Dean Smith

[Tomaszk]

I hope it's not going to be the case all season every game we lose that Smith was "outsmarted"?

Players appeared very tired and plenty put in bad performances. There's no one he can replace them with that's better.

Lack of any depth and underperforming players was the reason we got pumped by a good Leeds side.

[Sulberto21]

https://sportsgrasp.com/football/you-have-to-see-it-to-believe-it-cooper-on-bielsas-murderball/

Quote

You Have To See It To Believe It: Cooper on Bielsa’s “Murderball”
Liam Cooper opens up on Marcelo Bielsa's training sessions.

It’s just 100%, very chaotic. We do four or five-minute segments, maybe four or five times, with staff outside throwing the ball back in as soon as it goes out. It’s all man-for-man, there’s no escape. But the numbers the lads are putting up in these sessions are ridiculous,” tells Leeds’ captain Liam Cooper, with the feeling of exhaustion yet satisfaction.

In an interview withSPORTbible, he opened up on the training sessions put up by Bielsa and his training staff, how the players coped with it, and finally on Leeds’ promotion back to the Premier League.

The games almost seem easier than the training is! And it’s not just the murderball, the tactical sessions are so in-depth. We always go on the pitch knowing exactly what rival teams are going to do – and if they were to change, we’d have that covered as well.

Marcelo Bielsa’s playing style is very different in the modern world. He excessively focuses on player’s fitness and the tactical playing style of his opponents. His focus on the fitness of the players goes so far, that sources have often reported his sessions similar to that of “military boot camps.”

Not every player can cope up with the Argentine’s philosophy. Many great players have left his team without any significant impact. The recent example of highly regarded center-forward, Jean-Kevin Augustin, comes to mind.

Liam Cooper gives us more insight into the former Athletic Bilbao’s coach training sessions,”You try and prepare yourself mentally for how difficult it’s going to be, but I don’t think you can,” says the 29-year-old. “You can’t be ready for how hard it actually is. It took the lads four, five, six months to get up to top speed; to really think: ‘Yeah, this is us now, we can do this.”

The intensity of the training does not go down the drain. It builds the physique of the players and allows them to cope with any hurdles on the pitch. Leeds’ upward trajectory from a mid-table Championship side to Championship winners within two seasons is a testament to it. Now they will hope, that with Bielsa in the dugout, they reach an even higher level.

I know a lot of guys on here are not a fan of Bielsa but he's a genius. I think Deano should include a similar offshoot of Murderball into the weekly regimen. 

I remember in the old FIFA games on the PS1 you could put a cheat code in and the pitch would have a wall around it. We should make a 1.5 sized pitch with a wall around and make that our Murderball pitch.

Apparently Dean said that he knows they're the fittest team in the league? If that's the case why can't we be the fittest?? 

[villalad21]

3 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

I hope it's not going to be the case all season every game we lose that Smith was "outsmarted"?

Players appeared very tired and plenty put in bad performances. There's no one he can replace them with that's better.

Lack of any depth and underperforming players was the reason we got pumped by a good Leeds side.

And such will be the case if he only use 12 players.

Is he actually trying to kill them?

No but really. He has got to trust his squad more. Leeds squad is consisting of mainly Championship level players and all of them put in a real good shift for Bielsa.

 

[Tomaszk]

Just now, Sulberto21 said:

https://sportsgrasp.com/football/you-have-to-see-it-to-believe-it-cooper-on-bielsas-murderball/

I know a lot of guys on here are not a fan of Bielsa but he's a genius. I think Deano should include a similar offshoot of Murderball into the weekly regimen. 

I remember in the old FIFA games on the PS1 you could put a cheat code in and the pitch would have a wall around it. We should make a 1.5 sized pitch with a wall around and make that our Murderball pitch.

Apparently Dean said that he knows they're the fittest team in the league? If that's the case why can't we be the fittest?? 

Presume everyone wants to be the fittest. That drill is perfect in-game replication for them, don't think it would work as well for us if we aren't going to charge round like nutters during matches.

However, same as us going down without Covid, Leeds were clearly on the way to blowing promotion again without it.

It's unsustainable the way they play, it physically cannot be done unless you have a bigger squad.

Other teams this season will meet Leeds on a day when they have no legs and beat them handsomely.

