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Dean Smith


Demitri_C

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51 minutes ago, Zatman said:

Potter is paying big wages though. Lallana is on 100k a week. He isnt some budget manager 

As for being linked its just that. If Potter gets another job then can compare. Eddie Howe a similar genius has been linked to every job in the league and is still unemployed. Why would Smith be linked to another job if he is already at his dream club 🤔

I agree he's not. He's also spent big on some players who probably weren't worth the money - e.g.Webster, £20m, Maupay, £20m. But then it comes down to recruitment and is that down to the manager or the Sporting Director/Head of Recruitment - we signed Wesley for £20m, for example, who was a bigger waste of money than Maupay has been, but everyone blamed Suso for that rather than Smith. 

Football is ultimately about results and Potter's 27% win record in PL matches is not great. But Smith's PL win % is only 31% so hardly a great deal better (his overall win rate with us is 41% but that included time in the Champ). 

I would say for results Smith has done a better job, we've probably done better in recruitment terms too (albeit with a bigger budget), but I think Potter's system and style is better than Smith's and Brighton play better football than us. 

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16 minutes ago, AJ said:

I don't think its right to gauge the quality of a manager by how many clubs they are linked with. 99% of links are generated by media, and most times, they are full of shit. 

One of the first questions a head hunter asks, are they obtainable? Maybe Smith was offered the Spurs job, and after he finished laughing, he told them to do one?

As much as I dislike the media, I think if there is any serious interest in a manager it will come out in the press eventually. So if Spurs seriously wanted Smith, regardless what his own thoughts were, we would have got wind of it. Not saying that makes Smith a bad manager, I think he is underrated outside of Villa, but at the same time I think he's overrated by some of our fans too including many on here. I think as always the truth lies somewhere in the middle. 

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1 minute ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

Out of interest how many Brighton games have you fully watched? 

I don't watch them every week but I've seen them against the top teams if it is on Sky Sports including absolutely outclassing Manure in a 3-2 defeat a season or 2 ago, and I've also been very impressed when they've played us. 

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Just now, VillaFaninLondon said:

I don't watch them every week but I've seen them against the top teams if it is on Sky Sports including absolutely outclassing Manure in a 3-2 defeat a season or 2 ago, and I've also been very impressed when they've played us. 

That could be what it is then. If a Brighton fan had watched us against Man U and Chelsea as well as other games like Liverpool last season they probably think Smiths a top manager.

When you watch a team every minute of the season it’s a lot easier to see faults. I’m pretty sure if you had a conversation with a Brighton fan they’d soon tell you about the frustrating parts of Potters coaching. 

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2 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

I don't watch them every week but I've seen them against the top teams if it is on Sky Sports including absolutely outclassing Manure in a 3-2 defeat a season or 2 ago, and I've also been very impressed when they've played us. 

But we’ve completely outclassed teams and won like Liverpool 7-2.  I think during the last two years when we could watch every game of every team I’ve seen all Brighton games and they were very pretty but no end product and no idea of a solution and mostly lost or drawn.

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Just now, Vive_La_Villa said:

That could be what it is then. If a Brighton fan had watched us against Man U and Chelsea as well as other games like Liverpool last season they probably think Smiths a top manager.

When you watch a team every minute of the season it’s a lot easier to see faults. I’m pretty sure if you had a conversation with a Brighton fan they’d soon tell you about the frustrating parts of Potters coaching. 

Maybe but then look at Brighton's expected points from last season - I think they were 5th in the league and above us. They're near the top of the league for passes made, shots, presses etc. That tells you automatically they're a very well coached team. 

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29 minutes ago, Zatman said:

No every manager is better than Dean Smith. First it was Farke then Wilder then Big Sam then Bielsa etc. 

Why the extreme and bias each time when discussing Smith? It appears the people that endorse Smith the most are the ones that put him down the most on VT. 

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5 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

Maybe but then look at Brighton's expected points from last season - I think they were 5th in the league and above us. They're near the top of the league for passes made, shots, presses etc. That tells you automatically they're a very well coached team. 

Not only are they doing well in terms of expected goals and attacking stats in general.

Their expected goals against is good as well.

Basically Brighton tick all the boxes they just need to have a normal conversion rate and they would be comfortably top half.

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23 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

That could be what it is then. If a Brighton fan had watched us against Man U and Chelsea as well as other games like Liverpool last season they probably think Smiths a top manager.

When you watch a team every minute of the season it’s a lot easier to see faults. I’m pretty sure if you had a conversation with a Brighton fan they’d soon tell you about the frustrating parts of Potters coaching. 

 

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11 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Not only are they doing well in terms of expected goals and attacking stats in general.

Their expected goals against is good as well.

Basically Brighton tick all the boxes they just need to have a normal conversion rate and they would be comfortably top half.

