Dean Smith

[TRO]

54 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

I think Chelsea was a pretty good performance v a very good side to be honest. It was better than Brighton which we won.

A good level to aim at.

I think hunger to win the ball back was there as well to be honest. Only moment we didn't was when Targett and Hourihane both became boneheads and watched Willian pick out his cross, that was very very poor. Wouldn't have happened with McGinn out there, he showed a bit of form which was a welcome return.

Interesting.....I didn't see much of that.

I saw a bit more against Newcastle and Man U

Edited December 6, 2019 by TRO

[Rightdm00]

13 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

True, but in it's all about winning games. If I wanna be entertained i'll go star city and see a rubbish film

Pretty much every interview Dean states that's his #1 goal. To win the game. I feel our GD shows that as well. There hasn't been a match all season where we didn't have chances to draw or even win. That the team hasn't taken them comes down to us being newly promoted, having to bed in over 11 new players, and just plain old errors which you have to live with giving the amount of youth/inexperience we have in our roster.  

Honestly I think some people forget that we shouldn't even be here right now. Getting out of the Champ required us to a break a club record that stood for almost a century.  If you go look at our early games this season you will see we are far better now at pretty much every facet of play. What Dean and his staff have accomplished so far is nothing short of amazing  I have faith with Dean that we will continue to improve.  Barring a severe injury crisis we will be safe come the end of the year and everyone here can agree that was the goal at the start of the season. 

 

[foreveryoung]

20 minutes ago, Rightdm00 said:

Pretty much every interview Dean states that's his #1 goal. To win the game. I feel our GD shows that as well. There hasn't been a match all season where we didn't have chances to draw or even win. That the team hasn't taken them comes down to us being newly promoted, having to bed in over 11 new players, and just plain old errors which you have to live with giving the amount of youth/inexperience we have in our roster.  

Honestly I think some people forget that we shouldn't even be here right now. Getting out of the Champ required us to a break a club record that stood for almost a century.  If you go look at our early games this season you will see we are far better now at pretty much every facet of play. What Dean and his staff have accomplished so far is nothing short of amazing  I have faith with Dean that we will continue to improve.  Barring a severe injury crisis we will be safe come the end of the year and everyone here can agree that was the goal at the start of the season. 

 

Again, claret and blue glasses off, how are people so sure we will still be in the premier league next year. We are in a relegation battle as we speak, with no real improvement since the start of the season.

I've asked before, will people still see us as work in progress if we end up getting relegated. I just believe some fans have patience with Smith because he is an all round nice guy, an he has Villa in his blood. Me I want a little bit more, I don't want him gone far from it, an admit he needs time, but he always seemed to inexperienced for the Premier League, he has yet to prove me wrong.

[sne]

Remember last season under Bruce when all this talk of formations was only a play with words that didn't really mean anything?

Now apparently 4-3-3 is the devil.

[TRO]

27 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

Again, claret and blue glasses off, how are people so sure we will still be in the premier league next year. We are in a relegation battle as we speak, with no real improvement since the start of the season.

I've asked before, will people still see us as work in progress if we end up getting relegated. I just believe some fans have patience with Smith because he is an all round nice guy, an he has Villa in his blood. Me I want a little bit more, I don't want him gone far from it, an admit he needs time, but he always seemed to inexperienced for the Premier League, he has yet to prove me wrong.

I am pretty well on par with all that.

I get the "where we have come from" points, but not sure it sits that comfortable with me, with some of the fundamental shortfalls I see.

I think there has been improvement in some things and others that are basics have not been improved ( in the air we are benevolent, just lack the belief to win a headed challenge)

I have a concern that the players who have gone off to international duty and have been linked with so called bigger clubs, their game has struggled.....Does Dean need to get tougher and a few home truths dished out...or is 4-3-3 too ambitious for our qualities?.....something isn't quite right.

I didn't think we would beat Chelsea, but I thought we was capable of a draw.....I was more concerned by the performance than the result.....too much poor play is being swept under the carpet as development and time related......some issues, yes, valid....others is a sheer excuse.

No one expected us to turnover top teams, but honestly think we have it in us to secure one or two......I think we have the technical ability to, not sure we have the belief to see it through.