Great to watch when it works though, a lot of fun, and a lot of dominance.

[GENTLEMAN]

32 minutes ago, Delphinho123 said:

Nothing is clouding my judgment. They were much the better side in the first half and should have been leading at the break. They were running straight through us and the fullbacks were completely exposed time and time again.

Agreed that hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I was saying he should have changed it at half time during the game. Would it have changed the outcome? Maybe not, but I’m allowed to criticise our manager if I don’t think he makes the right decisions - and I’m a huge Smith fan. 

I just don’t think the criticism is warranted just yet. I think capitulation arose after going 1 nil down. If that a continuing pattern say against, Southampton and Arsenal then of course questions should be asked. There were things that worried me too but I’m just loathe to criticise until patterns emerge over a number of games.

Not having they should have been leading up until the goal or the much better side. Full backs were exposed a few times yes, but that’s the risk in our game. Let’s not forget we had one cleared off their line, a potential pen, Grealish run and then Konsa hooked shot from the corner.

I do think Davis maybe could have influenced the game, but he didn’t really against Stoke and just coming back from inj. Smith was ‘gambling’ that the players on the pitch could begin to impose our game on them. The goal comes from Trez not tracking Rodrigo, he realises too late and his recovery sprint is not in time. We capitulated after goal, tried to force and became even more individual. That’s where Smith will have to address. I don’t think it’s a sub thing, rather a mentality thing.

Edited October 24, 2020 by GENTLEMAN

[Tomaszk]

2 minutes ago, villalad21 said:

And such will be the case if he only use 12 players.

Is he actually trying to kill them?

No but really. He has got to trust his squad more. Leeds squad is consisting of mainly Championship level players and all of them put in a real good shift for Bielsa.

You still posting here? Jeez.

[Phil Silvers]

7 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

I hope it's not going to be the case all season every game we lose that Smith was "outsmarted"?

Players appeared very tired and plenty put in bad performances. There's no one he can replace them with that's better.

Lack of any depth and underperforming players was the reason we got pumped by a good Leeds side.

It really was one of those perfect storm moments of too many of us not at it and an average at best striker having a miracle game.

That said I don't understand why they had more energy than us and why that seems to be accepted .

[Sulberto21]

3 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

Presume everyone wants to be the fittest. That drill is perfect in-game replication for them, don't think it would work as well for us if we aren't going to charge round like nutters during matches.

However, same as us going down without Covid, Leeds were clearly on the way to blowing promotion again without it.

It's unsustainable the way they play, it physically cannot be done unless you have a bigger squad.

Other teams this season will meet Leeds on a day when they have no legs and beat them handsomely.

Great to watch when it works though, a lot of fun, and a lot of dominance.

I think we should use it especially for our current run of games because Southampton Arsenal play a high press style although no where near as intense as that mob we faced yesterday. I do agree with you that if we played them exactly the same 15/16 games down the road we would have beaten them. 

We definitely need to take big chances in future games. 2-0 up and we don't lose. 

[Sulberto21]

3 minutes ago, Phil Silvers said:

It really was one of those perfect storm moments of too many of us not at it and an average at best striker having a miracle game.

That said I don't understand why they had more energy than us and why that seems to be accepted .

Everyone of our players were 1/2 % below their own new found levels. Collectively it's a 20% drop. Dean has to recognise this going forward and play Nakamba et Al when needed.

[sharkyvilla]

16 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

https://sportsgrasp.com/football/you-have-to-see-it-to-believe-it-cooper-on-bielsas-murderball/

I know a lot of guys on here are not a fan of Bielsa but he's a genius. I think Deano should include a similar offshoot of Murderball into the weekly regimen. 

I remember in the old FIFA games on the PS1 you could put a cheat code in and the pitch would have a wall around it. We should make a 1.5 sized pitch with a wall around and make that our Murderball pitch.

Apparently Dean said that he knows they're the fittest team in the league? If that's the case why can't we be the fittest?? 

I'm not sure there are many who aren't fans of Bielsa as such, I suspect everyone thinks he is a great, innovative coach.  It's just there have been negative things about Leeds since he took over too (and in the past) and things Dean achieved that he didn't.  One thing we may have done was change our formation, if he goes into such depth with his analysis of the opposition and preparation, maybe we could have sprung something different like play Davis and Watkins together or 3 at the back.  All of this is in hindsight of course, if Jack's shot in the first half rolls another few centimetres or he buries it after that ridiculous run then we probably win and could be hailing Dean even more.  Sometimes you just get beaten on the day.

