quicker we can move on from this thing the better. Edit: Just read it all on the website. You are assuming this vaccine works as well, I thought it was further on than it is. It's like a number of trials that are going on across the world that are in the early stages so could fade away or need to be adjusted re dosage size etc so could be a lot longer. "A high proportion of vaccines are found not to be promising even before clinical trials. Moreover, a significant proportion of vaccines that are tested in clinical trials don’t work. If we are unable to show that the vaccine is protective against the virus, we would review progress, examine alternative approaches, such as using different numbers of doses, and would potentially stop the programme." http://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2020-04-23-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-begins-human-trial-stage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post AntrimBlack Posted May 2, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted May 2, 2020 Football is absolutely not essential, no matter what anyone tries to tell us. Why would we put the lives of doctors and nurses at risk just to satisfy the money rich Premier League? We need to remember what is at stake here; peoples lives - not promotion, relegation, etc. We need to concentrate on what really matters. Saving lives, getting essential operations up and running again. To hell with the football. it's only a game. People are dying. 12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only2McInallys Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 1 hour ago, sidcow said: I hope I don't get into trouble for this because I always seem to get a warning and I never know what I do wrong, but from the BBC website which follows the same theme as all other news outlets: The partnership with AstraZeneca aims to build capacity to produce tens of millions of doses by the end of the year, if the treatment is effective. "Our manufacturing capacity in the UK for vaccines isn't where it needs to be, and we're going to work together with AstraZeneca to improve that considerably," Prof Bell added. GlaxoSmithKline and Sanofi 2 biggest vaccine makers in the world made a statement saying they expect a vaccine to be ready in 12 to 18 months. If you can’t directly expose someone to the virus to see if the vaccine works how long are clinical trials going to take ? Remember Drug companies are in this to make a profit and they have shareholders and shares go up if a new medicine has been discovered or published . Vaccine stories can be used by people to give hope . Much more likely is treatment for most seriously affected Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 5 hours ago, villalad21 said: Finishing the season on a neutral pitch out of the country looking like the most realistic option. Basically like a gigantic pre season like a gigantic pre season tour of America / china / Australia where they'll tell you its about football but in reality its about money and marketing growth so it'll be on one pitch which ground staff like ours cant visit and replicate at BMH, but that's irrelevant because the players wont be training there anyway, in a different country, staying in hotels, in mid summer, in a different climate, without an actual pre season, behind closed doors, with players that were injured returning, but losing players that were on loan and out of contract and without VAR but somehow the integrity of the competition is still in place.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidcow Posted May 2, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted May 2, 2020 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Only2McInallys said: GlaxoSmithKline and Sanofi 2 biggest vaccine makers in the world made a statement saying they expect a vaccine to be ready in 12 to 18 months. If you can’t directly expose someone to the virus to see if the vaccine works how long are clinical trials going to take ? Remember Drug companies are in this to make a profit and they have shareholders and shares go up if a new medicine has been discovered or published . Vaccine stories can be used by people to give hope . Much more likely is treatment for most seriously affected I'm only going by what the news stories and Oxford University press releases are saying. They have been given dispensation to short cut some procedures. Vaccine technology is a very known tried and tested procedure. I am sure the biggest danger is it not working rather than being dangerous. It's not like a new type of medicine which has unknown complications. Clinical trials are taking place now and people are being injected with it. Edited May 2, 2020 by sidcow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 (edited) Interesting that Karen Brady has now come out and said every Premier League club wants to finish the season. Edited May 2, 2020 by PaulC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 She and the PL can say what they like, it's just not safe or logical to do so. Why don't they realise this? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 Just now, Zhan_Zhuang said: She and the PL can say what they like, it's just not safe or logical to do so. Why don't they realise this? Might not be safe or logical for the whole of next season either. Or the season after that. As a society we'll be forced to start taking risks. We can't keep sitting at home for the next 2 years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted May 2, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted May 2, 2020 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Only2McInallys said: GlaxoSmithKline and Sanofi 2 biggest vaccine makers in the world made a statement saying they expect a vaccine to be ready in 12 to 18 months. If you can’t directly expose someone to the virus to see if the vaccine works how long are clinical trials going to take ? Remember Drug companies are in this to make a profit and they have shareholders and shares go up if a new medicine has been discovered or published 1) They are not manufacturing the Oxford vaccine 2) I'm relatively sure the clever bods who made a vaccine are going to target frontline health/care workers when they test it out - as those are the most likely to confront the virus 3) There has been huge effort, especially by Oxford, to ensure that the whole operation is done at cost during the current pandemic and that all low to middle wealth countries will be able to have it. There will be a back end where of course profits will come, but those are to be reinvested in vaccine research for future pandemics. But it all means nothing if it doesn't work. They are going to have hundreds of thousands of doses made in advance of knowing this. On a premier league thread related point - we'll only get back to normal when this has been deployed - I can see next season not starting on time. Edited May 2, 2020 by Jareth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
useless Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 Brady actually said that every Premier league club is committed to finishing the season but she fears it could be cancelled. So that's not really the same as sayng that every club wants the season to continue. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 9 minutes ago, PaulC said: Interesting that Karen Brady has now come out and said every Premier League club wants to finish the season. She's changed her tune then. Very surprising that every club would want to restart, despite everything previously pointing to the clubs not being unanimous, either way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted May 2, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted May 2, 2020 Just now, John said: She's changed her tune then. Very surprising that every club would want to restart, despite everything previously pointing to the clubs not being unanimous, either way. I have a feeling that nobody wants to be seen to be a huge coward - I'm certain many when it comes to it will vote to void, when they can demonstrate they had no other option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Jareth said: I have a feeling that nobody wants to be seen to be a huge coward - I'm certain many when it comes to it will vote to void, when they can demonstrate they had no other option. When and if, the PL deem to tell the clubs, what would then happen title, European places, relegation and promotion wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only2McInallys Posted May 2, 2020 Share Posted May 2, 2020 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Jareth said: 1) They are not manufacturing the Oxford vaccine 2) I'm relatively sure the clever bods who made a vaccine are going to target frontline health/care workers when they test it out - as those are the most likely to confront the virus 3) There has been huge effort, especially by Oxford, to ensure that the whole operation is done at cost during the current pandemic and that all low to middle wealth countries will be able to have it. There will be a back end where of course profits will come, but those are to be reinvested in vaccine research for future pandemics. But it all means nothing if it doesn't work. They are going to have hundreds of thousands of doses made in advance of knowing this. Does anyone remember the MMR scandal?Many people thought these vaccine caused medical problems. These were vaccine that had been developed over many years been tested thoroughly in mass clinical trials and still people thought they had side effects. To do a mass clinical trial will need 20,000 people .How long is it going to take to see if it works,has no side effects etc After that they will need to manufacture it in mass quantities .All those things will take longer than 6 months No one is going introduce something at huge cost and expense unless they are sure it works and has no side effects On top of that there is no proof if you get it you can’t catch it again. Sorry if I am glass half empty guy Edited May 2, 2020 by Only2McInallys 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted May 2, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted May 2, 2020 1 minute ago, Only2McInallys said: After that they will need to manufacture it in mass quantities .All those things will take longer than 6 months No one is going introduce something at huge cost and expense unless they are sure it works and has no side effects Dude yer just gotta google it. Search 'Bill Gates'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareth Posted May 2, 2020 VT Supporter Share Posted May 2, 2020 3 minutes ago, John said: When and if, the PL deem to tell the clubs, what would then happen title, European places, relegation and promotion wise. Well that's the 64 million dollar question they're pushing back every week. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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