Dean Smith

[hippo]

1 hour ago, villalad21 said:

Smith has never been a winner though.

Look at Pep trying to field his strongest side or at least very strong sides in every competition meanwhile Smith treat the Cups like a development arena.

Playing Steer ahead of Martinez against Chelsea made very little sense to me. If anything it was a  decision out of sentiment rather than a will to win.

I know many on here don't care about them but I would absolutely love to win a league cup or an FA Cup.

Agree - but imo DS has strayed from the basics. Put your best 11 on the pitch.

We seem to be sprinkling the first 11 with fringe players and trying to protect our squad. We don't have a squad like peps. Pep has multiple choices of equal ability players - we don't.

[Swerbs]

Can see it now in December with a monstrous run of games and the players start to get tired. "But why weren't the kids and reserves involved more?!"

[Kiwivillan]

We need a Deano Out bingo card made from VT comments

[foreveryoung]

19 minutes ago, TRO said:

I am not sure what to think at the moment....but I want to see him get it right as opposed to thinking about sacking him.

After the United game, some of us was worried we would lose him to England, such is how fickle football can be....now we find even united are being questioned, with all their riches on the pitch....maybe we played them at the right time,who knows...but they too are missing the edge to win games.

I think there are good arguments on both sides of the debate and both are worth considering.

I like Dean and I like the environment he has created with us....but I have reservations too.....I also fear the line " be careful what you wish for"

I have for some time, had mixed feelings towards our team.....There are some really good moments in games, and some really questionable ones......I still see some of the really questionable ones linger and not get fixed and in my current mind, not likely to get fixed.

Dean is certainly trying hard to find a formula, to create some consistency and right now the losing of Jack and the replacements have not fixed the issue of keeping the ball.....I accept and I think most sensible fans do accept, it takes time.....but how long, can be a cop out, too.

I see other clubs make improvements and change much quicker, his old club have made huge strides and sure, the first season syndrome, is a valid reason for sceptism, but I would sooner risk that, than a last day draw to stay up like us.

We have made progress, there is no doubt about that, but there are still underlying issues, we can't just sweep under the carpet and ignore them.

I am sure, the club are making every effort to avoid the like of what happened on Saturday.

Dean is what he is, a thoroughly nice guy, who we all wish and hope he succeeds at Villa, and his persona is what it is.....is it deliberate enough to get the best out of the players, I am not sure......is it driving enough to get players super fit, I am again not sure.....Dean says he looks at performances before results, in the notion that good performances lead to good results, I get that....but for me it also throws up a doubt of the EDGE required to get results, is that overlooked? (with that focus).....Wolves never performed better than us, but they had the edge to find the result.

I am a results first man and performances second, but accept you need both.....you can win ugly, and I would sooner do that than lose allegedly playing well( game management can be dull, but needs must)....I think when you go for performances first, you miss a trick of what the game is all about, its not all about kippers and curtains or flashy reverse passes or the equivalent of the Harlem Globetrotters displays( as much as we all love that).....its about winning and all the ingredients that requires.....Wolves showed on Saturday that siege mentality, that trumped our better performance.

I would like to see Dean Develop an edge, like I see in Klopp, Tuchel or Guardiola.

Its all well and good us naming his potential replacements, but many of them don't have the edge either....Deans view of performances, I have no cottter with, but without results they are just cosmetic.

We need to find that hard edge, the hard to beat tag, the you know you have been in a game, syndrome.

right now, how would I sum my Villa up.......Too easy to play against.

Dean needs to find a way to change that.....I think his mate at Brentford has, so far.

 

Tro, I am always about on your level, a bit of realism, instead of being happy he is good for Villa and losing now and again is just the way it goes. I fear how Smith plays now, without edge is the philosophy of Villa. We may progress, but if we are expecting a more raw edged ruthless team, unfortunately I doubt that change will ever come under Smith, as it's just not in his nature to coach this way.

If Smith ever departs and we got a manager like Conte (tin hat on, not saying we ever would), he would change the mindset of the team and make us harder to beat, even with the limited quality we have right now. Problem is under Smith, I have always believed he has the coaching ability, but weather good or bad, we rarely ever look like fighters.