This is the thing for me.....Our technical ability is much what it is and it is not going to change over night......The will and desire and ability to deny the opposition any quarter is our only hope.....Dean smith has to find a way to get them to stop standing off and get stuck in and let the opposition know they are in a game and they are going to be contested for every ball on the ground or in the air.....They need to stay in position so the player on the ball can find them for an outlet, instead of drifting all over the park ball watching, they have to trust each other to compete.

We have to up the ante in terms of applying ourselves, particularly away from home.....Home form is much better,perhaps its confidence from the crowd atmosphere.

 

 

Edited December 6, 2019 by TRO

[TRO]

1 hour ago, sne said:

Remember last season under Bruce when all this talk of formations was only a play with words that didn't really mean anything?

Now apparently 4-3-3 is the devil.

We are all searching for answers to why we are losing so many games and that's the beauty of debate.

No one is saying its the devil.....I am suggesting it may be too ambitious, particularly away form home, for the quality of our players....just speculating/suggesting as opposed to claiming.

It doesn't go amiss that all the top teams use it.....but all the top teams have more complete players....funny that isn't it?

We are the only team below Chelsea that play 4-3-3

Edited December 6, 2019 by TRO

[carewjust4u]

30 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

Again, claret and blue glasses off, how are people so sure we will still be in the premier league next year. We are in a relegation battle as we speak, with no real improvement since the start of the season.

I've asked before, will people still see us as work in progress if we end up getting relegated. I just believe some fans have patience with Smith because he is an all round nice guy, an he has Villa in his blood. Me I want a little bit more, I don't want him gone far from it, an admit he needs time, but he always seemed to inexperienced for the Premier League, he has yet to prove me wrong.

See how you feel after the seven very winnable games we have after the game vs the Foxes (Blades A , Liverpool U18s H, Southampton H, Norwich H, Watford A, Burnley A, Fulham A). 

[sne]

2 minutes ago, TRO said:

We are all searching for answers to why we are losing so many games and that's the beauty of debate.

No one is saying its the devil.....I am suggesting it may be too ambitious, particularly away form home, for the quality of our players....just speculating/suggesting as opposed to claiming.

It doesn't go amiss that all the top teams use it.....but all the top teams have more complete players....funny that isn't it?

There are a limited set of formations we have the personal to play. anything with a front 2 is not an options since we don't even have 1 good attacker.

Our wide options are limited with Grealish being the stand out player by far and excelling in his current position wide left in a front 3 or whatever one labels it. El Ghazi when fit does well but both him and Trez are a bit on and off.

The central midfield is not good enough to be played as a 2 so 4-4-2 is just not an option. It just isn't.

We can play around with the positioning of the midfielders and call a 4-3-3 a 4-1-2-3 by playing Nakamba deep or call it a 4-1-2-2-1 by playing a the wide players a bit deeper but it's basically the same thing.

And that's the formation our squad is most suited to.

We would be absolutely useless if we for example tried to play like Newcastle with a deep sitting back 5 in front of a deep central midfield and 2 pace wingers and a targetman. it's perfect for them thou as they have a settled defense and those type of players. 

Flawed as it might be this current formation/tactic is our best shot. with the squad we have. It needs tweaking and adjustments, and additions in January. But it suits our squad for the most part.

 

[TRO]

6 minutes ago, sne said:

There are a limited set of formations we have the personal to play. anything with a front 2 is not an options since we don't even have 1 good attacker.

Our wide options are limited with Grealish being the stand out player by far and excelling in his current position wide left in a front 3 or whatever one labels it. El Ghazi when fit does well but both him and Trez are a bit on and off.

The central midfield is not good enough to be played as a 2 so 4-4-2 is just not an option. It just isn't.

We can play around with the positioning of the midfielders and call a 4-3-3 a 4-1-2-3 by playing Nakamba deep or call it a 4-1-2-2-1 by playing a the wide players a bit deeper but it's basically the same thing.

And that's the formation our squad is most suited to.

We would be absolutely useless if we for example tried to play like Newcastle with a deep sitting back 5 in front of a deep central midfield and 2 pace wingers and a targetman. it's perfect for them thou as they have a settled defense and those type of players. 