Edited October 24, 2020 by sharkyvilla

[GENTLEMAN]

5 minutes ago, Tomaszk said:

You still posting here? Jeez.

@villalad21 posted once or twice after beating Liverpool 7-2. Now we need to rename this thread VillaLad’s Marcelo Bielsa appreciation thread 15 hrs after the Leeds game

[striker]

Smith had a ready made blueprint of how to play against Leeds (Wolves) and totally ignored it.

One would hope therefore that Smith will have a recording of the Wolves game in his pocket when Villa play Leeds again.

[Phil Silvers]

1 minute ago, Sulberto21 said:

Everyone of our players were 1/2 % below their own new found levels. Collectively it's a 20% drop. Dean has to recognise this going forward and play Nakamba et Al when needed.

Thats why I was a bit peeved, if we acknowledge this is whats happening then why not counter it with a change that makes a difference rather then full on Bruce attitude of waiting for a bit of individual magic.

[PaulC]

1 minute ago, striker said:

Smith had a ready made blueprint of how to play against Leeds (Wolves) and totally ignored it.

One would hope therefore that Smith will have a recording of the Wolves game in his pocket when Villa play Leeds again.

We're not Wolves. Leeds looked far more up for our game as well 

[Sulberto21]

1 minute ago, Phil Silvers said:

Thats why I was a bit peeved, if we acknowledge this is whats happening then why not counter it with a change that makes a difference rather then full on Bruce attitude of waiting for a bit of individual magic.

It's the first game in about 10 where Dean didn't tweak it during the game. I might have been tempted to go 4-4-2 just to see if we can stem the tide. 

[Laughable Chimp]

If there's one thing I can criticize about Smith, its that I don't think he's a very flexible manager. He seems to me the type that optimizes the team to its best capabilities, and then puts them on the pitch. He doesn't really optimize his team against the particular capabilties of the opposing team and his in game management responding to issues can be suspect and incredibly formulaic.

Edited October 24, 2020 by Laughable Chimp

[PieFacE]

Meh. We've had a fantastic start to the season and one poor performance doesn't change that. Keep up the good work Smith.

[Phil Silvers]

Anyway lads, we've been in worse spots

[a-k]

10 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said:

If there's one thing I can criticize about Smith, its that I don't think he's a very flexible manager. He seems to me the type that optimizes the team to its best capabilities, and then puts them on the pitch. He doesn't really optimize his team against the particular capabilties of the opposing team and his in game management responding to issues can be suspect and incredibly formulaic.

It's one of the few gripes I have with Deano also. He seems pretty intent on playing a certain way and rarely changes that... Even though I thought we would win, I think the formation we play does not suit playing Leeds and probably should have played with 5 at the back, but to be fair we probably didn't have the personnel for that with Hause out, Engles probably not fit for 90 mins, and Elmo not a natural CB.

[HKP90]

13 minutes ago, Sulberto21 said:

Everyone of our players were 1/2 % below their own new found levels. Collectively it's a 20% drop. Dean has to recognise this going forward and play Nakamba et Al when needed.

We did. We got beat by Stoke’s reserves.

Seriously, though, this is a recruitment issue. I think we all thought during the window that we needed a few extra bods in. For whatever reason that didn’t happen.

Now I’m not going to be overly critical, because I’m pretty certain even as a layman that player procurement is not easy. At all. But it’s certainly something that needs to be addressed in the medium term.

Look, the objective for this year had to have been to get a first team that will comfortably survive the drop. That would be progress. Assuming that is what we now have, the next step is to ensure our stay in the nosebleeds by developing a solid squad. That either comes through recruitment, or more organically through development of youth. Thanks to FFP, though, neither is likely over the short term. 
 

We’ve made a great start, but we’re still at the moment an (at best) competitive mid-table side. That is a huge achievement after last year, and hopefully we’ll continue to make solid steady progress.

I dislike Leeds and Bamford as much as the next man, but in the long run that result is meaningless. 
 

UTV!