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Tyrone Mings


Demitri_C
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5 hours ago, Peter Griffin said:

I would say that there is a direct relationship between money spent on a defender and a reduction in the amount of mistakes made. Yes there will always be some exceptions but the better players make fewer mistakes and these players tend to cost more money.

 

some of the most expensive defenders of all time contain David Luiz, Benjamin Mendy, Otamendi, Maguire, Stones and Kyle Walker. The most expensive goalkeeper was Kepa

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13 hours ago, lexicon said:

I just think you're talking nonsense, sorry. 

The good work that Mings does absolutely outweighs the mistakes he sometimes makes and we'd be a hell of a lot worse off without him. Given that we've seen an inferior defender in Ben White go for 50m, it's a very good job the club doesn't think the way you do and try to replace him, because we're highly unlikely to find someone who is better than he is overall. 

Of course wed be worse off without Mings that is a stupid thing to say for a start, wed be worse without any one of those players this season that's a fact. You say I'm talking nonsense and then you are saying pointless Shit. I think you just don't like anyone criticising Mings whether it's good or bad criticism. Mings isn't perfect he makes mistakes and being the last man in the defence often and being caught out will happen, it's about finding ways of stopping it and it's like you don't want to hear none of it. If all your going to do is keep saying someone's talking nonsense as soon as they make there point then why even bother replying at all.

Sometimes it's like people can't even bloody speak around here or have a point, do I keep telling you your talking nonsense, no I do not. Just because you think tour right doesn't make others wrong you know..

Mings may do ace work but he has weaknesses and those weaknesses get exposed and no I do not believe it's worth the trade off, not at this level. If there is an answer and an easy solution as to put a fast player around where Mings is struggling under pressure, then why not take it. It just seems like tour all okay for Mings to keep making these mistakes, yet its these mistakes that keep us from reaching above and beyond in the league. If were going to continue to improve point blank Mings is going to have to cut these lapses in concentration out or we will end up replacing him if were to continue to improve. mopping up possible incoming mistakes is one reason why we have a CDM, then if your playing this down then what's the point of a defensive midfielder, they are there to help out in these kind of situations and put a stop to pressure.

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3 hours ago, peterw said:

I just don't get this 'not good enough for where we're going' argument. Its like an astronaut wearing his moon gear when walking around downtown Miami because he doesn't think his normal clothes are good enough for where he wants to go to. Is Mibgs good enough for where we are now? Yes. Is he good enough to try and get us into Europe? Yes. Is he good enough for pushing on thereafter? We'll see.

Welll why would you wear you moon gear around miami that's just idiotic in that heat. He probably shouldn't be going to the moon if he's making poor choices of wearing his astronaut clobber all while everyone else has F*ck all on lol. 

I think why people say it, is they are clearly stating that soon its going to become apparent that we wont reach europe having a player who makes these cheap mistakes. It's already creeping into slots minds because these simple amateur mistakes at that level cost you games and points. We are going to need an upgrade on Mings and the more of these mistakes Mings makes it only makes his weakness more of an easy problem to solve next window if he keeps it up.

 

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Couldn't care less about the stuff he does off the pitch.

Need him to perform on the pitch and cut out those mistakes.

But being in his late 20's odds are he won't do. He is at an age now where his value will decrease every year. Club needs to consider offloading him if they want to get decent profit out of him.

Edited by villalad21
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2 hours ago, Dave-R said:

Of course wed be worse off without Mings that is a stupid thing to say for a start, wed be worse without any one of those players this season that's a fact. You say I'm talking nonsense and then you are saying pointless Shit. I think you just don't like anyone criticising Mings whether it's good or bad criticism. Mings isn't perfect he makes mistakes and being the last man in the defence often and being caught out will happen, it's about finding ways of stopping it and it's like you don't want to hear none of it. If all your going to do is keep saying someone's talking nonsense as soon as they make there point then why even bother replying at all.

Sometimes it's like people can't even bloody speak around here or have a point, do I keep telling you your talking nonsense, no I do not. Just because you think tour right doesn't make others wrong you know..

Mings may do ace work but he has weaknesses and those weaknesses get exposed and no I do not believe it's worth the trade off, not at this level. If there is an answer and an easy solution as to put a fast player around where Mings is struggling under pressure, then why not take it. It just seems like tour all okay for Mings to keep making these mistakes, yet its these mistakes that keep us from reaching above and beyond in the league. If were going to continue to improve point blank Mings is going to have to cut these lapses in concentration out or we will end up replacing him if were to continue to improve. mopping up possible incoming mistakes is one reason why we have a CDM, then if your playing this down then what's the point of a defensive midfielder, they are there to help out in these kind of situations and put a stop to pressure.