Flawed as it might be this current formation/tactic is our best shot. with the squad we have. It needs tweaking and adjustments, and additions in January. But it suits our squad for the most part.

 

I agree.

and it still boils down to players, doing their bit.

I think its significant that we do lack certain types  to correct our openness, but I won't hold my breath that this window will fix that......IMO Nakamba and Luiz is not dominant enough to play the DM role on their own.....so they get lost in it all, just mucking in  and becoming just another midfielder, to put their foot in.

I have said some time ago that 2 wingers is leaving us sparse in the combat stakes as they are not players dedicated to tackling or competing for the ball or carrying it like Jack, which in itself is like defending, because it denies the opposition possession. ( as Cloughie once said, if they haven't got the ball they can't hurt you)  Jack actually helps with our defensive qualities, because he holds the ball, few others we have, can....it doesn't have to be superb ball winners, players who can carry the ball and keep possession are great for our defensive qualities.

2 wingers give the ball away too much and too easily....and added to few lightweight midfielders it spells trouble.

[sne]

I honestly think Nakamba is fine in the DCM role.

For the most part we are not facing a lot of aerial challenges in midfield as the ball is passed around on the floor or crossed from flank to flank the need for a tall bulky DCM is something I don't see. Much rather have mobility than bulk.

I don't see us getting Sander Berge in January so whatever funds we have should be put towards a new attacker (and possibly a winger if Dean has his heart set on Benrahma)

More worrying that our CB's surprisingly including Mings are poor in the air.

[TRO]

24 minutes ago, sne said:

I honestly think Nakamba is fine in the DCM role.

For the most part we are not facing a lot of aerial challenges in midfield as the ball is passed around on the floor or crossed from flank to flank the need for a tall bulky DCM is something I don't see. Much rather have mobility than bulk.

I don't see us getting Sander Berge in January so whatever funds we have should be put towards a new attacker (and possibly a winger if Dean has his heart set on Benrahma)

More worrying that our CB's surprisingly including Mings are poor in the air.

Interesting

I thought he had a poor game the other night, spent much time drifting out of the centre and play going past him too easily.

I disagree, some teams do launch it and the central defenders need protection.....also headers down the by line from throw in's we lose out too much and lose ground/territory,...>gaps open up.

winning headers gives a statement of intent, it helps to secure game initiative and promotes physical combat....it helps to start gaining control.

I remember in the past so many goals coming from headed flick ons from our centre forwards and players running on to the ball.....sure times have changed.....but Carroll did one the other night and Shelvey scored from it.......Headers and heading ability, can give so much advantage in a game.

I agree Mings is struggling.....I would have Hause waiting in the wings ready to pounce, I think he is the best player in the air at our club.....not to replace Mings but maybe go 3-5-2....

Heaton

Englels-Mings-Hause

Elmo/Guilbert-MGinn- Luiz- Grealish-Target

El Ghazi- Wes

I don't think Dean is an in the air man.....so I am wasting my time.....but if you check back, we have conceded so may goals from headed challenges, its frightening.......funny how Burnley always crowd the far post to bully opponents, and  the other night Man City put 4 players there to crowd them out, I thought good thinking, just a bit of nous makes all the difference.

Edited December 6, 2019 by TRO

[TRO]

53 minutes ago, carewjust4u said:

See how you feel after the seven very winnable games we have after the game vs the Foxes (Blades A , Liverpool U18s H, Southampton H, Norwich H, Watford A, Burnley A, Fulham A). 

Well, you have more faith than me playing Sheff Utd away.....but I do get your drift.....it will be interesting.

[sne]

Only saw half the Chelsea game so can't really say, but on the whole I think Nakamba has been fine considering. 

Not sure if he's been dropped, tired our carrying some minor injury after the international break but I'd have him in the team most games.

[MarkLillis]

Games are won by good players....but of course you need a good manager.

I think we have a more than generous amount of good players in our squad.

Dean is a good manager.

Therefore I am confident we will be ok

[TRO]

5 minutes ago, sne said:

Only saw half the Chelsea game so can't really say, but on the whole I think Nakamba has been fine considering. 

