Spoony Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Really looking forward to yet another rebuild and another preseason etc etc etc repeat until dead. Yay, Villa. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bannedfromHandV Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 13 minutes ago, Shropshire Lad said: That’s all fine, I don’t particularly disagree with that. I believe the comparison was purely between two sides who both missed out on promotion last season, with ambition to challenge for that again and both having new managers this season (one with more experience, the other that’s had more time with his players). It’s not a perfect comparison, but these things rarely are. The board over the last two years gambled and it didn’t work. The board this season seem to be of a more considered approach and accepting of the reality we’re in (although there are some things that have contradicted that, so not completely convinced on that myself). As you say, there are going to be cutbacks and they’ve seemingly employed someone who has been able to operate on a budget previously. Ignoring comparisons to particular clubs, if the season started when Smith took over, we’d be 11th, 7 points off a play off position and I believe 10 points off automatic promotion (as best as I can make out). All things considered, I would say that’s maybe a bit below average. I had my reservations before he was appointed (they can be found in the relevant thread) and I still have reservations now. But as with the previous manager, I’m trying to allow him a bit of time to show he can correct things. Agreed, and I'm not advocating sacking him right now, he deserves until the end of the season for sure but if we continue at this rate then I think he'd have to go, I mean imbalanced squad or otherwise, we should be doing better than we are. I'm just personally quite disappointed in how it's panned out to date, and it could be that we're building toward something really good but it doesn't feel like that at the moment. I don't think I helped myself in getting so carried away with the early results and performances and in all honesty, that's probably compounded my misery 10 fold. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KHV Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 5 hours ago, Zatman said: Derby arent playing well which is the point. In similar form to us at the moment. 9 wins in 22, we have 7 in 22 Derby fans arent calling for Lampards head or moaning about his lack of promotion experience That's because they were relegated 11 years ago. They are used to championship mediocrity now. I'm sure we will all be calmer in 2027 being in this division. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted February 21, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 21, 2019 34 minutes ago, bannedfromHandV said: Agreed, and I'm not advocating sacking him right now, he deserves until the end of the season for sure but if we continue at this rate then I think he'd have to go, I mean imbalanced squad or otherwise, we should be doing better than we are. I'm just personally quite disappointed in how it's panned out to date, and it could be that we're building toward something really good but it doesn't feel like that at the moment. I don't think I helped myself in getting so carried away with the early results and performances and in all honesty, that's probably compounded my misery 10 fold. No I know you’re not itching to see him dismissed. I’m disappointed but I’m not quite as down because the earlier wins and performances, while impressive, still left me wondering. If Derby had been a bit more clinical, if small heath hadn’t hit the post...but you can do that with lots of things. Basically I saw the improvements, but there were a few nagging “what ifs” that kept me relatively grounded. Ok, during that good run in the promotion thread I regularly said that we should be aiming for automatic promotion (aim for it, not expect it). But to me that’s basically saying we should be looking to try and win every game, which for the most part, I think we should and I hope that Smith still thinks that or if he doesn’t, he recovers that sentiment soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAMAICAN-VILLAN Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 On 20/02/2019 at 19:32, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said: If only Man City knew that when Pep told them he needed new fullbacks for 10's of millions to start his transformation. It is as if we are totally ignoring that the abilities of actual players might affect their ability to integrate into systems or play a certain way. What dafuq? If he failed to get Newport County playing like Barcelona would it be him who isn;t good enough? This is nothing mew for a a manager to say or do. OK, so Pep Guardiola’s first 10 matches with Man C were 10 straight wins and despite a wobble mid-season, he ended up with a 59% win ratio and finished a not too shabby 3rd in the league. I don’t recall him ever saying he knew how he wanted his team to play but couldn’t get them to do so. In calling to strengthen his squad he was speaking from a position of relative strength and saying to the board if you want this squad really to achieve your exceptionally high ambitions, here’s how you need to improve it. This is very different from making the sort of excuses for poor performance that are being discussed here so I really can’t see how your analogy has any relevance. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 26 minutes ago, briny_ear said: OK, so Pep Guardiola’s first 10 matches with Man C were 10 straight wins and despite a wobble mid-season, he ended up with a 59% win ratio and finished a not too shabby 3rd in the league. I don’t recall him ever saying he knew how he wanted his team to play but couldn’t get them to do so. In calling to strengthen his squad he was speaking from a position of relative strength and saying to the board if you want this squad really to achieve your exceptionally high ambitions, here’s how you need to improve it. This is very different from making the sort of excuses for poor performance that are being discussed here so I really can’t see how your analogy has any relevance. Pep Guardiola with one of most expensive teams ever failed in his first year season. 3rd is not acceptable Its like Steve Bruce with possibly the most expensive Championship team ever finished 4th 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Zatman said: Pep Guardiola with one of most expensive teams ever failed in his first year season. 3rd is not acceptable Its like Steve Bruce with possibly the most expensive Championship team ever finished 4th Yes, glad we sorted that one and are doing so much better under the new man... He’s really got his squad playing how he wants, I believe . Ah. Edited February 22, 2019 by briny_ear 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 1 minute ago, briny_ear said: Yes, glad we sorted that one and are doing so much better under the new man... He’s really got his squad playing how he wants, I believe . Ah. Eh i know you are Bruce loyalist but he left Villa in this shit. Nyland in goal, jedinak centreback, elmo in the squad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 Just now, Zatman said: Eh i know you are Bruce loyalist but he left Villa in this shit. Nyland in goal, jedinak centreback, elmo in the squad Grest analysis there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 1 minute ago, briny_ear said: Grest analysis there. Well you defend him better than our defenders can defend 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TB Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 31 minutes ago, Zatman said: Well you defend him better than our defenders can defend Which isn't saying a lot this season, really. I wish I had the wit to twist the phrase 'damning with faint praise' to suit the occasion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincenzo Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 Saw an interview with Pep where he said he was successful because he has worked with great players...is so true. What a humble guy though...Class Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romavillan Posted February 22, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 22, 2019 7 hours ago, briny_ear said: Yes, glad we sorted that one and are doing so much better under the new man... He’s really got his squad playing how he wants, I believe . Ah. Let's wait till he has got his squad before we pass judgement on that shall we? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashingqwerty Posted February 22, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 22, 2019 22 hours ago, briny_ear said: We weren’t mid-table last season though, we finished 4th and were 90 minutes and 1 goal away from the premier league. So, ignore all the talk about what happened in tne early 80s, we have fallen back significantly on where we were just 12 months ago. In my view the reasons for this have little to do with the unrealistic expectations of fans - wanting the club to be better than mid table Championship standard is hardly outrageous. It has to do with the chaotic actions of our last owner and the failure of our managers this season. Those are the issues we need to see addressed. Just forget about the players we lost, the awful state of our finances and nearly falling into administration then shall we? This club is fortunate to still be in existance let alone being promoted. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 15 hours ago, Spoony said: Really looking forward to yet another rebuild and another preseason etc etc etc repeat until dead. Yay, Villa. Well the only way of getting out of that is to stick by someone for a change or find our White Knight every season or two, there is more chance of the first happening as the latter we've been trying it for decades.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) On 21/02/2019 at 10:09, briny_ear said: We weren’t mid-table last season though, we finished 4th and were 90 minutes and 1 goal away from the premier league. So, ignore all the talk about what happened in tne early 80s, we have fallen back significantly on where we were just 12 months ago. In my view the reasons for this have little to do with the unrealistic expectations of fans - wanting the club to be better than mid table Championship standard is hardly outrageous. It has to do with the chaotic actions of our last owner and the failure of our managers this season. Those are the issues we need to see addressed. Amnesia by any chance??? Nearly got swallowed up into the world of administration. Had players leave us because we couldn't afford them any longer. Snoddy, Terry, Grabban and more were just a few of the cogs that caused the clock to halt to a standstill. Rocked with DRAMA left right and center Uncertainty on whether Grealish was staying another season. Spurs wouldn't p!$$ off and leave us alone. Dismissals from the top down especially those who were taking the piss (wyness) and co all to have court action hanging over us and the uncertainty of it. Tony xia basically spent his whole fortune in a very stupid and irresponsible way. Kept signing total wastes all to get promotion which failed, clubs seen us coming from a mile. Bruce left us with a massive hole in our defence. We went through a massive change from the top down, well the down is happening in the summer ( bye over rated players). The cabbage market worth more AstonVilla itself but fortunate two very wealthy billionaires enjoy eating there greens. It took two seconds to throw a cabbage at bruce, it took even longer to throw all that crap away, a whole season pretty much!!! Edited February 22, 2019 by Dave-R 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippo Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 12 minutes ago, Dave-R said: Well the only way of getting out of that is to stick by someone for a change or find our White Knight every season or two, there is more chance of the first happening as the latter we've been trying it for decades.. Whether you rate Smith or not I disagree with the above. We are where we are IMO because we have employed poor managers. I can't really think of one who has been sacked to early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVTuco Posted February 22, 2019 VT Supporter Share Posted February 22, 2019 15 hours ago, Spoony said: Really looking forward to yet another rebuild and another preseason etc etc etc repeat until dead. Yay, Villa. I'm afraid I agree with you. It doesn't matter to me what players we bring in. Only when they win games will I get excited. I've been let down too many times now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-R Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 (edited) 24 minutes ago, hippo said: Whether you rate Smith or not I disagree with the above. We are where we are IMO because we have employed poor managers. I can't really think of one who has been sacked to early. But we will never know will we and why because of our impatient attitude compared to the rest if the clubs out there. For all we know any one of those managers at any point given extra time could of completely turned it around. It's that exact thinking and more of the same that is leaving us in the world of deja vu or ground hogs day. About time that we changed and changed towards who ever is in charge. I mean Smith has hardly been in, he's had a string of wins and a string of draws and already you have this stupid talk of sacking him by some, for what he's not been losing games really. Again if we are to dig ourselves away from what is a bad habbit of sacking managers way to early, we might actually find we end up getting somewhere. But some of you will keep wanting a guy in charge for a season or two, change if he doesn't win all in hopes that we will be lucky enough to find a White Knight. While many of the premiere teams were keeping there managers and keeping a stable ship, we were becoming one step closer to our fall from the premiere. Look at Alex Ferguson, in his first season nearly got the sack from man Utd, yet they stayed with him and in the end won countless trophy and seasons. If we stay with someone we have more chance of being a stable ship, keep changing and I think we will be doomed to go down even further into lower leagues. What are our options: Smith rebuilds, his season is whatever it is, then let him add to his squad making it better the season after and refining our squad. go with the flow and be patient and eventually something happens. Or Smith rebuilds, season doesn't work out, vet rid, bring someone else in, go through another rebuild again and it's more of the same. Get rid now which in my eyes would be completely stupid considering many things which have been said much before, pull someone else in and let them have the rebuild which means it may or may not be worse than Smith's. The owners go after a legend in the business of promotion, which to point out we've tried before and ended up being cabbaged. I think as well that after Bruce got cabbaged that no high profile coach or manager will even look in our direction. We bought ourselves a world of hurt with that grocery attack and no one that good with such a reputation will come to our club and risk being ridiculed like that and who could blame them, it was a next level of disrespect really. So can you think of any other options we have because it's time I think that we change the past twenty years of doing more of the same, actually find someone to stick by for a change and try that route. Edited February 22, 2019 by Dave-R 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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