Zatman Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 1 hour ago, Peter Griffin said: Not quite the Lansbury goal. It can be argued that goal shouldn't have stood, personally I think it was a goal but I can see why some would argue it shouldn't. Like many goals there can be debate regarding them. No debate with the Ghost goal What is the argument that the Lansbury goal shouldnt have stood? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Just now, thabucks said: Why shouldn’t I ? But to answer your question Smith has been given the requisite funds, time and patience for 3 years now. He has shown he can adapt and learn but there comes a time when you cannot keep being hung up past achievements to justify stagnation. Our recent form could be a blip or could be that Smith has plateaued. I have no interest in what happened 2-3 years ago when looking at the present and beyond. Smith will need to show he can deal with being an established prem manager and increasing expectations that come with the territory. To finish above midtable? I'd strongly disagree with that when you compare the cost of our squads and wage bills with those teams you'd expect us to take over. What have we done recruitment wise that makes us so much better than the 5 or 6 other teams that would aim to finish in that top half or Europe? I agree with the last part but those expectations need to be realistic. IMO finishing between 8th and 13th is pretty realistic, with the top end being great and 13th being disappointing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 27 minutes ago, jim said: Absolutely this! I saw it mentioned the other day it was a “miracle” he got us up that year. It was a good achievement no doubt but let’s not forget we had the one of the strongest teams in the Championship that was massively under achieving under Bruce. However, we were what, 3/4 points off the playoffs when Smith came in? With 90 odd points to play for. We strengthened further in the January so for me, getting to the playoffs and going up was good but certainly not a “miracle”. We had one senior centre back who was crippled 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, jim said: Reina was the following season tbf. But we shouldn’t ignore the fact that team was amongst the strongest in the league and reaching the playoffs and going up was not some epic achievement. We had a weaker side with a cabbage head in charge the season before and got to the playoff final. Yes, good spot, for some reason I had him joining for our promotion push but it was our relegation fight. My mitigating factors are Covid and getting older . I hadn't considered that about the season before, good point. Although, it was ultimately beneficial that we lost to Fulham I am still really pissed with Bruce for the way we approached that game Edited October 28, 2021 by Peter Griffin Fixed a typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 1 minute ago, Zatman said: What is the argument that the Lansbury goal shouldnt have stood? The phase of play, as I said I believe it should have be given but I have also seen other people's perspective on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zatman Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 1 minute ago, Peter Griffin said: The phase of play, as I said I believe it should have be given but I have also seen other people's perspective on it Which phase of play? The fake diving call on Grealish So confused a Villa fan would even defend that bullshit decision 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 There's a table out there that shows how the table would have been in 2019/20 if VAR wasn't used. Surprise surprise, Bournemouth and Watford still both got relegated. In fact, we even moved up a place ahead of the venerated Brighton and Hove Albion. Inaccuracy aside, bringing up the Sheffield United incident is some goofy Leeds United fan type shit, and seeing it being invoked by Villa fans to berate our manager is embarrassing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foreveryoung Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 18 minutes ago, DCJonah said: What are your reasons that we should expect more right now, at this point in the journey? I'd love to know. Bailey, Ing's and Buendia, better squad depth, Smith 3 years in the job, more experienced coach. No longer dependent on 1 player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 5 minutes ago, DCJonah said: To finish above midtable? I'd strongly disagree with that when you compare the cost of our squads and wage bills with those teams you'd expect us to take over. What have we done recruitment wise that makes us so much better than the 5 or 6 other teams that would aim to finish in that top half or Europe? I agree with the last part but those expectations need to be realistic. IMO finishing between 8th and 13th is pretty realistic, with the top end being great and 13th being disappointing. There seems to be a growing problem with our spending that some ebay to use it as a stick to beat Smith with but they're being very blinkered with it, yes we've spent money but we've spent money due to a huge turnover of players very quickly Other teams have also spent money, other teams have spent more money, other teams have spent more money on fewer players and other teams have had a longer more stabilised time to spend that money Our spending is about 10th or 11th in the league Funnily enough that's around where we will be too... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 1 minute ago, foreveryoung said: Bailey, Ing's and Buendia, better squad depth, Smith 3 years in the job, more experienced coach. No longer dependent on 1 player. Like always, you ignore the rest of the league. Has every other team stood still? Are we the only team with that ambition? It's our 3rd year back in the league. