Dean Smith

[Keyblade]

2 minutes ago, useless said:

Everton fans have much less of a reason to be concerned about relegation than we do, their team was comfortable last season whilst our wasn't, that's why it doesn't make sense to ask whether Everton fans are worried or not, of course they're not going to be as worried about relegation as much as Villa fans, they didn't finish with one of the worst point totals in the history of the premier league for a team finising in 17th place last season.

Saying that we shouldn't worry about relegation because Everton fans aren't worried about relegation really is misguided, it's like saying we shouldn't be worried about not qualifying for the champions league because Man City fans aren't worrying about not qualifying for the champions league.

Current form doesn't mean we will be relegated, but it's reasonable for fans to be concerned, that doesn't mean that they're pasquinading  DS, just pointing out that things need to improve.

It would need a monumental collapse in form for us to be in danger of relegation. We'd need to lose about 80% of the next 10-15 games to get dragged down to the level of the bottom 4.

Obviously things need to improve, but all the signs point to a team that can turn this around. When our problems are silly individual errors and lapses in concentration that is a much more relatively easy fix than "we're not creating chances" or "we're getting cut open by teams every time they get the ball", which incidentally were our problems when we looked to be in relegation trouble last season.

[useless]

Well lets hope we win a few matches.

Edited December 1, 2020 by useless

[weedman]

5 minutes ago, mykeyb said:

I do find it a little strange. Trent I thought made a valid point last nght about our defence not being as sound as it was but then got jumped on. 

I like Dean, want him to be our manager but also feel it's OK to point out issues in our game when I see it.

The squad is young, still trying to gel and needs improving and most importantly needs our support. It absolutely does not mean I want him out.

Why is it OK to criticise, Conor, Mings, Target, Trez or SJM but not Dean?.

 

I mean sure, it's a valid point, it just doesn't mean anything. He wasn't saying our defence was worse than last season, he agreed it is now better, he was literally saying our defence isn't as good now as it was during a tiny 4 game run where we had the best defence of anyone in the league.

I think the reason people jumped on it was because what kind of a criticism is that? We finished 17th last season and critical this year because we don't have the best defence in the league after 10 games like we did after 4? We obviously weren't going to finish the season with the best defence in the league, so it was absolutely inevitable that it would "regress" in subsequent games. Using it as a stick to beat the team with is ludicrous. It's punishing them for having a good start 

If we win every remaining match 5-0 can we complain that our attack has regressed since our 7-2 v Liverpool? Of course not because that would be ridiculous 

We've conceded more goals but arguably our defence is still solid, we have a really low xG against and are getting super unlucky to concede with basically every shot the opposition has, and they're all unsaveable worldies to boot. The odds of that continuing all season are staggeringly low, luck evens out over a season and the better performances you put in the more you will eventually gain in the longer term over the course of a season. 

Constructive criticism and criticising for the sake of it are very different things. Taking the results with no context just in order to throw criticism out there is always going to wind people up, especially when it's pretty much been universally accepted by all apart from a few on here that we were very very unlucky not to get at least a point, and realistically deserved all 3. Getting shocked and outraged by it seems crazy to me. 

[Tomaszk]

2 hours ago, DCJonah said:

I honestly am surprised so many are like it. I really thought we were past that point now. 

Watching the trolls turn fans on Smith so easily it's no surprise the politics in this country is a mess. People are swayed so easily.

[DCJonah]

9 hours ago, useless said:

People are allowed to point out we're on a bad run, it doesn't mean to say that they're displeased with out position in the bigger picture. Sometimes it seems like people are in some sort of cult where you can't say anything negative at all in case it reflects badly on Smith.

Absolutely point out we are on a bad run. We are. But anyone who has watched the games knows the results don't reflect the full picture and the improvements we've made. 

Show me a midtable prem team that doesn't have bad spells throughout the season.

[Vive_La_Villa]

23 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Absolutely point out we are on a bad run. We are. But anyone who has watched the games knows the results don't reflect the full picture and the improvements we've made. 

