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Dean Smith

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15 hours ago, TheStagMan said:

That is the only point you react to??????

Its the only one i felt compelled to respond to, because i never heard any fan say it....but equally,  is that the only one you was bothered about?😀

Edited by TRO

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56 minutes ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

I agree that right this instant is probably not the classiest thing to do as a football club, but I am of the belief we need to replace him before next season unless we want another relegation battle. Two names I'd put forward to be manager would be Ralf Rangnick, who previously managed RB Leipzig and now works in a development role for Red Bull Salzburg. The other is Rafa Benitez who obviously now manages in China. I don't think either would be unobtainable but we might have to pay their existing clubs money to get their services. 

I swear people on this forum are obsessed with Rafa Benitez, he did a shit job at Newcastle for years before retiring in China on about £12m a year. Plays the exact same football as Steve Bruce and very publicly is not liked by Purslow. You say he's not unobtainable, you are wrong. We couldn't afford him even if we wanted to, and we definately don't want to as the man in charge of those decisions hates him. There's more chance of this season finishing with a 9 game winning run for us then us appointing Benitez at any point

I've never heard of the other guy so can't comment on him 

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1 hour ago, OxfordVillan said:

How do you think sacking Dean Smith during a football shutdown due to a pandemic would look, what type of press coverage do you think we’d receive? I’ve read some of your posts above where you say you don’t know who should replace Dean Smith and that’s the job of the owners, but I beg to differ. By calling for a sacking you have to have a good idea of the replacement, otherwise your argument is mute. Which alternative to Dean Smith is viable, better qualified, obtainable? Unless you can give solid answers to the aforementioned, you’re calling for a sacking with no idea of any credible replacement. And that’s not particularly clever.

I hear what you are saying and you have made some fair points but.."..

I have suggested two 'possible' replacements ( please revisit my previous post ).

You haven't stated why you think Dean is a 'success' ( note inverted comma's , not trying to take the 'mick')

I never said I was clever.....I'm just giving my opinion , like you.......

ATB

VLD.

 

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15 hours ago, MapleVilla said:

Exactly this. If we get relegated I want Smith to stay. If we find ourselves in the relegation places in the championship come November then that's the time to get someone else in. 

Even if we hadn't got promoted and stayed in the championship we'd still need to rebuild to a certain degree. Except we would have had next to no money with FFP restrictions. The promotion has given us a cushion to spend some money on new players and help boost our profit etc. The problem is our squad needed so much work to begin with, on top of competing in a new, much higher level league we had to spend way more than most teams just to haave a squad that could try and compete. 

"A stitch in time saves nine"......the moral is if you wait for the writing on the wall to be common knowledge.....its probably too late.

to wait until we reached a point that you suggest, is not leadership, its complacency.

Dean needs to explain to the club, what he understands about defensive capability and should the rationale be acceptable, maybe he should continue.....but to just drift from game to game getting mullered, is not leadership or proactive decision making.

There will be many opinions on the summer, signings and of course integrating that many is tricky to say the least,, but not having seen any improvement in the slightest in any of them, is worrying and not right....personally, i think we could have signed better types to help us to be harder to beat.....i think we have focused on offence too much at the expense of  durability and resillience....just my opinion.

The argument of stability and giving managers time is credible, but it is just as equally, questionable.....if you appoint the wrong manager, and give him time, that is not stability, its complacency.....do we keep dishing out 3 year tenures, until we get it right?

Dean Smith has given us some good football to watch no doubt about that and that to say he is still learning, is fair, most of younger managers are......but the issue we have is not one you can just run with until it corrects itself.....its serious and needs an emergency approach to it.

Dean has now had 18 months and 63 league games, for us to form our opinions and there has been some good as well as bad for me in fairly equal measure.

He is not going to be sacked, now....but if we see 10 losses until the end of the season, I would expect to see the mood change.

Finally, I would say this, IMO.....he has to get the team to get to grips with stopping the opposition from having their own way with us.....I feel sure that will be ultimately the deciding factor of his future with us.

I sincerely hope he manages it.

Edited by TRO

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P.S.

Still waiting for anybody to forward a reason to keep Dean that reflects his tactical brilliance or astute buying in the transfer market.

Most on here simply describe him as ' a nice bloke', which he probably is....

'Nice blokes' tend to disappear in the harsh world of football management unfortunately...

ATB

VLD

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6 minutes ago, Graham t said:

P.S.

Still waiting for anybody to forward a reason to keep Dean that reflects his tactical brilliance or astute buying in the transfer market.

