Dean Smith

[trom_borg]

23 minutes ago, Pimlico_Villa said:

I can understand the success of last season fuelling the optimism for this one, but we’re pretty much playing a different game this year. The PL punishes inconsistency and technical incompetence severely, this isn’t a league where you can get by on heart. 

This is why I don’t share the optimism. For all the talk of great support and getting behind the team, that counts for nothing. We lack quality, composure, fitness, pace and tactical nouse. Beneath our starting XI we have players that have no right being anywhere near the PL and Elmo coming on on Sunday epitomises this perfectly. 

All round, Smith and these players are just too green. He said on Sunday “...to close games out by going to get the next one”, in which he is referring to goals. That to me shows he doesn’t understand the PL. To close out games in this league you don’t need to score another 5, you have to be intelligent in possession and manage the game. It’s an honourable approach, but not for the PL.

For every positive development we make, this inexperience and lack of quality means we’ll get an Arsenal-like situation. 

Unless Smith gets up the curve quickly and we supplement the team with proper quality and pace in January, then I just don’t see the optimism. 

Couldn't disagree more. I think mentality and belief will play a huge part in where we end up this season. Not only for the team and manager, but the whole club. 

For periods this season we have looked like a a team getting relegated. For other periods we have looked like a team pushing for mid table. We don't know were the penny will drop yet but Smith and his team has earned our patience and belief that we'll tilt towards the latter. Statements like Smith doesn't understand the PL or some of our players have no right being anywhere near the PL is hyperbole and can only be derived from our worst spells of this young season. 

 

[hippo]

• He's a villa fan
• He's a decent bloke
• He gave us a truly memorable day at Wembley last May
• He took us from 13th in March - to the premier league.
• He has plenty of credit left from me.

Edited September 24, 2019 by hippo

[villalad21]

48 minutes ago, hippo said:

• He's a villa fan
• He's a decent bloke
• He gave us a truly memorable day at Wembley last May
• He took us from 13th in March - to the premier league.
• He has plenty of credit left from me.

That's all true, but if we are bottom 3 by christmas and there is no signs of improvement our owners won't give a s*** in any of that.

[tinker]

13 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

That's all true, but if we are bottom 3 by christmas and there is no signs of improvement our owners won't give a s*** in any of that.

He's a year in front of the plan, the owners are more sensible than to sack a manager who's performed minor miracles . 

[villalad21]

3 minutes ago, tinker said:

He's a year in front of the plan, the owners are more sensible than to sack a manager who's performed minor miracles . 

Then you have a poor understanding of modern football.

Our owners aren't special snowflakes to everyone else. Reality is it's a result industry and there is no way Smith is immune to the sack this year.

That being said i hope it works out for him and it won't ever come to that.

[useless]

If we were to get relegated we'd suddenly be a year behind the plan, as the plan was to get promoted this season and therefore be in the Premier league next season. Have no doubt about it if the owners at any stage feel that leaving Smith in charge will result in us getting relegated then they won't hesitate to make a change.

[villalad21]

Exactly right. People on here have this romantic idea that he will be our Ferguson and stay here for 20+ years.

Get real people. The chance of that happening is below 1 % if you look at managerial stats the past 15 years. The average time managers get these days is 2-3 years at most. Anything longer is an exception to the rule.

I'm not Dean Smith out by the way, not by any means. But nor do i have the mindset that DS should be immune to the sack if he is underperforming.

Let's see where we are in 3-4 months time.

 

[useless]

If it ever came to the point where the owners were seriously thinking about making a change then in that hypothetical scenario we will have obviously performed very badly and would be in serious peril of losing our premier league status, so most Villa fans would probably reluctantly agree that it's time for a change anyway. It's not at that stage yet, or anywhere near, with a bit more believe and some luck which everyone needs I'm sure we can climb up the table.

[MotoMkali]

For all his talk of positive play after the first 10-15minutes of the first half we were incredibly negative. After they scored we played attacking football until we scored and then we sat back again.

I think there are 3 reasons for our loss: 1st our fitness is not up to scratch mcginn has no legs by about 70 minutes and should be taken off every game at that point. Bring on hourihane or lansbury and get someone who can close down and be aggressive for the last 20 minutes on the pitch.

2nd substitutions have been poor. Taking off el ghazi was a bad decision leaving us without a direct winger whilst we were chasing.

3rd they had a player who was dominating the game and we let him walk all over us. We should have brought hourihane on and had him man Mark guendouzi. Even if he isn't spectacular defensively he can put a shift in and we still would have had an extra man on the pitch. 

