Popular Post a m ole Posted March 4, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted March 4, 2021 There is no such thing as a managerial ‘ceiling’, what a dumb concept. 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, a m ole said: There is no such thing as a managerial ‘ceiling’, what a dumb concept. O'Neill certainly had one 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 4 minutes ago, a m ole said: There is no such thing as a managerial ‘ceiling’, what a dumb concept. This. If Pep had only managed bottom half of the league teams, his 'ceiling' wouldn't be impressive. There are so many factors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 1 hour ago, tomav84 said: the fact that el ghazi and elmo are current starters for us, that keinan davis gets any form of PL game time, and neil taylor still makes a PL bench shows how much work we still need to do. we'll be better next season gutted europe aint happening. i was convinced it was for a large part of this season. but would be nice to finish top half if possible This all day. We need some perspective at times. No other top half team would be relying on Elmo to play games. Or have Davis as their only other forward option off the bench. We are still probably 2 summer transfer windows away from having the sort of squad that can maintain a serious challenge to the top 6. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QldVilla Posted March 4, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted March 4, 2021 5 minutes ago, a m ole said: There is no such thing as a managerial ‘ceiling’, what a dumb concept. Not as dumb as you think. All coaches can learn and adopt new ideas and methodologies, but they can get to a point where they don’t understand, or can’t conceptualise a new idea. You can be the best tactician in football, but if you can’t communicate that idea to your coaching staff and the players, it’s worthless. A manger needs to where many hats and continue to develop those many skills, but at some point they can struggle to continue to develop, otherwise anyone could coach the top clubs in European football. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomav84 Posted March 4, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted March 4, 2021 1 minute ago, DCJonah said: This all day. We need some perspective at times. No other top half team would be relying on Elmo to play games. Or have Davis as their only other forward option off the bench. We are still probably 2 summer transfer windows away from having the sort of squad that can maintain a serious challenge to the top 6. i just hope that we move forward quickly enough for jack. based on your timeline i'm not sure he is going to wait until the 2023/2024 season before playing european football i think we need to be challenging next season personally or he's off. love to have been a fly on the wall for his chat with the owners. i'd imagine he was given targeted timelines in that discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Zatman Posted March 4, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted March 4, 2021 This is Dean Smith 2nd top flight season. The only managers above him have a combined 8 Champions League trophies and about 100 trophies overall Its a tough managerial level 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 8 minutes ago, tomav84 said: i just hope that we move forward quickly enough for jack. based on your timeline i'm not sure he is going to wait until the 2023/2024 season before playing european football i think we need to be challenging next season personally or he's off. love to have been a fly on the wall for his chat with the owners. i'd imagine he was given targeted timelines in that discussion. I think there's a good chance we challenge next season. But when I look at the squads Everton and Spurs have, realistically its going to be another couple of seasons before we start being able to match them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post KentVillan Posted March 4, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted March 4, 2021 1 hour ago, villalad21 said: We will know next season. It's become boy who cried wolf now. It's just the same people saying "He's taken us as far as he can" and then he takes us another rung up the ladder, and then they say it again without the slightest note of self-awareness or embarrassment. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 4 minutes ago, KentVillan said: It's become boy who cried wolf now. It's just the same people saying "He's taken us as far as he can" and then he takes us another rung up the ladder, and then they say it again without the slightest note of self-awareness or embarrassment. Said people then start Title threads and not as a joke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_avfc Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 34 minutes ago, tomav84 said: i just hope that we move forward quickly enough for jack. based on your timeline i'm not sure he is going to wait until the 2023/2024 season before playing european football i think we need to be challenging next season personally or he's off. love to have been a fly on the wall for his chat with the owners. i'd imagine he was given targeted timelines in that discussion. I don't really see anybody committing the sort of money we'd want for Grealish on one player in the near future. Its all well and good saying "he's off" but who do you see stumping up the price that we'd want for Jack. On topic, the continuing questioning of Smith every time we lose a game is pretty silly. Our squad isn't good enough that we can avoid results like this in the season. Performances have been a million times better than last season consistently. I get that we all want to be a powerhouse of European football again but the turn around from where we were two years ago has been remarkable. I genuinely think we would be the laughing stock of English football if we were to get rid of him now. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zhan_Zhuang Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 Our focus should be top ten now, as we are in such a good position it would be a shame to falter. Before the season top ten would have been magic but we were so close; what we needed was to win back-to-back matches regularly. This is something we have struggled with. I echo the point made before me Villa MUST spend £60-80 million this summer on two players. A midfield General, a replacement for McGinn who is quicker and stronger and then a replacement for Barkley. We need back-up for defense too which basically means understudies for Cash and Targett. Although the latter didn't exactly cover himself in glory against Sheff. Utd and looked lost without Grealish. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a m ole Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 1 hour ago, QldVilla said: Not as dumb as you think. All coaches can learn and adopt new ideas and methodologies, but they can get to a point where they don’t understand, or can’t conceptualise a new idea. You can be the best tactician in football, but if you can’t communicate that idea to your coaching staff and the players, it’s worthless. A manger needs to where many hats and continue to develop those many skills, but at some point they can struggle to continue to develop, otherwise anyone could coach the top clubs in European football. You’d think they could, the way fans analyse a managers decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QldVilla Posted March 4, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted March 4, 2021 6 minutes ago, a m ole said: You’d think they could, the way fans analyse a managers decisions. That’s because they don’t have all the information from training, medical staff, coaching staff etc etc. fans just give their opinion after 90mins. If they had to do it in the managers shoes, their heads would explode. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a m ole Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 7 minutes ago, QldVilla said: That’s because they don’t have all the information from training, medical staff, coaching staff etc etc. fans just give their opinion after 90mins. If they had to do it in the managers shoes, their heads would explode. Well yeah, exactly. the idea of him hitting a ceiling as a manager meaning we could never progress from where we are now because he didn’t make a sub until 10 mins after we all (including me) wanted him to is silly. We don’t know! Give Smith Liverpool’s squad, do we think he’d be sitting in 6th behind Moyes’ West Ham? Has Klopp hit his ceiling as a manager? Where is Moyes’ ceiling now he’s doing better with an average squad than he did with a title winning squad? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sharkyvilla Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 The fact that Dean can set up a team to thrash the Champions and also to grind out 1-0s when we are out of form and missing our best player shows just how good a coach he is. I hate the tiresome Bielsa comparisons but he does only have one method. We just need more depth in the squad, which will no doubt happen in the summer. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveAV1 Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 1 hour ago, QldVilla said: That’s because they don’t have all the information from training, medical staff, coaching staff etc etc. fans just give their opinion after 90mins. If they had to do it in the managers shoes, their heads would explode. Absolutely right. We all have opinions based on comparatively little actual up to date knowledge. Many people were calling for Sanson to start, I certainly wouldn’t have been disappointed to see that happen. After last night the general concensus appears to be that he needs more time. Even now we are forming an opinion on about 20 minutes of a game when nobody did particularly well. There may have been any number of reasons that he didn’t do as well as we all hoped. We just don’t know and neither should we. Although we’d all love to of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eholm Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 Maybe more of a plateau than a ceiling. As has been said managerial improvement is not a constant upward trajectory. The observation I was making was that Smith hasn’t quite got us playing the way we were in the first half of the season, especially from an attacking perspective and this has coincided with teams having experience of playing us. As I said, we rarely control the midfield and lack central focused creativity. I am sure that Smith and Co will find the answers either within the current squad or by solid recruitment in the Summer. To say that a ceiling is a stupid concept is an opinion I disagree with; if so, every manager would a PL manager and every player a PL player. This is all part of the ride we are on - a relatively inexperienced coach at the top level and a young inexperienced squad. I am sure we will continue to develop and improve and I’m looking forward to seeing how Smith attempts to turn is from a principally counter attacking team who struggle when pressed into a more varied attacking unit. Exciting times 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvfcRigo82 Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 7 minutes ago, sharkyvilla said: We just need more depth in the squad, which will no doubt happen in the summer. I agree. I think we will see atleast another 4 or 5 arrivals in the summer scattered over many positions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, KentVillan said: It's become boy who cried wolf now. It's just the same people saying "He's taken us as far as he can" and then he takes us another rung up the ladder, and then they say it again without the slightest note of self-awareness or embarrassment. After the summer we need to see Deano keep kick on. That'll be 3 transfer windows prolly totalling £300 Million + I actually like the guy despite what people think. He is a likable down to earth character and players obviously like him and plays for him, but if he can't take us where we belong i think even Smith himself will eventually step down for the good of the club. I hope he can do it but i can't see him ever breaking into that top 6. That is based on a lack of a tactical nouse when plan A isn't working. Zero wins from losing positions is very telling and alarming. This is the reason Wolves is starting to lose their best players. They hit the ceiling with Nuno and players would prefer to move because they can't progress more under him. This is how you lose your best players. You can't stop progressing. Gareth Barry even admitted to this being the reason to why he left Villa. He would love to stay but we constantly bottled top 4 and we didn't win any trophies so he fel he had to leave to achieve that. Our squad needs to be not so relient on Jack too. We've made some steps towards that this season with some cracking signings but it's alarming how flat we look without him. Nobody can replace Jack Grealish but a decent squad should be able to consistently get results even without him. In that sense we are very similar to Man Utd in being overly relient on one individual. Edited March 4, 2021 by villalad21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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