Most on here simply describe him as ' a nice bloke', which he probably is....

'Nice blokes' tend to disappear in the harsh world of football management unfortunately...

ATB

VLD

By the same token I've not really seen a persuasive argument for saying he has failed and should be sacked.  He exceeded expectations in getting us promoted so quick, exceeded expectations in the League Cup and looks like we are staying in the Prem despite having a flawed and inexperienced squad.  Let's just wait and see what happens with the rest of the season first, then we can plan properly for whatever comes. 

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4 hours ago, Graham t said:

Dean was given his contract extension when when the club was in 15 th position 

 

and only 4 points above the relegation zone. Obviously if we were to finish in that position then I think every fan would be happy and Dean would be deserving of a new contract , maybe. 

I thought that giving the manager a contract extension so early in the season was crazy as it was too early to judge the managers performance.

It appears that I was correct. Since then the club has been sliding steadily towards relegation with the teams performances getting worse ( by and large ) every week.

Wether sacking Dean would save us from relegation is impossible to forecast but I just don't see him as a Premier manager, he simply has no tactical skills ( just look at our defence ) and the player recruitment has been an embarrassing waste of money.

Some may disagree with my analysis and I welcome his supporters posting on here and expanding on his abilities.

ATB

VLD.

When the contract extension was issued, i thought it was fair....promotion and respectable league position at the time deserved it.....i think the objective was also one of encouragement too, which was prudent at the time.....intrinsically driven individuals respond to encouragement, well...i guess that was the clubs intention.

Hindsight is an exact science, unfortunately since the reward, things have turned sour, for whatever reasons that have caused it.

I hope Dean can get through this, but he has to show snippets of life / improvement in games that our waiting is not all in vain.

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8 minutes ago, Graham t said:

I hear what you are saying and you have made some fair points but.."..

I have suggested two 'possible' replacements ( please revisit my previous post ).

You haven't stated why you think Dean is a 'success' ( note inverted comma's , not trying to take the 'mick')

I never said I was clever.....I'm just giving my opinion , like you.......

ATB

VLD.

 

I don’t think Dean has been a success this season, indeed I think he has displayed a certain naivety in this 1st season back in the top flight. But sometimes you have to be patient, be careful what you wish for etc. The Premier League is an incredibly hard place to be successful, whatever successful means to individual clubs. I look around at other clubs and there aren’t actually many content sets of fans! Spurs have a multiple winner as manager and they’re not happy, Southampton fans were apoplectic earlier in the season, Newcastle fans unhappy with Bruce, Arsenal fans unhappy. I think our situation this season is down to more factors than just the manager. We’re inexperienced almost top to bottom of the club, Purslow the exception. We HAD to buy the numbers we bought to get a squad together, and because of FFP that meant that Premier League experience would be thin on the ground. I think dean underestimated how difficult the Premier League would be, and there’s a case for him not adapting soon enough. But there are also some clear examples of awful decisions that have gone against us, costing us pts and ultimately a bit of confidence. 
What I’m trying to say is that a few clubs have demanded change, and been worse off by changing. I don’t see anyone out there right now that is better placed than what we currently have, and is obtainable or viable. If we remained an Premier League club next season and Pochettino was still available then it’d probably be good business to try and get him, if he could be persuaded. That’d be the type of appointment that I could understand. But FWIW I’d be sticking with Dean Smith to November next season, regardless of which league we’re in. Unless something exceptional happens which dictates a more hasty departure. 

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8 minutes ago, OxfordVillan said:

I don’t think Dean has been a success this season, indeed I think he has displayed a certain naivety in this 1st season back in the top flight. But sometimes you have to be patient, be careful what you wish for etc. The Premier League is an incredibly hard place to be successful, whatever successful means to individual clubs. I look around at other clubs and there aren’t actually many content sets of fans! Spurs have a multiple winner as manager and they’re not happy, Southampton fans were apoplectic earlier in the season, Newcastle fans unhappy with Bruce, Arsenal fans unhappy. I think our situation this season is down to more factors than just the manager. We’re inexperienced almost top to bottom of the club, Purslow the exception. We HAD to buy the numbers we bought to get a squad together, and because of FFP that meant that Premier League experience would be thin on the ground. I think dean underestimated how difficult the Premier League would be, and there’s a case for him not adapting soon enough. But there are also some clear examples of awful decisions that have gone against us, costing us pts and ultimately a bit of confidence. 
What I’m trying to say is that a few clubs have demanded change, and been worse off by changing. I don’t see anyone out there right now that is better placed than what we currently have, and is obtainable or viable. If we remained an Premier League club next season and Pochettino was still available then it’d probably be good business to try and get him, if he could be persuaded. That’d be the type of appointment that I could understand. But FWIW I’d be sticking with Dean Smith to November next season, regardless of which league we’re in. Unless something exceptional happens which dictates a more hasty departure. 

