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Anwar El Ghazi


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5 hours ago, Stockport_Villain said:

You’ve spent a lot of time there to make a point and taken part of my comment instead of reading the whole comment. The whole comment stands in that he misses too many to make it at this level, the Everton element of the comment was further evidence not what the comment was based on. Maybe you should find a hobby.

Mate, that took about 60 seconds.

Maybe u should take IT lessons?

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4 hours ago, theboyangel said:

Totally agree - despite him being the fan’s scapegoat du jour, his stats and returns weren’t bad at all last season.

 

I can not disagree more on any post on this forum than this, sorry.

Ghazi- stats what were they like, cant be impressive, I mean hed run at the defence and would find position but there was just nothing, bad passing, bad finishing.

Dont think it's bad fan hate, more like fans waking up to the fact hes not a premier player.

Ghazi and returns, I spose you could call this a bad return at the catalogue that never arrives and you never see your money back.

 

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26 minutes ago, MotoMkali said:

What 4 goals and 4 assists last season. You want want to know who else had that return sarr and Zaha. Players who people like you would be cumming over if we announced them. He should have had a bout 10 assists but our strikers could finish and whilst he certainly bollocksed a lot of chances. People were jizzing over Tammy who **** up easy chances at about the same rate as el ghazi.

If you want to criticise a player don't be hypocritical. El ghazi is a perfectly capable winger at this level and is easily worth 10-12 million. Give him a ball to run onto and he will beat his man but if you are expecting him to take it past 2 or 3 players from a stand still he isn't going to do because only a handful of players in the world can do it and he isn't one of them. 

You are merely going after el ghazi because hourihane is not a valid target anymore. 

I do not think I'm going after Ghazi because Hourihane isnt a target anymore, have a look at all my history of Hourihane posts I never was once on the side of getting rid of the bloke.

Ghazi isnt a prem player, his attitude sucks for a start and has changed massively since he signed for Villa, while on Loan he was a good lad in the championship.

He may of got himself some stats but stats do not speak for his temperament on the pitch does it, it's been awful at times.

No your right Ghazi cant dribble round 2 or 3 players and in a winger at the top level that's what you partly need. In his role neither Trez or Ghazi are good enough, the only thing that makes Trez better is his hard work and willingness to get a goal. 

I don't know how many times last season witnessed Ghazi miss in front of goal, I bet Hes in record books for misses smack bang in front of a keeper in a whole season. Imagine if he had scored those goal, we may of not been in as much of the S**t we were in at end of the season.

Doesn't matter what any of us say here really, Ghazi will be gone one way or another soon because those Coaching know hes not good enough. It may not be this season but next seasons window Id put a bet be Ghazi will be sold or at most lost amongst the players who can put in a performance at the top level.

I would sooner have Tammy than Ghazi, you cant even compare the two look at what Tammy did for us in the championship compared to Ghazi. Tammy had to many a time come support midfield or Wingers because Grealish were the only real player making things work for large parts of last season.  We would not be at the play offs if it was not for Tammy/Tuanzebe/Mings and Ghazi coming in and yes we would also not be in the premier if it was not for the Ghazi goal. But that's the past and now he should be judged on last season and simply Ghazi was not good enough and a good reason as to why we were where we were. Why do you think that after project start Smith lost confidence in Ghazi and he was not starting, again simply not putting in the effort compared to other players.

Now I'm all for Ghazi proving me wrong, I couldnt wish for more than any player we have coming on that pitch and kicking ass, but if they cant do that you shouldnt be anywhere near the first eleven. Players have to prove themselves every night when the chips are down, if they cant then you slip. This is a business as much as it's a sport now and if your not making everything count on the pitch you leave yourself open to be replaced by better and that is the position Ghazi is in I think.

Edited by Dave-R
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3 hours ago, MotoMkali said:

What 4 goals and 4 assists last season. You want want to know who else had that return sarr and Zaha. Players who people like you would be cumming over if we announced them. He should have had a bout 10 assists but our strikers could finish and whilst he certainly bollocksed a lot of chances. People were jizzing over Tammy who **** up easy chances at about the same rate as el ghazi.