[Zatman]

6 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

We need a Deano Out bingo card made from VT comments

-Needs a 6 foot 5 enforcer like Jedinak or Makelele 

- is he really better than Wilder, Bielsa, Farke, Potter or whoever is the flavour of the month 

[bobzy]

Let's just keep Smith as manager for as long as possible unless it goes completely south (relegation).

 

There's something quite nice about having an honest manager, who happens to be a fan, managing our club in a modern football world where everything is "if we haven't improved, sack everyone".  Football isn't enjoyable because of winning - ****, we haven't won anything for over 2 decades.  It's enjoyable because of the rollercoaster ride of weekly results and being able to discuss where things went right/wrong without resorting to this **** nonsense blame culture that is now ingrained in the game.

Losing games that you "should win" is as much of the fun as winning games that you "should lose".

[Kiwivillan]

4 minutes ago, Zatman said:

-Needs a 6 foot 5 enforcer like Jedinak or Makelele 

[hippo]

24 minutes ago, Swerbs said:

Can see it now in December with a monstrous run of games and the players start to get tired. "But why weren't the kids and reserves involved more?!"

Worry about that if and when it happens - Don't borrow problems from tomorrow 

[Kiwivillan]

1 minute ago, hippo said:

Don't borrow problems from tomorrow 

Nietzsche or TLC?

Edited October 19, 2021 by Kiwivillan

[hippo]

3 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Let's just keep Smith as manager for as long as possible unless it goes completely south (relegation).

 

There's something quite nice about having an honest manager, who happens to be a fan, managing our club in a modern football world where everything is "if we haven't improved, sack everyone".  Football isn't enjoyable because of winning - ****, we haven't won anything for over 2 decades.  It's enjoyable because of the rollercoaster ride of weekly results and being able to discuss where things went right/wrong without resorting to this **** nonsense blame culture that is now ingrained in the game.

Losing games that you "should win" is as much of the fun as winning games that you "should lose".

Mostly agree - however we would have to take evasive action if relegation started to look probably due to the financial costs involved. But most likel;y this season we are mid table and lower mid table.

 

[hippo]

2 minutes ago, Kiwivillan said:

Nietzsche or TLC?

Not sure what you mean ? 

[TRO]

2 minutes ago, foreveryoung said:

Tro, I am always about on your level, a bit of realism, instead of being happy he is good for Villa and losing now and again is just the way it goes. I fear how Smith plays now, without edge is the philosophy of Villa. We may progress, but if we are expecting a more raw edged ruthless team, unfortunately I doubt that change will ever come under Smith, as it's just not in his nature to coach this way.

If Smith ever departs and we got a manager like Conte (tin hat on, not saying we ever would), he would change the mindset of the team and make us harder to beat, even with the limited quality we have right now. Problem is under Smith, I have always believed he has the coaching ability, but weather good or bad, we rarely ever look like fighters.

As you well know.....I was brought up on Ron Saunders ....he was in charge when I was in my 30's.....He had that edge, Morley didn't like him on the surface, Andy Gray didn't like him either, that didn't bother Ron, one Iota......Ron was not perfect, and his teachings was not that of the classy and silky ways of Bobby Robson....but Ron was a winner and he instilled a winning mentality and to help him with that he had balanced teams....workrate was his mantra....and watching Conor Gallagher last night that mantra is not dead to "Modern Football"...He is a Ron type player.

In those days Bobby's Ipswich was the darling of the beautiful game.....We wasn't the eye candy, they was, but we was methodical, regimented and " Hard to beat"....had Ipswich won the league, I don't think they would have won the European cup

The players we had in Morley, shaw and withe was direct and they had a mix that made a whole.....the midfield was the same in as much as it had contrast....Bremner, Cowans and Mortimer, all adding different attributes to make the whole.

It was done with 14 players, never to be repeated in my view, and that was in a day when tackles were like the "wild west " anything goes....sure the pace, was not the same and subsequently the space was more plentiful, perhaps why Gary Shaw had a knack of rarely getting caught napping on the ball.....It was different times, of which I will soon be reminded....but it is the mentality, I am trying to highlight.

I understand managing super rich players is a whole different ball game, but even more so, he needs to develop a way of getting the best out of them.

I am sold on Deans playing style, he just needs to add some steel to a sound philosophy.