AND BONUS 4TH POINT is our players are at the same time far too confident and unsure of themselves. Our players have made stupid mistakes through lapses in judgement because they over estimated their ability I.e mings' header luiz's **** up in the Bournemouth game. But at the same time when we are in good positions the only players who really look to do anything are mcginn and our wingers. Jack, Wesley and anyone else who is up their needs to be more aggressive with the ball at their feet. 

[markavfc40]

53 minutes ago, useless said:

If we were to get relegated we'd suddenly be a year behind the plan, as the plan was to get promoted this season and therefore be in the Premier league next season. Have no doubt about it if the owners at any stage feel that leaving Smith in charge will result in us getting relegated then they won't hesitate to make a change.

We'd be in a far better position though than had we have not come up last season.

The average age of the squad would be much lower and even with the expected loss of some players we'd have the foundations of a squad rather than the total rebuild we would have had to still undertake had we have been a championship club this season. We'd also have the parachute payments.

I think this season would need to be a total disaster for Smith to get the sack so that to me would mean going down with a whimper as we did in 2016.

Based on what I have seen so far this season we are going to make a very good fist of staying up. We have held our own in every game we have played and given the level of some of the opposition that is some going. Had it not been for some very poor officiating we would have been a couple of points better off. I can't ignore the fact though that we have had some very poor spells in games and many of the goals we have conceded could have been avoided had we have shown a bit more nous.

We aren't far way though for me and the biggest issue is maintaining intensity in games and playing for 90 minutes and stopping the tendency to have spells of getting deeper and deeper and not pressing. I believe it will come. I just hope as a fan base the magnificent support so far this season is maintained and we keep faith in these players and coaching staff. We are 6 games in with a new squad and it was always going to take time to come together completely so let's allow that time.

Edited September 24, 2019 by markavfc40

[Stuartc445]

21 hours ago, WakefieldVillan said:

Any talk what so ever of sacking Smith is absolutely mind blowing, it really is, thankfully I think our owners aren't that stupid. 

We all knew that this season was going to be tough and I think even the most ardent supporter would have taken a 17th place finish come the end of the season, so I really don't get all the dejection after what, six games?! 

Unless we lose 10 on the spin and he completely loses the dressing room would I then contemplate sacking him, but that is not going to happen, we are competing, we have been in contention in each game and there are positives to take for sure.

Don't get me wrong, he has made mistakes (I'm sure he's aware of this), he's not flawless, but who is? Klopp? Guardiola? Let's bring one of them in shall we.

End of the day, he's one of our own, he is a positive person, he talks a good game, he won us promotion with a 10 game winning streak and one of the main reasons we got promoted last season was due to the players, management and fans all being together and the only way we will stay in this league and progress is for us fans to get behind them again - (to be fair, at the games we are doing that and it is a pleasure to see, long may it continue).

I have only seen highlights of the Arsenal game (couldn't find a decent stream) and it seems the biggest issue amongst fans was with us sitting back and inviting pressure - However listening to his post-match analysis it seemed that this wasn't the HT instruction, therefore I think the players have to take responsibility there as much as Smith. I think the players do need to believe in themselves a little more. Another blame was laid to the lack of substitutions which I get totally, it sounded very much like the players were absolutely knackered after 60 mins, I think this is definitely something that the head coach needs to look at, freshening things up sooner - I am sure he is regretting this now but hindsight is a wonderful thing. 

With a bit of luck (we have had less than most this season) a bit more guile (when we are winning, seeing out games) and a bit more doggedness (see Sheff Utd) we would be sat on about 9-10 points - I think it's been a frustrating start to the season but not a disastrous one.

Some BIG home games coming up where I feel we will get some positive results 

 

 

 

I think it's more a case of people reacting to the Arsenal game rather than the 6 games. I felt absolutely devistated leaving the ground on Sunday, it took a long time to think clearly and remember the feeling the last time we left the arsenal stadium.

It was Smiths subs that caused it imo, I still want him as our manager and I'm a long way from even thinking about wanting him out. 

