Frédéric Guilbert

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 hour ago, Elton said:

I like him but he was clearly at fault for Deeney’s goal. He let Deeney drift off him and amble into the 6 yard box for a simple free header when he could see that Konsa was wasn’t picking him up. He needs to improve his defensive awareness and he’ll be a good player.

Deeney won headers against him all first half, it was a clear issue and looked like something Watford had worked on. Even if he tracked him Deeney would still have scored. 
 

In the second half a centre half started picking him up. 

[villa4europe]

the problem is konsa should hold in the middle, that's the role in the 3, mings has stepped out of position, hause is closing down the ball, konsa just needs to hold...

and he doesn't, he drifts, worst of it being he drifts to nowhere, he has to know where deeney is, mainly because he's their main threat but also because there is no one else

you cant have 2 players step out in a 3, doesn't work, 2 hold position and shape 1 free man goes

im guessing that's why mings had the barney with him

don't get me wrong guilbert needs to track him and sandwich him and obviously also needs to shout at konsa but its konsa that should be in front of him goal side winning the header

[VillaAlex]

Never hides, never bottles, always gives everything. Love him.

[DaveAV1]

36 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

the problem is konsa should hold in the middle, that's the role in the 3, mings has stepped out of position, hause is closing down the ball, konsa just needs to hold...

and he doesn't, he drifts, worst of it being he drifts to nowhere, he has to know where deeney is, mainly because he's their main threat but also because there is no one else

you cant have 2 players step out in a 3, doesn't work, 2 hold position and shape 1 free man goes

im guessing that's why mings had the barney with him

don't get me wrong guilbert needs to track him and sandwich him and obviously also needs to shout at konsa but its konsa that should be in front of him goal side winning the header

Yes but he knew he was going to assist Mings in scoring a brilliantly placed 95th minute winner. 

[AVTuco]

I'm starting to warm up to Fred.

[Elton]

49 minutes ago, villa4europe said:

the problem is konsa should hold in the middle, that's the role in the 3, mings has stepped out of position, hause is closing down the ball, konsa just needs to hold...

and he doesn't, he drifts, worst of it being he drifts to nowhere, he has to know where deeney is, mainly because he's their main threat but also because there is no one else

you cant have 2 players step out in a 3, doesn't work, 2 hold position and shape 1 free man goes

im guessing that's why mings had the barney with him

don't get me wrong guilbert needs to track him and sandwich him and obviously also needs to shout at konsa but its konsa that should be in front of him goal side winning the header

So you do agree with me then

I’m not saying Konsa couldn’t have done better but Fred was the main culprit. I think he’s a really good prospect but just these little concentration/awareness issues let him down at times. If he was the finished article we wouldn’t have signed him as a championship team and he wouldn’t occasionally get dropped for Elmo.

[DCJonah]

Deeney was in the middle of the 6 yard box, how on earth do you blame the right wing back for him being free?

Hause was challenging the cross, that meant we had 2 cbs to mark one striker. Konza's man all day for me. 

[Elton]

12 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Deeney was in the middle of the 6 yard box, how on earth do you blame the right wing back for him being free?

Hause was challenging the cross, that meant we had 2 cbs to mark one striker. Konza's man all day for me. 

Because he was marking him and then let him go to nod in a free header...

[DCJonah]

Just watched it back. Yeah he probably should have been tighter but konza's position seems wrong to me. He didn't need to be so far away fro. Deeney and really konza should be the one challenging. Deeney will eat guilbert in the air most times. 

Overall, not a great defensive display for their goal. 

[Rightdm00]

18 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Just watched it back. Yeah he probably should have been tighter but konza's position seems wrong to me. He didn't need to be so far away fro. Deeney and really konza should be the one challenging. Deeney will eat guilbert in the air most times. 

Overall, not a great defensive display for their goal. 

Exactly, what's the point of having 3 CBs (all 6' or above) on the pitch and then leave it up to your 5'10 WB to mark a 6' CF.  Fred maybe could have done a little more to put off Deeney's run but that's Konsa's man all the way. 

[Elton]

29 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said:

Exactly, what's the point of having 3 CBs (all 6' or above) on the pitch and then leave it up to your 5'10 WB to mark a 6' CF.  Fred maybe could have done a little more to put off Deeney's run but that's Konsa's man all the way. 

I really don’t get this viewpoint. Fred was marking him and left him knowing that Konsa was facing the other way and not able to see Deeney. Fred could see the whole picture.