Show me a midtable prem team that doesn't have bad spells throughout the season.

It’s why I took a day out from VT. I think it’s more frustration than anything as there is no way we should have lost all 4 of the games.  The performances are encouraging that we will turn it around  but we really need to be getting points on the board while we are still able to field more or less our best team.  We are a couple of injuries away from being in big trouble. 

[useless]

We're no more a midtable team than we were a top six team when we were in the top six, first we have to earn the honour over the course of a season of attaching to ourselves such a title. If a team that's established as a midtable side goes on a bad run they have less reason to be worried than we do as they're more proven than us at this level since they've already proven themselves capable of finishing halfway up the league, whereas we haven't, we've just come out of a season where we barely survived so losing four out of five is more concerning for us than it would be for a more established side.

 

[bobzy]

10 hours ago, mykeyb said:

I do find it a little strange. Trent I thought made a valid point last nght about our defence not being as sound as it was but then got jumped on. 

I like Dean, want him to be our manager but also feel it's OK to point out issues in our game when I see it.

The squad is young, still trying to gel and needs improving and most importantly needs our support. It absolutely does not mean I want him out.

Why is it OK to criticise, Conor, Mings, Target, Trez or SJM but not Dean?.

 

It didn't get jumped on at all.  Personally, I made a constructive argument and explained why I thought the defence had got better, despite us conceding more goals.

 

I think the reason people are arguing over it is because some are literally only seeing scorelines (which is understandable to an extent as that's all that football is based on).  As I said earlier, we're basically a reverse-Newcastle at the moment - we're playing good stuff but not getting the wins, whereas they are playing awful stuff and picking up valuable points.

It's obviously fine to criticise anyone when it's warranted - but I'm genuinely unsure as to what people want Smith to do differently.  Maybe he should tell Mings to hoof the ball long all the time?  However, it's completely obvious that he's wanting us to build from the back and, naturally, that brings about it a risk element.

 

I think the first few games of the season have **** up our fanbase.  We're not going to be a top 6 (or even top 8!) club this season - it's all about stabilising ourselves in the Premier League to enable us to kick on.

[useless]

Of couse we have to turn our current form around, we've just lost four out of five, conceding eleven goals, why people are acting otherwise I'm really not sure. In fact I'm pretty certain that Smith himself thinks that we have to turn our current form around. Contrary to reason and common sense, utterly absurd and ridiculous that you can't say so without being branded as some sort of anti Smith bandit.

[Zatman]

1 hour ago, DCJonah said:

Absolutely point out we are on a bad run. We are. But anyone who has watched the games knows the results don't reflect the full picture and the improvements we've made. 

Show me a midtable prem team that doesn't have bad spells throughout the season.

Yep, this is the best football we have played in the top flight in over a decade in that we actually look like a Premier League team. We arent winning everyweek but its nowhere near last season or the garbage Lamberto or McLeish served us

[useless]

One win off top four with a game in hand. Money well spent. Keep up the good work coach.

[Vive_La_Villa]

1 hour ago, bobzy said:

It didn't get jumped on at all.  Personally, I made a constructive argument and explained why I thought the defence had got better, despite us conceding more goals.

 

I think the reason people are arguing over it is because some are literally only seeing scorelines (which is understandable to an extent as that's all that football is based on).  As I said earlier, we're basically a reverse-Newcastle at the moment - we're playing good stuff but not getting the wins, whereas they are playing awful stuff and picking up valuable points.

It's obviously fine to criticise anyone when it's warranted - but I'm genuinely unsure as to what people want Smith to do differently.  Maybe he should tell Mings to hoof the ball long all the time?  However, it's completely obvious that he's wanting us to build from the back and, naturally, that brings about it a risk element.

 

I think the first few games of the season have **** up our fanbase.  We're not going to be a top 6 (or even top 8!) club this season - it's all about stabilising ourselves in the Premier League to enable us to kick on.