[screwdriver]

2 hours ago, hippo said:

• He's a villa fan
• He's a decent bloke
• He gave us a truly memorable day at Wembley last May
• He took us from 13th in March - to the premier league.
• He has plenty of credit left from me.

a)atrocious subs - subs killed any momentum Villa have against spurs, palace and arsenal

b) tactically poor - always the same set up 4-3-3 doesn't know when to tweak. no retaliation when opposition flex their formation. FACT!!! we will have our botty cheeks partied dry at the ehihad!

c) indecisive - woulda shoulda coulda make a sub????    got away with it against everton when 2nd half it was backs to the wall. got punished against spurs and arsenal

d) lunatics running the asylum! - he said gazi and mings sorted out their little tiff themselves. he should of left them both in no doubt who was in charge by having a press confrerence like bowyer and dyer.

e) questionable purchases in the transfer market - lambert-esque foreign gambles with a couple of brentford boys thrown in. Where are the marquee signings with prem experience? Who's going to score the goals to keep us up? midfielders?

f) bottle job changes - always winger for winger subs. never mixes it up nothing to make an impact. can't spot a tired player.

H)doesn't know how to integrate connor hourihane, the most dangerous weapon we have when it comes to set piece delivery. (either this or he doesn't think he's fast enough for prem) FACT!!! GARETH BARRY played 600 prem games despite having as much pace as a hyudai getz! in the kick and rush era of the prem.

 

Yeah but he's a decent bloke and a Villa fan so lets go down and do it all again. was so nice against rotherham wasn't it. %&*$£"%^&*&'s!!!!!!!!!

[terrytini]

Blimey I thought I’d avoid for a couple of days. Seems a few months would be better.

Ludicrous debate,

[Kiwivillan]

1 hour ago, terrytini said:

Blimey I thought I’d avoid for a couple of days. Seems a few months would be better.

Ludicrous debate,

Agreed. I've been disappointed with some of his decisions but the Arsenal game not so much. We got sucker punched with multiple bad decisions and players failed to follow his instructions. The last bit is on him but there's only so much you can do from the sidelines. It's the same in my 5 a side. This excuse I keep hearing of mids being gassed and needing subbing is doing my head in. Why are they struggling unlike every other team?

Edited September 24, 2019 by Kiwivillan

[PieFacE]

I genuinely think the only way Smith will get sacked is if we are cut adrift by Christmas, can't see that happening though. 

I think we will be okay, just need to wise up a bit and believe in our own ability.

[WakefieldVillan]

56 minutes ago, screwdriver said:

a)atrocious subs - subs killed any momentum Villa have against spurs, palace and arsenal.

Could easily argue that the sending off killed us at Palace, and his substitutions actually improved us and it was the referee that basically cost us a point (with the equalizer being from one of Smith's substitutes), I think regardless of who entered the field at Spurs we were beaten in the end by a better team, though the subs, in particular Jota was below par. I think he should have changed things earlier against Arsenal.

b) tactically poor - always the same set up 4-3-3 doesn't know when to tweak. no retaliation when opposition flex their formation. FACT!!! we will have our botty cheeks partied dry at the ehihad!

Many teams will get destroyed at Man City if they play like they did on Saturday, a la Watford. We wont be judged on games against them. I think being new to the premier league Smith is trying to keep a settled formation which for me is better than changing formation week in week out which would be a disaster. I am sure the coaching staff are looking at different formations in training.

c) indecisive - woulda shoulda coulda make a sub????    got away with it against everton when 2nd half it was backs to the wall. got punished against spurs and arsenal.

I wouldn't say he "got away with it" against Everton, he shored things up by taking a tiring Jota off and he brought on El Ghazi who killed the game off in fine style. Unfortunately, not sure if you are aware but there are some strong teams in this league, regardless at times of subs we may just lose because we aren't quite up to it.

d) lunatics running the asylum! - he said gazi and mings sorted out their little tiff themselves. he should of left them both in no doubt who was in charge by having a press confrerence like bowyer and dyer.

No sure if you're being serious here but he handled it perfectly IMO. We don't know what was said in the dressing room, but what was said should be sorted in the dressing room and stay there. I would be surprised to see this happen again under Smith's management.

e) questionable purchases in the transfer market - lambert-esque foreign gambles with a couple of brentford boys thrown in. Where are the marquee signings with prem experience? Who's going to score the goals to keep us up? midfielders?

So your basically writing off all his signings after 6 games? I think more are looking like hits rather than misses right now, regardless of our points tally. I have been impressed with Engels, Guilbert, Nakamba, Mings, Heaton thus far, Luiz and Wesley I think will come good with a bit of patience , Targett has been injured so hard to judge, Konsa is one for the future and Jota is a definite upgrade on Gardner. We have reduced the age of the squad and will be better for it next season regardless of which division we are in.

f) bottle job changes - always winger for winger subs. never mixes it up nothing to make an impact. can't spot a tired player.