If you want to criticise a player don't be hypocritical. El ghazi is a perfectly capable winger at this level and is easily worth 10-12 million. Give him a ball to run onto and he will beat his man but if you are expecting him to take it past 2 or 3 players from a stand still he isn't going to do because only a handful of players in the world can do it and he isn't one of them. 

You are merely going after el ghazi because hourihane is not a valid target anymore. 

Sarr and Zaha aren't exactly high return players either though. Honestly those 2 might've been the most overrated player in the PL when you consider their actual stats last season. The comparisons to Zaha in particularly were already being made last season to show that El Ghazi was in fact better than people were giving him credit for, when in fact it should've been taken the other way. Its not that El Ghazi was good, its that Zaha (at least in terms of goals and assists output) was shit.

Secondly, I've seen you use xG stats before I believe, correct me if I'm wrong. But if so, I think you know very well that the claim that he should've had about 10 assists if our strikers could finish is demonstrably false, at least according to xA statistics which attempt to measure the expected assists a player would get if the person who ended up in the final shot had average finishing ability.

https://understat.com/player/5612

Understat shows that it should've been 2.88 instead of the 4 he actually got. Meaning the chances he created were actually worse than what his assist talley suggests, its just they were finished very well. Literally the opposite of what you suggested. 

Lastly, I don't think he's easily worth 12-13 million, but this is a lot more subjective. Personally, I'd put it somewhere around 8-10 million.

Edited by Laughable Chimp
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2 hours ago, Dave-R said:

I do not think I'm going after Ghazi because Hourihane isnt a target anymore, have a look at all my history of Hourihane posts I never was once on the side of getting rid of the bloke.

Ghazi isnt a prem player, his attitude sucks for a start and has changed massively since he signed for Villa, while on Loan he was a good lad in the championship.

He may of got himself some stats but stats do not speak for his temperament on the pitch does it, it's been awful at times.

No your right Ghazi cant dribble round 2 or 3 players and in a winger at the top level that's what you partly need. In his role neither Trez or Ghazi are good enough, the only thing that makes Trez better is his hard work and willingness to get a goal. 

I don't know how many times last season witnessed Ghazi miss in front of goal, I bet Hes in record books for misses smack bang in front of a keeper in a whole season. Imagine if he had scored those goal, we may of not been in as much of the S**t we were in at end of the season.

Doesn't matter what any of us say here really, Ghazi will be gone one way or another soon because those Coaching know hes not good enough. It may not be this season but next seasons window Id put a bet be Ghazi will be sold or at most lost amongst the players who can put in a performance at the top level.

I would sooner have Tammy than Ghazi, you cant even compare the two look at what Tammy did for us in the championship compared to Ghazi. Tammy had to many a time come support midfield or Wingers because Grealish were the only real player making things work for large parts of last season.  We would not be at the play offs if it was not for Tammy/Tuanzebe/Mings and Ghazi coming in and yes we would also not be in the premier if it was not for the Ghazi goal. But that's the past and now he should be judged on last season and simply Ghazi was not good enough and a good reason as to why we were where we were. Why do you think that after project start Smith lost confidence in Ghazi and he was not starting, again simply not putting in the effort compared to other players.

Now I'm all for Ghazi proving me wrong, I couldnt wish for more than any player we have coming on that pitch and kicking ass, but if they cant do that you shouldnt be anywhere near the first eleven. Players have to prove themselves every night when the chips are down, if they cant then you slip. This is a business as much as it's a sport now and if your not making everything count on the pitch you leave yourself open to be replaced by better and that is the position Ghazi is in I think.

Please there are probably 10 men in the league who can beat multiple players on a consistent basis. Mahrez, sterling, Salah, Mane, firminho, Zaha, traore, saint-maximan, Jack, Maddison, auba. You could maybe add someone like aguero to that list or son but it is definitely less than 20 and you are expecting a winger for a relegation said to have to be able to do that? No el ghazi beats his man about 50% of the time which is good enough for a prem player but he can't beat the 2nd or 3rd player surrounding him due to our lack of movement.