I genuinely think some would prefer the Steve Bruce tactics of get everyone behind the ball all game, ride your luck and nick one on the break. 
 

I guess it gets points on the board.

[DCJonah]

1 hour ago, useless said:

Of couse we have to turn our current form around, we've just lost four out of five, conceding eleven goals, why people are acting otherwise I'm really not sure. In fact I'm pretty certain that Smith himself thinks that we have to turn our current form around. Contrary to reason and common sense, utterly absurd and ridiculous that you can't say so without being branded as some sort of anti Smith bandit.

Show me anyone who doesn't think our form needs to change.

The difference is, most can see that this will happen if we continue playing this well. We don't need major tweaks and changes. 

In the last 2 games, we've missed a pen and had a last minute pen and goal taken off us through VAR. Moyes spoke about how well we played, pundits knew we deserved more than we got. 

People, the usual ones, are acting like this is all down to terrible management and coaching. We've been incredibly unlucky. 

[lexicon]

1 hour ago, Vive_La_Villa said:

I genuinely think some would prefer the Steve Bruce tactics of get everyone behind the ball all game, ride your luck and nick one on the break. 
 

I guess it gets points on the board.

I genuinely think some will never be happy, and for them it's not about that - supporting football is simply their cathartic way of venting their frustrations at life

[useless]

It's perfectly normal to be unhappy to have lost four out of five. And people should be allowed to express that without being called a troll, or being accused of wanting Bruce back, or of hating Smith, or wanting him sacked.

 

[tom_avfc]

12 minutes ago, useless said:

It's perfectly normal to be unhappy to have lost four out of five. And people should be allowed to express that without being called a troll, or being accused of wanting Bruce back, or of hating Smith, or wanting him sacked.

 

I'd imagine every single person on here is unhappy to have lost four out of five. To completely ignore the performances is pretty strange though. There have been posters on here saying that we don't seem to have a system despite the fact that we've dominated our past two games of football and probably should have won both games by a couple of goals.

[PaulC]

Our home form is a concern but away from home we have played at a very high level in all 4 games. I don't worry about the results as much as the performances. 

[Tomaszk]

14 minutes ago, useless said:

It's perfectly normal to be unhappy to have lost four out of five. And people should be allowed to express that without being called a troll, or being accused of wanting Bruce back, or of hating Smith, or wanting him sacked.

 

Individual player errors are not the managers fault IMO.

He's not telling Mings to get tackled every week.

He's not telling Hourihane to bottle tackles every time someone is within 5 yards of him.

He's not telling players to lose their man at corners (every good team in the world plays a half man-to-man, half zonal system at corners. It's the best method.).

He's not telling players to miss penalties.

He's not telling VAR and bad refs to **** us week after week.

But to nick a line I just wrote in another thread, we're a work in progress.

We have barely any realistic options to play ahead of the players on the pitch.

This is our second season in the PL after years away. This is probably going to be our best season for 10 years.

Smith is doing a great job and if you think someone else would come in click their fingers and have this squad, hideously thin on quality, solid as a rock at the back and scoring loads of goals, you're wrong.

I honestly wish analysis would come up more often about, after a win perhaps? Performance related thoughts.

It doesn't though, it comes after and only after losses. I can't take it seriously after we absolutely dominate games but miss three sitters and a penalty and people are saying Smith is a weak link and we played badly.

A fair result Monday night would have been 5-2 to us. Real improvement will come as long as we don't **** up signings across the next three windows.

[useless]

Not sure what any of that has to do with anything I've wrote, least of all in the comment quoted.

But it rather makes my point for me, dare to say anything negative and you get accused of all sorts.

[Zatman]

7 minutes ago, useless said:

Not sure what any of that has to do with anything I've wrote, least of all in the comment quoted.

But it rather makes my point for me, dare to say anything negative and you get accused of all sorts.

Dont think anybody was labelling anything at you. There is the notable posters that come on here after every loss to bring the neagtive spin