Fair post...good comments.

For me, I am easily pleased, success for is measured by how many new recruits show noticable improvement in their game....trophies and titles can come when the team is ready......if a team shows improvement in what they do, that is success for me...and of course there are degrees of it.

I have been disappointed in the development of this seasons recruits and speculation will undoubtedly escalate accordingly.....its unusual to see no one shine, only Samatta has shown anything and he is one of the latest to arrive.

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I think you have made some interesting points here and they are worth making of course.....but......apart from sort of hoping for the best and crossing our fingers I don't personally think Dean is the answer.

A forum is all about opinions and that is what makes them interesting and worthwhile so I will respectfully disagree with you here as I simply don't see the 'progress 'you see....

ATB.

VLD.

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Oops,

my reply was intended to 'oxfordvilla' post. 

Sorry for any confusion.....

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15 hours ago, villalad21 said:

I don't see any evidence in Dean learning.

If anything we've been getting steadily worse as the season's progressed.

Sadly its one of the bones of contention.

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1 hour ago, weedman said:

I swear people on this forum are obsessed with Rafa Benitez, he did a shit job at Newcastle for years before retiring in China on about £12m a year. Plays the exact same football as Steve Bruce and very publicly is not liked by Purslow. You say he's not unobtainable, you are wrong. We couldn't afford him even if we wanted to, and we definately don't want to as the man in charge of those decisions hates him. There's more chance of this season finishing with a 9 game winning run for us then us appointing Benitez at any point

I've never heard of the other guy so can't comment on him 

On Purslow I can't comment, though I'm really not sure he's doing a great job as our CEO anyway. What I pull you up on:

  • "he did a shit job at Newcastle"- erm, no he didn't. Won the Championship, finished top 10 first season back, and comfortably safe last season despite not spending a great deal. 
  • "We couldn't afford him even if we wanted to" - you do know we've spent £150m this season don't you? How much are we talking here? A billion to release him from his contract? He won't be cheap of course but saying we couldn't afford him is ridiculous 

 

I agree with you he doesn't play great football and we would be more defensive, but at least we wouldn't concede 3 goals a game like we do under the incumbent. As I've said many, many times, we won't be able to play Dean Smith football and be successful until we have good enough players to do so - do you honestly believe Dean Smith can attract those players to get us competing in the league and still playing that type of football?

 

Regardless of the point you're making, as TRO said, us as fans are not here to name suitable replacements anyway. We don't get paid for scouting the globe for the best managers to do this job - that is up to the club to do that. I'd never heard of Nuno before he took the Wolves job but we can all agree he's done a fantastic job for them and we would love him to be managing us at this moment in time.

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6 hours ago, VillaFaninLondon said:

On Purslow I can't comment, though I'm really not sure he's doing a great job as our CEO anyway. What I pull you up on:

 

Purslow sacked him from his dream job, the one he has struggled come to terms with since

Image result for rafa benitez painting

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1 hour ago, romavillan said:

YEah just a nice bloke who took over a **** basket case 15th in the Championship and got them promoted by randomly getting them to play some of the best football I can remember seeing Villa play by just being nice to them down at bodymoor heath.

Yes and the club is now on its way back to the championship . Is that what you want?

ATB.

vLD.

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22 minutes ago, Graham t said:

Yes and the club is now on its way back to the championship . Is that what you want?

ATB.

vLD.

The plan for this season was to get promoted. Deano is being punished for his own over achievement 

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4 minutes ago, Zatman said:

The plan for this season was to get promoted. Deano is being punished for his own over achievement 

Getting relegated Isn't an ' achievement ' me old cocker.....

ATB.

VLD.

 

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17 hours ago, Graham t said:

Yes , that's the million dollar question isn't it. A young , unproven Graham Potter or an old experienced Sam Allardyce? I honestly don't know. What I do see is that Smith is failing.

ATB.

VLD.

You mean Graham Potter who is just as inexperienced as Dean and doing just marginally better in the league with an established PL squad?

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59 minutes ago, Keyblade said:

You mean Graham Potter who is just as inexperienced as Dean and doing just marginally better in the league with an established PL squad?

I think both of them are very good managers with scope to improve, do you think they are good managers?

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