It is embarrassing as a villa fan to have people who slate a player so badly when he has done his best for us. Yes he struggles with consistency but so does everyone but the best players. You act like he doesn't work hard but he seems to track back as much as trez yet you all laud him. How many times last season did trez or mcginn not track the runner into the box from the wing last season to put us level or behind was it 5 or 10 times? It can't have been any less. So either keep uniform standards between players or admit you are being biased and blaming a perfectly average Premier league player. 

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11 minutes ago, Laughable Chimp said:

Sarr and Zaha aren't exactly high return players either though. Honestly those 2 might've been the most overrated player in the PL when you consider their actual stats last season. The comparisons to Zaha in particularly were already being made last season to show that El Ghazi was in fact better than people were giving him credit for, when in fact it should've been taken the other way. Its not that El Ghazi was good, its that Zaha (at least in terms of goals and assists output) was shit.

Secondly, I've seen you use xG stats before I believe, correct me if I'm wrong. But if so, I think you know very well that the claim that he should've had about 10 assists if our strikers could finish is demonstrably false, at least according to xA statistics which attempt to measure the expected assists a player would get if the person who ended up in the final shot had average finishing ability.

https://understat.com/player/5612

Understat shows that it should've been 2.88 instead of the 4 he actually got. Meaning the chances he created were actually worse than what his assist talley suggests, its just they were finished very well. Literally the opposite of what you suggested. 

Lastly, I don't think he's easily worth 12-13 million, but this is a lot more subjective. Personally, I'd put it somewhere around 8-10 million.

I think you should also understand that xg and assists don't take in to account that our players never got on the end of crosses when they really really should have. Was that not our biggest complaint against samatta and Davis last season that they didn't move in the box or gamble or even get a touch on some of the peaches of balls that were put in by our players? I can think of 2 against Newcastle since restart, one against Sheffield. There are probably more as well but I can't quite recall. 

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6 minutes ago, MotoMkali said:

I think you should also understand that xg and assists don't take in to account that our players never got on the end of crosses when they really really should have. Was that not our biggest complaint against samatta and Davis last season that they didn't move in the box or gamble or even get a touch on some of the peaches of balls that were put in by our players? I can think of 2 against Newcastle since restart, one against Sheffield. There are probably more as well but I can't quite recall. 

No, actually I don't remember either being large complaints against Samatta or Davis. The biggest complaint against Davis was that the boy can't finish. Whilst Samatta was just useless in general aside from his work ethic. Perhaps one of those complaints was him not getting at the end of those crosses, but I doubt those would bias El Ghazi's xA stat so negatively that it would create a completely opposite view of his chance creation last season. Certainly not to the point where he should've gotten 10 assists instead of the 4 he got.

Edited by Laughable Chimp
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1 minute ago, Laughable Chimp said:

No, actually I don't remember either being large complaints against Samatta or Davis. The biggest complaint against Davis was that the boy can't finish. Whilst Samatta was just useless in general aside from his work ethic. Perhaps one of those complaints was him not getting at the end of those crosses, but I doubt those would bias El Ghazi's xA stat so negatively that it would create a completely opposite view of his chance creation last season.

In the games I watched very few of our players actually put their foot on a cross even if it was only a foot away.

Also XA will only really be accurate with a huge volume of chances not a bunch of good ones. 

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1 minute ago, MotoMkali said:

In the games I watched very few of our players actually put their foot on a cross even if it was only a foot away.

Also XA will only really be accurate with a huge volume of chances not a bunch of good ones. 

I've been reading this several times but I'm not really sure what you mean here. xA will be accurate to what? And how huge is the volume needed?

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1 hour ago, Laughable Chimp said:

I've been reading this several times but I'm not really sure what you mean here. xA will be accurate to what? And how huge is the volume needed?

I'm saying that for xa to accurately represent the number of goals assisted you would need a large volume of attempts. I mean obviously el ghazi got lucky with one of his assists Jack's goal against united but I also feel that our strikers missed plenty of simple chances that he created. 

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2 hours ago, bannedfromHandV said:

I wouldn’t be too disappointed to see him leave, I think he’s improved the least since being here and hasn’t shown any signs of doing so this season in the two cup games.

And yet scored in one.

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