andym Posted October 13, 2021 Share Posted October 13, 2021 1 hour ago, villalad21 said: Leicester seem to be pretty consistent. As well as West Ham. I don't think their squads are vastly superior to our. Moyes has managed to find consistency. You know what West Ham you're going to get most weeks. Can't say the same about Villa. Do you? They put 4 past Leicester and Newcastle, but then twice blew a lead at home to Palace, and a few weeks later lost at home to newly promoted Brentford. You slated Smith for our draw against Brentford (despite our weakened side), so losing to them is surely a disasterous performance by Moyes? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catanzaro Posted October 13, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted October 13, 2021 3 hours ago, villalad21 said: Smith isn't solely responsible for player recruitment. Suso and now Lange is. No doubt Smith has played the main role in the Championship market and I credit him for that. Cash, Watkins and Konsa are great additions. But point is everything is set up for the manager and players to flourish. I actually think the managerial position is very easily replaceable. Tactical set up against Watford and Spurs is an example to why he still isn't there yet as a manager. He is still making mistakes. And you've followed the game for far longer than I and should know how key consistency is. And we've never really had it under Smith. Went from 2 wins in 13 to 10 wins in a row in the championship. Went from a team in the course to comfortably finish top half last season to collapse and barely averaging above a point per game second half of the season. Smith is a manager that has given us moments but way too inconsistent to make me believe we can finish in Europe which ultimately is what the owners and fans want. I am still unconvinced of Smith. I think he is a culture builder but for me he isn't a winner. I hope I am wrong as that would obviously benefit the Villa. but the best team managers in all sports are the ones who build the best cultures 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post The Other Mat Posted October 14, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 14, 2021 14 hours ago, villalad21 said: I am still unconvinced of Smith. You do kind of give off that vibe. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Vive_La_Villa Posted October 14, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 14, 2021 Dean Smith appointed when 14th. Not convinced with this appointment (fair enough). promotion in first season. - still not convinced Kept team up following a complete squad overhaul and a keeper injury crisis. plus a league cup final - still not convinced 11th place finish including wins over Liverpool, Arsenal x 2, Chelsea and Spurs - still not convinced. Started the season with a win at Old Trafford for the first time in a decade - still not convinced. I think it’s safe to say anybody that is still not convinced by now will never be convinced. So it’s a pointless debate. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 (edited) I’m actually struggling to understand what and how Solskjaer trying to build there whereas I can see the culture Smith is building throughout the club I don’t really see that in Solskjaers team, recruitment or style. Edited October 14, 2021 by blandy removed OT aspect 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blandy Posted October 14, 2021 Moderator Share Posted October 14, 2021 This is not a Man Utd thread. Stay on topic please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 35 minutes ago, Vive_La_Villa said: Dean Smith appointed when 14th. Not convinced with this appointment (fair enough). promotion in first season. - still not convinced Kept team up following a complete squad overhaul and a keeper injury crisis. plus a league cup final - still not convinced 11th place finish including wins over Liverpool, Arsenal x 2, Chelsea and Spurs - still not convinced. Started the season with a win at Old Trafford for the first time in a decade - still not convinced. I think it’s safe to say anybody that is still not convinced by now will never be convinced. So it’s a pointless debate. It's absolutely pointless because there's nothing to debate anymore. It's just the same critical posters trying to start a debate or want a balanced view, because they've been proved wrong on multiple occasions and can't back track at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 11 hours ago, catanzaro said: but the best team managers in all sports are the ones who build the best cultures Yes, that is absolutely correct but the best team managers do more than just build the best culture. Coaching & tactics and also key factors. All of the best managers have the attributes to do each of these. Time will tell if Smith can develop into one of the best managers. He does show elements of all the necessary skills but he is still learning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillanousOne Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 we've lost another youth coach, feels like Dean has lost at least three members of his coaching staff and apart from MacPhee we've not replaced any of them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nick76 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 8 minutes ago, VillanousOne said: we've lost another youth coach, feels like Dean has lost at least three members of his coaching staff and apart from MacPhee we've not replaced any of them? I'm not worried about it, people come and go and bringing in people like MacPhee recently shows we keep improving the staff when it is needed and available. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouUnastanFren Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 17 minutes ago, VillanousOne said: we've lost another youth coach, feels like Dean has lost at least three members of his coaching staff and apart from MacPhee we've not replaced any of them? Danks has joined as well. Seems to be highly regarded 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Silvers Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 31 minutes ago, VillanousOne said: we've lost another youth coach, feels like Dean has lost at least three members of his coaching staff and apart from MacPhee we've not replaced any of them? What the others have said plus all the coaches and youth players we've taken from the baggies, I think we are stronger all through the coaching set up then we have been for decades. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Smith has done a decent job on the whole considering where we were but comparing him to previous Villa managers is pointless because we've had so many mediocre ones. Because of our ability to appoint sh*t coaches shouldn't mean we put Smith on some kind of pedestal. Plus going on about where we were 3 years ago, 5 years ago or even 10 years ago is irrelevant and ignores all the non-managerial factors that have taken us from where we were then and now. New owners have had a huge impact considering the 2 charlatans we had before these ones. I think Smith has built a great orgnisation at Villa and he's built up a very good backroom staff. I think he's also brought a really harmonious feel to the squad which we've lacked for a long time. I'm still not sure why Lange hasn't unearthed many gems in his scouting mission, but I'm hopeful that will come. Where Smith is lacking is tactically and in his decision making. Our biggest strength currently is our wingers yet he doesn't play any (injuries haven't helped in that regard either I admit). But he comes across very stubborn his approach and tends to stick at something even if it isn't working or affecting our style of play. We are roughly where I'd expect us to be given the strength of the squad. I feel last season we should have finished a bit higher. And I feel the season before that we were very lucky to stay up and would have gone down if not for COVID and the failings of Bournemouth and Watford. So in terms of results he hasn't impressed me all that highly. I like him as a guy and he has built a very solid foundation for us. I think that's a fair argument. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Zatman Posted October 14, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted October 14, 2021 5 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: Smith has done a decent job on the whole considering where we were but comparing him to previous Villa managers is pointless because we've had so many mediocre ones. Because of our ability to appoint sh*t coaches shouldn't mean we put Smith on some kind of pedestal. Plus going on about where we were 3 years ago, 5 years ago or even 10 years ago is irrelevant and ignores all the non-managerial factors that have taken us from where we were then and now. New owners have had a huge impact considering the 2 charlatans we had before these ones. I think Smith has built a great orgnisation at Villa and he's built up a very good backroom staff. I think he's also brought a really harmonious feel to the squad which we've lacked for a long time. I'm still not sure why Lange hasn't unearthed many gems in his scouting mission, but I'm hopeful that will come. Where Smith is lacking is tactically and in his decision making. Our biggest strength currently is our wingers yet he doesn't play any (injuries haven't helped in that regard either I admit). But he comes across very stubborn his approach and tends to stick at something even if it isn't working or affecting our style of play. We are roughly where I'd expect us to be given the strength of the squad. I feel last season we should have finished a bit higher. And I feel the season before that we were very lucky to stay up and would have gone down if not for COVID and the failings of Bournemouth and Watford. So in terms of results he hasn't impressed me all that highly. I like him as a guy and he has built a very solid foundation for us. I think that's a fair argument. Tactically he destroyed Jurgen Klopp last season and has given Tuchel a run for his money 3 times in the last 5 months. He also beat the Spurs, Arsenal and United coaches in recent times plus Ancelotti, Bielsa and Rafa 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 8 minutes ago, Zatman said: Tactically he destroyed Jurgen Klopp last season and has given Tuchel a run for his money 3 times in the last 5 months. He also beat the Spurs, Arsenal and United coaches in recent times plus Ancelotti, Bielsa and Rafa Fair but Bielsa, Wilder, Hassenhuttl, Moyes, etc all got the better of him last season too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 17 hours ago, villalad21 said: Smith isn't solely responsible for player recruitment. Suso and now Lange is. *Shudder* ... what a con artist he was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romavillan Posted October 14, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted October 14, 2021 37 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: Plus going on about where we were 3 years ago, 5 years ago or even 10 years ago is irrelevant and ignores all the non-managerial factors that have taken us from where we were then and now. New owners have had a huge impact considering the 2 charlatans we had before these ones. Just don't get this, people talk about hat Smith has done since he got here as a way of explaining why they rate him to people who constantly say he's not good enough. It's not like anyone is dragging up ancient history or anything. 38 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: Where Smith is lacking is tactically and in his decision making. Our biggest strength currently is our wingers yet he doesn't play any (injuries haven't helped in that regard either I admit). But he comes across very stubborn his approach and tends to stick at something even if it isn't working or affecting our style of play. I think the polar opposite of this, we've played several different formations successfully. Before we had one decent first eleven and the shape pretty much picked itself based on those players. No we have options and we've played 4-3-3, 3-5-2 and others so far this season. I have no idea why you would think Smith is lacking tactically, he is one of the the most tactically astute British coaches in football today. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaFaninLondon Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 1 hour ago, romavillan said: Just don't get this, people talk about hat Smith has done since he got here as a way of explaining why they rate him to people who constantly say he's not good enough. It's not like anyone is dragging up ancient history or anything. I think the polar opposite of this, we've played several different formations successfully. Before we had one decent first eleven and the shape pretty much picked itself based on those players. No we have options and we've played 4-3-3, 3-5-2 and others so far this season. I have no idea why you would think Smith is lacking tactically, he is one of the the most tactically astute British coaches in football today. Why are Potter, Gerrard, Rodgers all considered better than him then? It’s not a conspiracy against Villa I can tell you that. Smith has done a decent job as I said but still has weaknesses - the good thing is he’s young enough to fix them and not stuck in his ways and I do think there is an element of underrating him outside of Villa, but then I don’t get hyperbole like “he is one of the most tactically astute British coaches in football today”. There is an element of our support that will never back him, I get that (I don’t put myself in that category by the way), but there are the ones who defend him at every turn and believe he can do no wrong. The worst thing is the latter don’t like it when you criticise and can’t accept an opposing point of view so then determine to call everyone out that makes a constructive criticism of the manager. Which is wrong in my view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 14, 2021 Share Posted October 14, 2021 Gerrard 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romavillan Posted October 14, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted October 14, 2021 5 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said: Why are Potter, Gerrard, Rodgers all considered better than him then? Considered by who? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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