I think it's the wingers that are not quite performing at the level required so usually seem the obvious choice to swap, plus I would argue that wingers in general are likely to be swapped more than most positions (not got a stat to back it up but it wouldn't surprise me). I do feel when the likes of SJM or Jack get tired he should maybe look to his bench a little quicker - but then again, if he takes one of them two off in a game we are winning and we were to drop points, he would be crucified.

H)doesn't know how to integrate connor hourihane, the most dangerous weapon we have when it comes to set piece delivery. (either this or he doesn't think he's fast enough for prem) FACT!!! GARETH BARRY played 600 prem games despite having as much pace as a hyudai getz! in the kick and rush era of the prem.

The same Conor that has had plenty of supporters saying he goes anonymous in games and ain't good enough at this level ETC. The unfortunate thing for Conor is that CM is probably where we have most options so it is really up to him to make the position his own, that said I am sure he his pushing in training and will get his chance soon enough. We do miss his set play's and I am sure Smith is aware of this. 

Yeah but he's a decent bloke and a Villa fan so lets go down and do it all again. was so nice against rotherham wasn't it. %&*$£"%^&*&'s!!!!!!!!! 

No sane Villa fan wants us to go down this season or any season - we belong in the top flight, but we have to earn it like everybody else.

 

One last thing, no one is saying Smith should be void of criticism just because he is "one of us", far from it, but I think so far he has earned our respect and patience whilst he is in the hot seat!

Not sure if you are on the wind up but I have responded nevertheless. UTV

 

 

[Kiwivillan]

1 hour ago, screwdriver said:

a)atrocious subs - subs killed any momentum Villa have against spurs, palace and arsenal

b) tactically poor - always the same set up 4-3-3 doesn't know when to tweak. no retaliation when opposition flex their formation. FACT!!! we will have our botty cheeks partied dry at the ehihad!

c) indecisive - woulda shoulda coulda make a sub????    got away with it against everton when 2nd half it was backs to the wall. got punished against spurs and arsenal

d) lunatics running the asylum! - he said gazi and mings sorted out their little tiff themselves. he should of left them both in no doubt who was in charge by having a press confrerence like bowyer and dyer.

e) questionable purchases in the transfer market - lambert-esque foreign gambles with a couple of brentford boys thrown in. Where are the marquee signings with prem experience? Who's going to score the goals to keep us up? midfielders?

f) bottle job changes - always winger for winger subs. never mixes it up nothing to make an impact. can't spot a tired player.

H)doesn't know how to integrate connor hourihane, the most dangerous weapon we have when it comes to set piece delivery. (either this or he doesn't think he's fast enough for prem) FACT!!! GARETH BARRY played 600 prem games despite having as much pace as a hyudai getz! in the kick and rush era of the prem.

 

Yeah but he's a decent bloke and a Villa fan so lets go down and do it all again. was so nice against rotherham wasn't it. %&*$£"%^&*&'s!!!!!!!!!

I agreed with you 100% about Bruce but I think you've lost your mind on this one. Especially Hourihane. Every one to a man had him out of their 11 early on and rightfully so. He's never a DM, he's not a water carrier and who do you drop out of Grealish and McGinn? I wrote off Lansbury but since I've seen him back I'd throw him on as a sub instead. How many free kick opportunities have we had that we can suffer Hourihane in a DM role?

Edited September 24, 2019 by Kiwivillan

[romavillan]

4 hours ago, villalad21 said:

That's all true, but if we are bottom 3 by christmas and there is no signs of improvement our owners won't give a s*** in any of that.

No way they'd sack him at xmas

[KentVillan]

4 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Then you have a poor understanding of modern football.

Our owners aren't special snowflakes to everyone else. Reality is it's a result industry and there is no way Smith is immune to the sack this year.

That being said i hope it works out for him and it won't ever come to that.

It's not about being snowflakes. "Football is a results industry" is one of those worldly-wise, weather-worn, look-to-the-camera insights  that is said by people who really do have a poor understanding of modern football.

It's how you end up panic sacking mid-season and hiring a "results manager" who papers over the cracks and destroys any semblance of a long term plan.

I recommend you watch some of the interviews with Christian Purslow. He's ruthless, but he won't sack Dean Smith for losing a few games before Christmas.

[Dr_Pangloss]

1 hour ago, PieFacE said:

I genuinely think the only way Smith will get sacked is if we are cut adrift by Christmas, can't see that happening though. 

I think we will be okay, just need to wise up a bit and believe in our own ability.

Yes this is the only circumstance where he'd be sacked IMO. Even if we're in the bottom three in December as long as we're not cut adrift you'd be inclined to stick with him and financially back him in January.