 

[hippo]

3 minutes ago, TRO said:

As you well know.....I was brought up on Ron Saunders ....he was in charge when I was in my 30's.....He had that edge, Morley didn't like him on the surface, Andy Gray didn't like him either, that didn't bother Ron, one Iota......Ron was not perfect, and his teachings was not that of the classy and silky ways of Bobby Robson....but Ron was a winner and he instilled a winning mentality and to help him with that he had balanced teams....workrate was his mantra....and watching Conor Gallagher last night that mantra is not dead to "Modern Football"...He is a Ron type player.

In those days Bobby's Ipswich was the darling of the beautiful game.....We wasn't the eye candy, they was, but we was methodical, regimented and " Hard to beat"....had Ipswich won the league, I don't think they would have won the European cup

The players we had in Morley, shaw and withe was direct and they had a mix that made a whole.....the midfield was the same in as much as it had contrast....Bremner, Cowans and Mortimer, all adding different attributes to make the whole.

It was done with 14 players, never to be repeated in my view, and that was in a day when tackles were like the "wild west " anything goes....sure the pace, was not the same and subsequently the space was more plentiful, perhaps why Gary Shaw had a knack of rarely getting caught napping on the ball.....It was different times, of which I will soon be reminded....but it is the mentality, I am trying to highlight.

I understand managing super rich players is a whole different ball game, but even more so, he needs to develop a way of getting the best out of them.

I am sold on Deans playing style, he just needs to add some steel to a sound philosophy.

 

A picture (Video) is a thousand words . I was 18 at the time - I thought we always be like this. Please watch this - we were so effin dominant that day ! 

 

[Peter Griffin]

17 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Losing games that you "should win" is as much of the fun as winning games that you "should lose".

I can't say I agree with that. Quite the opposite really. It is great fun winning a game we should lose and it is like dogshit losing a game we should win

[Eak94]

2 hours ago, villalad21 said:

Do you think we are likely getting to another final if he keeps playing the reserves?

We might.

You can't really include possible future cup exit in the statistics, this isn't Enron accounting.

[foreveryoung]

24 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Let's just keep Smith as manager for as long as possible unless it goes completely south (relegation).

 

There's something quite nice about having an honest manager, who happens to be a fan, managing our club in a modern football world where everything is "if we haven't improved, sack everyone".  Football isn't enjoyable because of winning - ****, we haven't won anything for over 2 decades.  It's enjoyable because of the rollercoaster ride of weekly results and being able to discuss where things went right/wrong without resorting to this **** nonsense blame culture that is now ingrained in the game.

Losing games that you "should win" is as much of the fun as winning games that you "should lose".

[villalad21]

30 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Let's just keep Smith as manager for as long as possible unless it goes completely south (relegation).

 

There's something quite nice about having an honest manager, who happens to be a fan, managing our club in a modern football world where everything is "if we haven't improved, sack everyone".  Football isn't enjoyable because of winning - ****, we haven't won anything for over 2 decades.  It's enjoyable because of the rollercoaster ride of weekly results and being able to discuss where things went right/wrong without resorting to this **** nonsense blame culture that is now ingrained in the game.

Losing games that you "should win" is as much of the fun as winning games that you "should lose".

My word. 

I can't believe what this fanbase has become. 

Thankfully the owners won't think like that. 

[bobzy]

Just now, villalad21 said:

My word. 

I can't believe what this fanbase has become. 

Thankfully the owners won't think like that. 

I'm just a fan, football is just a game.

It's sad to think otherwise.

[bobzy]

14 minutes ago, Peter Griffin said:

I can't say I agree with that. Quite the opposite really. It is great fun winning a game we should lose and it is like dogshit losing a game we should win

Try not to take that specific line too literally - I mean it's all part of the fun of following a football team.  You have high and lows.

 

I would genuinely not want to be a Man City fan.  Win everything or you've "failed" - woo, what fun.

[Woody1000]

37 minutes ago, bobzy said:

Let's just keep Smith as manager for as long as possible unless it goes completely south (relegation).

 

There's something quite nice about having an honest manager, who happens to be a fan, managing our club in a modern football world where everything is "if we haven't improved, sack everyone".  Football isn't enjoyable because of winning - ****, we haven't won anything for over 2 decades.  It's enjoyable because of the rollercoaster ride of weekly results and being able to discuss where things went right/wrong without resorting to this **** nonsense blame culture that is now ingrained in the game.

Losing games that you "should win" is as much of the fun as winning games that you "should lose".

I know what you’re saying mate, everything about the game has changed.