Not sure if he's been dropped, tired our carrying some minor injury after the international break but I'd have him in the team most games.

I have equally liked him.....that's the problem they all have good games then poor games.....consistency is bound to be an issue, now that is a legitimate issue going up.

[tinker]

We're not the finished article, it's a work in progress. We was always going to be in a relegation battle and we all knew that.......

Against Chelsea and Manure we have performed as well as I have seen since MON  and we was then an established top 6 team. Against our relegation rivals we have played well ,in fact very well and that is where our faith is coming from .

It's easy as fans ,( and entertaining) to see our mistakes made in games , individual and as team, but they don't define our season. 

Spot the issues , comment on here, discuss  then move on. UTV 

[TRO]

1 minute ago, MarkLillis said:

Games are won by good players....but of course you need a good manager.

I think we have a more than generous amount of good players in our squad.

Dean is a good manager.

Therefore I am confident we will be ok

Bravo.

but good players can mean a lot of things.....some players are good at some things but not at others.

Conor Hourihane is a point in question of why he divides so many opinions.

I agree with you in principle, but if only it was that simple.

[sne]

Going forward if we are to realistically challenge for the spots outside the top 6 or so I honestly think only Grealish is good enough to be a starter currently. Heaton as well obviously.

Mings needs to be smarter and cut out the silly stuff, McGinn needs to pace himself better and also be smarter but if they do so will also be fine.

Nakamba might also grow into it as may some others as they are young-ish but it's very much a work in progress squad with potential but issues.

For me we are pretty much performing as expected all things considered. Newly promoted squad thrown together during a short summer with a inexperienced manager up against more settled often much better sides.

Not sure what people were expecting.

[Rightdm00]

1 hour ago, foreveryoung said:

Again, claret and blue glasses off, how are people so sure we will still be in the premier league next year. We are in a relegation battle as we speak, with no real improvement since the start of the season.

I've asked before, will people still see us as work in progress if we end up getting relegated. I just believe some fans have patience with Smith because he is an all round nice guy, an he has Villa in his blood. Me I want a little bit more, I don't want him gone far from it, an admit he needs time, but he always seemed to inexperienced for the Premier League, he has yet to prove me wrong.

If you can't see improvement from the Everton win to the Newcastle win then that's just baffling.  I went back and watched the Everton game.  They bossed us for almost the entire game but we pulled off a win thanks to a couple moments of quality.  Compare that to Newcastle where we dominated and Newcastle had maybe 2 chances all game.  That's improvement.  Another example. First game of the season versus Spurs. We nick a goal and try to hang on for dear life. Compare that to United where we goto Old Trafford and are the better side for the entire first half. Once again that's improvement. Yes everybody wants to see the finished article but the Prem season doesn't end til May. The team and Dean deserve time to improve. 

 

So I guess I find it hard to understand fans who felt this season was going to be anything other than a struggle. Bournemouth came up as champions under Eddie Howe (no prior prem experience) and finished 16th his first year. Next year they finished 9th and Howe won LMA manager of the year. Now Bournemouth has struggled recently due to some very poor transfer decisions but who here wouldn't take that 2 year window right now.  We have no divine right to Top 6 hell we don't even have a right to be in the Prem. It's going to be a dog fight but one I think Dean can surely see us through.

This isn't blind Faith by any means. The eye test tells me we are a solid lower half prem team but almost every modern analytical stat bears that out as well. XPts which is based off of xG and xGa says we should be 15th. Also, only one team in the last ten years has ever been relegated with a GD better than -20.  Hull City went down with -18 in 14-15.  They only won 8 times all season and didn't get their 4th win til week 24. Fun fact Steve Bruce pulled a MON that season and quit a whole 2 weeks before kickoff.  He deserved the cabbage.  Our one true weakness right now is depth. So barring a bad injury crisis I feel confident in saying we survive this season. 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

I think it's obvious we lack squad depth.

People underestimate us even being without one or two players changes our whole dynamic and drops our levels massively.

Engels, Guibert, and El Ghazi make a huge difference.

As others have stated we are a work in progress.

We need better back up players than the likes of Taylor, and Elmo.