This is very true and I think this is where I bow out. I don't think there's any point trying to explain something that you don't want to grasp, as you fixate on things that nobody is actually saying (for example, nobody is saying that Mings is perfect, nobody is saying that he has to do it all on his own, nobody is stopping you from expressing your opinion, nobody is saying that someone is immune from criticism, yet they feature a lot in your posts). It's just tiring. 

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1 hour ago, lexicon said:

This is very true and I think this is where I bow out. I don't think there's any point trying to explain something that you don't want to grasp, as you fixate on things that nobody is actually saying (for example, nobody is saying that Mings is perfect, nobody is saying that he has to do it all on his own, nobody is stopping you from expressing your opinion, nobody is saying that someone is immune from criticism, yet they feature a lot in your posts). It's just tiring. 

This is becoming a big issue on this forum, and it’s usually from people providing criticism. This whole “I can’t say anything on here” attitude is tiresome and childish, if you’re going to offer a negative opinion on something then you have to accept that someone will probably call you out on it.

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4 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Couldn't care less about the stuff he does off the pitch.

Need him to perform on the pitch and cut out those mistakes.

But being in his late 20's odds are he won't do. He is at an age now where his value will decrease every year. Club needs to consider offloading him if they want to get decent profit out of him.

I would be amazed if that is their intention. He is here for the long haul. 

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1 hour ago, lexicon said:

This is very true and I think this is where I bow out. I don't think there's any point trying to explain something that you don't want to grasp, as you fixate on things that nobody is actually saying (for example, nobody is saying that Mings is perfect, nobody is saying that he has to do it all on his own, nobody is stopping you from expressing your opinion, nobody is saying that someone is immune from criticism, yet they feature a lot in your posts). It's just tiring. 

its not my argument, I am just trying to be helpful.

Everyone has their own opinion and has the right to express it, providing it doesn't harm anyone else......saying someone is talking nonesense or some call someoen an idiot for their comments , is just not cricket.

I get your frustration, when someone doesn't see your point......I think it sometimes, when folk can't see my point, its frustrating, but I do not call their point nonesense, I try suppress my frustration and move on.

Personally, I love opposing views, that way I learn to have a more rounded point of view of a considered view point.

Football is all about opinions and every Premier league manager, despite their professional prowess, don't always agree and have differing views how to get a result.

sometimes the problem is, is not what is being said , more of what is not being said....if you avoid the issue of the errors, its like condoning it, in some folks eyes......

I think ty does more good than bad and I want him in the team.....but the errors have to stop....we seen last night the passion and determination Pep exudes in getting his point over.....Jack & Mahrez were torn one and I have seen him do it to others, who don't stick to his instructions....All managers deal with it their way, but we can't condone gifts.

you don't need to bow out....your opinions are too valuable for that.

 

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People react based on goals conceded. Mings makes too many errors but then people forget how many goals he prevents. Hause on the other hand didn’t make an error last season but I saw a Chelsea team miss massive chances while he was in the team. Had they scored at least one of themit would be a case of Hause isn’t good enough. 

It’s almost like some fans can only judge players on scorelines or other teams taking chances rather than actually watching our defenders play and judging by that. 

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4 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Couldn't care less about the stuff he does off the pitch.

Need him to perform on the pitch and cut out those mistakes.

But being in his late 20's odds are he won't do. He is at an age now where his value will decrease every year. Club needs to consider offloading him if they want to get decent profit out of him.

not every player we buy we intend to get profit out of. the likes of mings, emi, ings i guarantee they never intended to sell for profit one day.

and he is doing the bolded part...he's performing very, very well.

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38 minutes ago, Woody1000 said:

This is becoming a big issue on this forum, and it’s usually from people providing criticism. This whole “I can’t say anything on here” attitude is tiresome and childish, if you’re going to offer a negative opinion on something then you have to accept that someone will probably call you out on it.

Being called out on it is fine. But getting strawmanned constantly is annoying.

Someone says something negative and then someone else responds by misrepresenting their opinion as if it's a lot worse and more extreme than it actually is.

The Dean Smith out discussions last season are a classic example. Most people who provided criticism on Dean Smith didn't want him out but they were tarred with the brush as if they did and were made to look ungrateful for not appreciating where he'd taken the club. Various posters had to repeatedly insist that that wasn't their position. 

