DCJonah Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 31 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: No ones saying it wasn't a achievement, it was. But that was the Championship, we were under performing Smith got us to click with the best team in the league and it worked out, proving Smith can do it in the Championship, with the best players. But we are now in the Premier League,, a whole new kettle of fish for Smith, he is failing. yes I agree we came up to quick, to quick for Smith. He hasn't got the experience as yet, an it shows, my goodness it shows. We are going into a game tonight with no hope, that's what Smith has brought us in the premier League. I just don't know how you put it all on Smith. He is inexperienced, and we gave him an inexperienced squad, full of players not good enough for the league. Smith might be an abysmal manager at this level, I just don't believe we gave him and us a chance to really find out what he can do. He wasn't good enough to keep this poor squad up, that's clear. I think he might get the chance to bring us back up though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, VillaCas said: No I don’t think we did want him....,I suspect that he did not fit the profile Purslow is pursuing....our loss If that was the situation years ago, villa fans would be up in arms......its football people like managers, who should be signing players or vetoing iffy ones. I don't care, what the modernist say.....its Bolleaux. you wouldn't ask the manager to deal with the finance of the club....it should be horses for courses. Its starting to look like the real reason, they signed Dean Smith, as a smoke screen, so purslow, could run the football show himself...... a strong manager, would tell him to get stuffed. We are doomed Mainwaring, doomed I say. Edited July 8, 2020 by TRO 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 1 minute ago, DCJonah said: I just don't know how you put it all on Smith. He is inexperienced, and we gave him an inexperienced squad, full of players not good enough for the league. Smith might be an abysmal manager at this level, I just don't believe we gave him and us a chance to really find out what he can do. He wasn't good enough to keep this poor squad up, that's clear. I think he might get the chance to bring us back up though. We took Smith with us to the Premier League because the board felt he had the ability to coach our "inexperienced squad" into a Premier League team, this was his chance. If we could have spent 300 million+ I doubt we would have kept Smith and probably brought in another more experienced manager/coach. It's true he was brought in for long term we all know that, but the board believed with the constraints on the budgets he could develop the players we signed into quality. Unfortunately this has not been the case, quite the opposite in fact, as in, a few have regressed. Personally, I thought he was going to be this dynamic coach, who was going to turn a few of our new players into top quality, but unfortunately for us, he has turned out not to not be the Coach we thought he was, no one can disagree with that. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, TRO said: If that was the situation years ago, villa fans would be up in arms......its football people like managers, who should be signing players. I don't care, what the modernist say.....its Bolleaux. you wouldn't aske the manager to deal with the finance of the club....it should be horses for courses. Its starting to look like the real reason, they signed Dean Smith, as a smoke screen, so purslow, could run the football show...... a strong manager, would tell him to get stuffed. We are doomed Mainwaring, doomed I say. Bizarre post not sure where to start Edited July 8, 2020 by Zatman 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, villalad21 said: Dean kept mentioning performance levels when asked about a lack of wins on the press conference today. He really isn't a result man. where can I see the press conference, is there a link? Edited July 8, 2020 by TRO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 7 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: We took Smith with us to the Premier League because the board felt he had the ability to coach our "inexperienced squad" into a Premier League team, this was his chance. If we could have spent 300 million+ I doubt we would have kept Smith and probably brought in another more experienced manager/coach. It's true he was brought in for long term we all know that, but the board believed with the constraints on the budgets he could develop the players we signed into quality. Unfortunately this has not been the case, quite the opposite in fact, as in, a few have regressed. Personally, I thought he was going to be this dynamic coach, who was going to turn a few of our new players into top quality, but unfortunately for us, he has turned out not to not be the Coach we thought he was, no one can disagree with that. That is just about how I see it. spending more than £140 mill was never going to be an option, not matter what the case for it, presents.......so other than what you have said, I don't know what folk was expecting. I think most of us expected Dean to raise the profile of these players, like managers of the past have done......not so. I think many of us thought, he would get the response Wilder and Nuno got from their new fledglings to the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villaluke Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 8 minutes ago, TRO said: where can I see the press conference, is there a link? https://video.avfc.co.uk/home?lang=en 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 7 minutes ago, TRO said: where can I see the press conference, is there a link? You need to make an account on VillaTV. A new platform they launched this year. You'll find it on Villas official web site. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: We took Smith with us to the Premier League because the board felt he had the ability to coach our "inexperienced squad" into a Premier League team, this was his chance. If we could have spent 300 million+ I doubt we would have kept Smith and probably brought in another more experienced manager/coach. It's true he was brought in for long term we all know that, but the board believed with the constraints on the budgets he could develop the players we signed into quality. Unfortunately this has not been the case, quite the opposite in fact, as in, a few have regressed. Personally, I thought he was going to be this dynamic coach, who was going to turn a few of our new players into top quality, but unfortunately for us, he has turned out not to not be the Coach we thought he was, no one can disagree with that. Expecting a coach to turn average to poor players into good Premier league players is a bit much. I doubt pep could turn some of our players into consistently good players at this level. All players will have a ceiling, regardless of who their coach is. Too many of ours are not good enough for this level. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRO Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 10 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Expecting a coach to turn average to poor players into good Premier league players is a bit much. I doubt pep could turn some of our players into consistently good players at this level. All players will have a ceiling, regardless of who their coach is. Too many of ours are not good enough for this level. but thats not what is being said......albeit, I do think Pep would have kept this lot up, yes I do. No one is expecting to see what you suggested turning poor players in to Good Premier League players. but most of us was expecting improvement in them, only Luiz since lockdown has shown that.....I don't doubt your last line and yes of course players will have a ceiling. However, we have all seen improvement of players first hand, managers of the past have done it......Saunders, improve nearly everyone who arrived due to his format of 110% workrate.....he got second tier players from other clubs and moulded them in to a well oiled machine. it was all for one and one for all. some of us thought that was going to happen here, because Dean was reputed to be a coach, who could do that sort of thing......I don't remember too many complaints at the start of the season, when the business had been done, we trusted the club to get it right....and its turned out like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 26 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Expecting a coach to turn average to poor players into good Premier league players is a bit much. I doubt pep could turn some of our players into consistently good players at this level. All players will have a ceiling, regardless of who their coach is. Too many of ours are not good enough for this level. Newcastle have average players too. We've seen that twice against them. Twice we've outperformed them. They didn't look any better than us. But seems like Bruce is getting more out of his team on a consistent basis. Something Smith fails to do. You don't need good PL players to stay up. You just need 11 players who work hard for each other. Are organized and disciplined. This group can perform, but we've not seen it enough. Smith's job is to get his players to perform. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 5 minutes ago, villalad21 said: Newcastle have average players too. We've seen that twice against them. Twice we've outperformed them. They didn't look any better than us. But seems like Bruce is getting more out of his team on a consistent basis. Something Smith fails to do. You don't need good PL players to stay up. You just need 11 players who work hard for each other. Are organized and disciplined. This group can perform, but we've not seen it enough. Smith's job is to get his players to perform. Not sure there is much evidence to support claims like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 Just now, DCJonah said: Not sure there is much evidence to support claims like this. You know there is a middle ground between good and shit right? Westwood the best example. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 15 minutes ago, TRO said: but thats not what is being said......albeit, I do think Pep would have kept this lot up, yes I do. No one is expecting to see what you suggested turning poor players in to Good Premier League players. but most of us was expecting improvement in them, only Luiz since lockdown has shown that.....I don't doubt your last line and yes of course players will have a ceiling. However, we have all seen improvement of players first hand, managers of the past have done it......Saunders, improve nearly everyone who arrived due to his format of 110% workrate.....he got second tier players from other clubs and moulded them in to a well oiled machine. it was all for one and one for all. some of us thought that was going to happen here, because Dean was reputed to be a coach, who could do that sort of thing......I don't remember too many complaints at the start of the season, when the business had been done, we trusted the club to get it right....and its turned out like this. I keep reading this. Improvement from what? Only Heaton played regular Premier league football previously. So what's your baseline to expect improvement from? How do you even judge it? I doubt any of us saw lots of the players we signed previously so what are you basing it on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 36 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Expecting a coach to turn average to poor players into good Premier league players is a bit much. I doubt pep could turn some of our players into consistently good players at this level. All players will have a ceiling, regardless of who their coach is. Too many of ours are not good enough for this level. Where to start ... That’s exactly what a coach should do - work with players to improve them or find a system that suits. Countless managers are doing just this as we speak. We see things differently as I see the managers ceiling being the issue not the players. His track record isn’t stellar and we have regressed even further backwards after his enforced sabbatical. All signs point to him being out of his depth. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 1 minute ago, villalad21 said: You know there is a middle ground between good and shit right? Westwood the best example. I would say in order to stay up, the majority of your team need to be up to the premier league standard, or you need some real top quality, who can win games on their own at times. Sometimes good teams go down because of behind the scenes stuff. I've seen nothing to suggest the majority of our squad are up to it. Not sure how anyone else could claim they have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villalad21 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 1 minute ago, DCJonah said: I would say in order to stay up, the majority of your team need to be up to the premier league standard, or you need some real top quality, who can win games on their own at times. Sometimes good teams go down because of behind the scenes stuff. I've seen nothing to suggest the majority of our squad are up to it. Not sure how anyone else could claim they have. But we've seen twice against Newcastle that we're on par with them. We even look better than them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 Just now, thabucks said: Where to start ... That’s exactly what a coach should do - work with players to improve them or find a system that suits. Countless managers are doing just this as we speak. We see things differently as I see the managers ceiling being the issue not the players. His track record isn’t stellar and we have regressed even further backwards after his enforced sabbatical. All signs point to him being out of his depth. Of course that's what a coach can do. But the worlds best coach can't turn someone into something they aren't. Why do top teams with top coaches spend all this money on proven players if its easy to just go and develop unknown players? As I've said previously, smith might be an abysmal coach, but I'm not sure we gave him a chance to really see what he can do. Clearly he hasn't been able to work miracles but I'm not sure I really hold that against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodgyknees Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 59 minutes ago, Zatman said: Bizarre post not sure where to start Still bitter about Bruce. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 Just now, villalad21 said: But we've seen twice against Newcastle that we're on par with them. We even look better than them. Haha so what? Norwich beat man City. What's your point? Its a 38 game season, the challenge isn't performing well every so often, its being consistent enough over an entire season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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