It would be the same if El Ghazi playing up front decided to leave a man he was marking when defending but that’s ok, it’s not his normal job. What if a defender has a tap in but decides not to bother because that’s not his normal job? 
 

These are basics of football and if we want to stop conceding so freely then everyone has to be alert and do the basics and not fall asleep at crucial moments and that applies to everyone if we like them or not.

[Vive_La_Villa]

Guilbert should have tracked him but the fact that he had to mark long balls to Deeney for the entire first half was causing us problems. We corrected it second half. 

[Rightdm00]

1 minute ago, Elton said:

I really don’t get this viewpoint. Fred was marking him and left him knowing that Konsa was facing the other way and not able to see Deeney. Fred could see the whole picture.

It would be the same if El Ghazi playing up front decided to leave a man he was marking when defending but that’s ok, it’s not his normal job. What if a defender has a tap in but decides not to bother because that’s not his normal job? 
 

These are basics of football and if we want to stop conceding so freely then everyone has to be alert and do the basics and not fall asleep at crucial moments and that applies to everyone if we like them or not.

Hause gets cutout by the threw ball. Ming's comes over to cover. Konsa ends up marking no one.  As a CB he should be marking him. If you expect Fred to come that far center then that leaves a whole half of the field open. Plus, expecting your WB who is 2 inches smaller and 30# lighter to out jump Deeney seems like a match up you would try to avoid. 

[Elton]

8 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said:

Hause gets cutout by the threw ball. Ming's comes over to cover. Konsa ends up marking no one.  As a CB he should be marking him. If you expect Fred to come that far center then that leaves a whole half of the field open. Plus, expecting your WB who is 2 inches smaller and 30# lighter to out jump Deeney seems like a match up you would try to avoid. 

Fred did avoid it, he just left him. Weird that anyone can think that’s ok.

So by your logic Fred should (as he did) leave Deeney who is about to nod it in and mark some empty space on the right wing?

Edited January 22, 2020 by Elton

[Kingman]

1 minute ago, Elton said:

Fred did avoid it, he just left him. Weird that you think that’s ok.

Take care in all you do next year
And keep smiling through the days
If we can help to entertain you
Oh we will find the ways
So merry Christmas one and all
There's no place I'd rather be
Than asking you if you'd oblige
Stepping into Christmas with me... 

[Elton]

5 minutes ago, Kingman said:

Take care in all you do next year
And keep smiling through the days
If we can help to entertain you
Oh we will find the ways
So merry Christmas one and all
There's no place I'd rather be
Than asking you if you'd oblige
Stepping into Christmas with me... 

Mate, you’ve got the wrong Elton. I’m Ben.

[Adam2003]

Hi guys, what about if we say: Konsa could have done better with their goal, so could Guilbert, and hopefully they both learn from it and continue to develop as promising young players in their first season of top-flight football? As long as they keep knocking in the goals themselves to make up for any lapses I'll forgive them

[MrBlack]

9 minutes ago, Kingman said:

Take care in all you do next year
And keep smiling through the days
If we can help to entertain you
Oh we will find the ways
So merry Christmas one and all
There's no place I'd rather be
Than asking you if you'd oblige
Stepping into Christmas with me... 

I always thought it was "if you would mind"...

On topic, Fred and Konsa both at fault for the goal,  either one of them could've done more to stop it, but more Konsa for me. Fred had an exceptional game otherwise. Konsa I think is a gamble at the moment but he'll be a good player in the future

[Rightdm00]

10 minutes ago, Adam2003 said:

Hi guys, what about if we say: Konsa could have done better with their goal, so could Guilbert, and hopefully they both learn from it and continue to develop as promising young players in their first season of top-flight football? As long as they keep knocking in the goals themselves to make up for any lapses I'll forgive them

That's fair I can leave it there. As a wide defender myself I always hated it when the CBs expected me to pick up the huge CF while they did **** all trotting around the penalty spot marking empty space. Just felt the need to defend my boy Guilbert their for a sec. 

[ozvillafan]

3 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said:

That's fair I can leave it there. As a wide defender myself I always hated it when the CBs expected me to pick up the huge CF while they did **** all trotting around the penalty spot marking empty space. Just felt the need to defend my boy Guilbert their for a sec. 

I'm with you. It was Konsa's man all day long. He got drawn to the ball where there was no threat as Hause had him covered - a sign of a poor defender.

You always mark up in your own box even if you are outnumbered - but Konsa drifted and Guilbert was hesitant as he wasn't sure who was behind him.

Made up for it with a fine goal.