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 5 minutes ago, Keyblade said: There's a table out there that shows how the table would have been in 2019/20 if VAR wasn't used. Surprise surprise, Bournemouth and Watford still both got relegated. In fact, we even moved up a place ahead of the venerated Brighton and Hove Albion. Inaccuracy aside, bringing up the Sheffield United incident is some goofy Leeds United fan type shit, and seeing it being invoked by Villa fans to berate our manager is embarrassing. Looking at the facts is always a smart thing to do and I expect Deano and Purslow are doing that. If fans want to ignore the facts that is their prerogative. Personally, I like to judge Villa objectively. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 9 minutes ago, DCJonah said: To finish above midtable? I'd strongly disagree with that when you compare the cost of our squads and wage bills with those teams you'd expect us to take over. What have we done recruitment wise that makes us so much better than the 5 or 6 other teams that would aim to finish in that top half or Europe? I agree with the last part but those expectations need to be realistic. IMO finishing between 8th and 13th is pretty realistic, with the top end being great and 13th being disappointing. Leicester say hi . But the correlation is there between wages and league positions overall granted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 5 minutes ago, foreveryoung said: Bailey, Ing's and Buendia, better squad depth, Smith 3 years in the job, more experienced coach. No longer dependent on 1 player. 2 of those players have fitness problems so far this season Maybe 2nd half of the year they all click and we move up the table and your expectation is met 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Albrighton Posted October 28, 2021 VT Supporter Share Posted October 28, 2021 9 minutes ago, Zatman said: We had one senior centre back who was crippled And 3 wins out of the previous 12 (or 1 out of the previous 10 if you prefer). The sort of form that Smith would rightly be criticised for but no doubt that was just the perfect springboard for him coming in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 4 minutes ago, villa4europe said: There seems to be a growing problem with our spending that some ebay to use it as a stick to beat Smith with but they're being very blinkered with it, yes we've spent money but we've spent money due to a huge turnover of players very quickly Other teams have also spent money, other teams have spent more money, other teams have spent more money on fewer players and other teams have had a longer more stabilised time to spend that money Our spending is about 10th or 11th in the league Funnily enough that's around where we will be too... It amazes me how those critical of Smith just pretend no other teams exist. Spending and wages are in line with midtable. But thats not good enough because they say so. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 17 minutes ago, jim said: A shambles that was a gnats dick away from the playoff places when Smith arrived. To be fair yeah it was an easy job to get in to the playoffs All he had to do was go on a club record streak of wins... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keyblade Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Just now, villa4europe said: There seems to be a growing problem with our spending that some ebay to use it as a stick to beat Smith with but they're being very blinkered with it, yes we've spent money but we've spent money due to a huge turnover of players very quickly Other teams have also spent money, other teams have spent more money, other teams have spent more money on fewer players and other teams have had a longer more stabilised time to spend that money Our spending is about 10th or 11th in the league Funnily enough that's around where we will be too... Also crucially, many of these clubs were spending what we've just spent in the last few years while we were in the Championship. Apparently we're supposed to surpass these clubs in just a couple of years and a couple hundred million. It betrays a complete lack of awareness of anything going on in the PL behind Villa. It's tunnel vision. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 3 minutes ago, thabucks said: Leicester say hi . But the correlation is there between wages and league positions overall granted. Leicester say hi? What does that mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa4europe Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 Just now, DCJonah said: It amazes me how those critical of Smith just pretend no other teams exist. Spending and wages are in line with midtable. But thats not good enough because they say so. Part of the problem is there's the whole banter behind football now Spurs are shit, arsenal are shit, Everton are shit, everyone is shit... We are on the up, we have ambition they don't... We have spent £350m we should be catching them... They're still £500m+ teams full of experienced internationals These other teams aren't as bad as the media the WhatsApp groups and the various bibles like to make out, mid table is tight 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thabucks Posted October 28, 2021 Share Posted October 28, 2021 5 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Leicester say hi? What does that mean? Apologies… I misread and Interpreted your post wrong making my post pointless! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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