Or take the Jacob Ramsey thread. Couple of guys in there are acting all high and mighty because Ramsey has finally come good despite some posters having written them off. Except most posters didn't write them off, a lot including myself were just expressing healthy skepticism about him considering his prior performances.

In fact, it seems like having any level of skepticism towards our youngsters gets labelled as writing them off. No one, I repeat no one was writing Carney off after one game 2 weeks ago. People were just again, claiming he didn't perform all that well I'm that game. Didn't stop some posters from acting like they did.

happens all the **** time on here on various topics.

 

 

Edited by Laughable Chimp
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26 minutes ago, Woody1000 said:

This is becoming a big issue on this forum, and it’s usually from people providing criticism. This whole “I can’t say anything on here” attitude is tiresome and childish, if you’re going to offer a negative opinion on something then you have to accept that someone will probably call you out on it.

Woody, but its not negative in their eyes, its a positive in trying to get in a better player and make money......I prefer to keep Ty and get him back to not gifting goals, it can be done.

I disagree too, I think Tyrone is a very good defender, who for us, will be hard to replace all is good stuff.....and I am not talking about off the field, where he seems a good human being.

but.......No one "should be called out" imo from where ever that term come from, because that assumes the caller is right, when that is still to be established.....The best debaters in the Commons win folk over, cat calling is low grade.

The art of argument is to provide a stronger, more believeable alternative view....one that the recipient can buy in to or reconsider, his/her original view.....thats debate......calling folk out, just creates controvesy and folk dig their heels in even more.

Everyone values their own opinion, else they wouldn't write on here, before any of us call someone out, we might consider providing them with an  alternative view, not rubbish their first attempt on a point......The pen is mightier than the sword.

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1 minute ago, Laughable Chimp said:

Being called out on it is fine. But getting strawmanned constantly is annoying.

Someone says something negative and then someone else responds by misrepresenting their opinion as if it's a lot worse than it actually is.

The Dean Smith out discussions last season are a classic example. Most people who provided criticism on Dean Smith didn't want him out but they were tarred with the brush as if they did and were made to look ungrateful for not appreciating where he'd taken the club. Various posters had to repeatedly insist that that wasn't their position. 

Or take the Jacob Ramsey thread. Couple of guys in there are acting all high and mighty because Ramsey has finally come good despite some posters having written them off. Except most posters didn't write them off, a lot including myself were just expressing healthy skepticism about him considering his prior performances.

In fact, it seems like having any level of skepticism towards our youngsters gets labelled as writing them off. No one, I repeat no one was writing Carney off after one game 2 weeks ago. People were just again, claiming he didn't perform all that well I'm that game. Didn't stop some posters from acting like they did.

happens all the **** time on here on various topics.

 

 

facebook comments/twitter is exactly the same

though in this thread to be fair there have been a number people implying mings needs upgrading

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45 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said:

Being called out on it is fine. But getting strawmanned constantly is annoying.

Someone says something negative and then someone else responds by misrepresenting their opinion as if it's a lot worse and more extreme than it actually is.

The Dean Smith out discussions last season are a classic example. Most people who provided criticism on Dean Smith didn't want him out but they were tarred with the brush as if they did and were made to look ungrateful for not appreciating where he'd taken the club. Various posters had to repeatedly insist that that wasn't their position. 

Or take the Jacob Ramsey thread. Couple of guys in there are acting all high and mighty because Ramsey has finally come good despite some posters having written them off. Except most posters didn't write them off, a lot including myself were just expressing healthy skepticism about him considering his prior performances.

In fact, it seems like having any level of skepticism towards our youngsters gets labelled as writing them off. No one, I repeat no one was writing Carney off after one game 2 weeks ago. People were just again, claiming he didn't perform all that well I'm that game. Didn't stop some posters from acting like they did.

happens all the **** time on here on various topics.

 

 

I think you make some good points....but we are all different in terms of our emotional attachment.....some folk can't countenance anything derogatory said about the club/team, some can never be pleased, with anything....but most are somewhere in between.

This is a forum.... within reason, we should be grown up enough to be able to debate and share views, without throwing teddies.

some posters work hard to present their point, some just resort to juvenile taunts....We are all Villa fans, chances are some of what we say has merit.

Strawmanning is a convenient method of continuing to argue your own point, and not considering what has been said by the debater....how many posters, reiterate some of the points to indicate they understand the point but disagree and proceed to present their point.

sure, an agree to disagree position, maybe sought.....but a compromise is not as often reached....when in some cases its the more apt position.

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