I bet you we still finish above them. 

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1 hour ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

I think that's pure bias towards Smith if I'm being honest. Saying he's a much better manager than Potter because Potter only won 9 games in the past 2 seasons, Smith only won 7 games in his first season with us in the Prem! 

Brighton were already a PL team whereas Smith had dragged us up from bottom half of the Championship into the playoffs and promoted and then had to rebuild and settle almost a new squad in the PL.  its  light and day that position two years ago.  

Also Smith won 9 league games.  

Brighton under previous management won 9 league games per season for two years and then Potter came and he’s won 9 league games per season for two seasons…he’s not improved them.

Smith won 9 games and then 16 games…massive increase!

1 hour ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

And also the league positions, Brighton finished 15th and 16th, we finished 17th and 11th under Smith in the same seasons, so a couple of places below them and then a few places above them

You’re kidding right? We finished 6 points behind them and then 14 points above them the following season.  We flipped 20 points while they stayed the same.  If you don’t think beating them by 14 points is huge, that’s crazy.

1 hour ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

Brighton also finished in those positions playing front foot football against every team (including Man City, Liverpool etc) and outplaying a lot of good teams in that time but maybe not getting the results. Whereas we have played with no consistent style in that time and have reverted to very direct, even long ball at times to get results. 

In your opinion and you stated above you only watched them occasionally and I disagree with your view about Villa.  We were playing some beautiful football first half of last season, we hit a dark patch 2nd half I agree but many mitigating factors for that and also some not mitigating factors but your overall assessment I can’t agree with.

1 hour ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

Smith has also spent a lot more. In the same period, Smith has spent £350m roughly (and also got £100m back for Grealish), Potter has spent roughly £100m in the same period so a lot less.

Yeah but over five years the outlay is only 50m less.  Yes Potter wasn’t there for over half of that but they already had an established PL team we were playing catch up to actually build a team, we had very few players when we were promoted.  I think that’s an unfair comparison.

1 hour ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

That's why I think we're where I'd expect us to be as a minimum with the squad we have - whereas Brighton are above where I think they should be despite having some decent players. 

So Brighton should be relegated each season because on 41 points, if they are above where you think they should be means they should relegated.

1 hour ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

I would say as a coach and tactician Potter is the much better manager and that's why he's being linked with the top jobs. But I'll probably get a load of stick for saying that.

Fair enough if that’s your opinion, I honestly don’t see it and obviously don’t agree.  I don’t think it’s even close, Smith is a much better coach and tactician.

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46 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

The Wilder fan club was hilarious. A whole season of why couldn’t Smith be more like Wilder. Not it’s Potter! 

He did a great job at Sheffield but seems a bit old school-my way or the highways, manager.  Which Smith has never been. Probably one of the reasons he still hasn't got  a job yet. I think he will probably have to drop down to the Championship again. Probably Nottingham Forest when they sack their manager again.

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13 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

Not only are they doing well in terms of expected goals and attacking stats in general.

Their expected goals against is good as well.

Basically Brighton tick all the boxes they just need to have a normal conversion rate and they would be comfortably top half.

are you a brighton fan now that leeds are crap? ;)

they seem to turn into prime barca whenever we play them but whenever else i see them i think they've looked crap and it's only because there have been one or 2 worse teams than them each season that they're still in this league. they shithouse just enough decent results to stay up each season but ultimately they're a poor side, expensively assembled by an average manager. i can't believe we're even comparing ourselves to them and comparing smith to potter is also quite insulting to smith

they've had a piss easy start to the season...we'll be comfortably above them

**** brighton

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It is nonsensical to try and compare Potter v Smith with so little data. They have each only managed at one club in the PL and Potter has only managed in the PL for two seasons and Smith for 3 seasons. They have both undertaken a serious change in direction at their respective clubs and they are both doing a good job. The likelihood is that both clubs will finish mid table / lower upper half this season. I am sure there is lots of individual data elements to show where Smith is better than Potter and also to show where Potter is better than Smith. Suggesting one manager is better than the other with the information available is simply showing bias

 

Edit: DS has only managed us for 2 seasons in the PL and not 3 as stated. Time flies when u are enjoying yourself 😀

Edited by Peter Griffin
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This is getting a bit like the Jack Grealish for England situation, it is possible to rate one without slating the others. 
In this particular case, isn’t it fair to say that both Dean and Potter are doing good jobs?

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54 minutes ago, Woody1000 said:

This is getting a bit like the Jack Grealish for England situation, it is possible to rate one without slating the others. 
In this particular case, isn’t it fair to say that both Dean and Potter are doing good jobs?

It appears you are not allowed to do that. You have to say Deano is much better. Suggesting Potter is a good manager is disrespectful to Dean as he is unquestionably the best manager who can do no wrong

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