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John McGinn


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12 minutes ago, PieFacE said:

Yeah it's worrying about McGinns yellow card situation. 

That’d explain why he was absolutely furious with Elmo for giving the ball away that led to him pulling their guy back.

Its not an exaggeration to say losing him would be a potential disaster.

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I guess the best course is to play him in the Bolton and Millwall games, hope that he doesn’t collect any more, (hopefully) pick up the necessary points and then rest him for the final two games?

A bit surprised there’s no reset at 46 games though.

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1 minute ago, terrytini said:

That’d explain why he was absolutely furious with Elmo for giving the ball away that led to him pulling their guy back.

Its not an exaggeration to say losing him would be a potential disaster.

I would have thought losing Jack or Mings would have been a potential disaster too. 

We’re a different beast now mate.

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The more I rewatch that clip.......

This is the 94 th minute. just days after that Herculean effort against Rotherham, and his 3rd in a week. To have the mental alertness, the drive, the energy, and the ability, to pull that out the bag ..........words fail me. 

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1 hour ago, wilko154 said:

No I've checked this tonight, they continue into the playoffs.

Just reading about this, are you sure it applies to the play offs? Unless I’m reading it wrong? 

Quote

Therefore, the cut-off dates for receiving a sanction as a result of accumulating cautions in league matches only are:

Number of cautions Cut-off date [inclusive]

 Five [Premier League] Following 19 league fixtures

 Five [EFL] Following 19 league fixtures

 Five [National League] Following 23 league fixtures

 10 [Premier League Following 32 league fixtures 

 10 [EFL] Following 37 league fixtures

 10 [National League] Following 37 league fixtures

 15 [All leagues] *End of the season**

Quote

N.B. Discipline in the EFL Trophy is competition specific and remains unchanged from last season.

* The FA Women’s Super League does not have cut-off dates. Automatic suspensions for players accumulating 5, 10, 15 cautions etc. will take effect at any stage during the season.

** This does not apply to play-off matches.

http://www.thefa.com/news/2018/jul/31/red-yellow-cards-technical-area-2018-19

Edit - Re-reading that means the cut off date doesn’t apply to play off matches, doesn’t it? Balls.

Edited by Shropshire Lad
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There is no way that McGinn doesn't get 2 yellow cards in a potential 6 future games. That means he'd miss any final.

Not worth the risk, pick up a yellow card in each of the next two matches please. Missing for Leeds, Norwich and First Leg. If he plays his part in next two games and basically assures us of Playoffs then we can forcibly rest him for the two dead games and hope someone else can hold the fort in the first leg.

It might mean a petulant kick of the ball away or something but I hope we're clever about this. It'd be a disaster to lose him for any significant games.

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6 hours ago, wilko154 said:

No I've checked this tonight, they continue into the playoffs.

It's a tough one now, chances are he will pickup two bookings by the end of the season.

 

Bolton

Millwall

Leeds - 2nd booking here he misses Norwich and both Semi's.

Norwich - 2nd booking here he misses all of the playoffs. 

Playoff Semi

Playoff Semi

Playoff Final

 

We would be better off letting him pick up two against Bolton and Millwall and going one Semi Final without him... a massive gamble though.

Why not get 2 yellows against Bolton? Will the bans be served together or one after the other?

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I wouldn’t want us to be tactical with these yellow cards. Can come back to bite you on the arse. In all fairness though when jack was out I think he went that whole period without getting a yellow being on his 9th of the season already. So if needs be he can rein it in. 

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9 hours ago, Shropshire Lad said:

Just reading about this, are you sure it applies to the play offs? Unless I’m reading it wrong? 

http://www.thefa.com/news/2018/jul/31/red-yellow-cards-technical-area-2018-19

Edit - Re-reading that means the cut off date doesn’t apply to play off matches, doesn’t it? Balls.

The EFL rules define the “Play-off Competition” as a separate competition, so there should be no carry over of cautions.  Agree it could be more clearly stated though.

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I read the below article from 2015 when Boro were looking at something similar going into the playoffs, however their players were near the 10 card mark.

 

Quote

A Football League spokesman said: “The threshold for 10 cautions has passed but if a player gets 15 cautions they would be suspended for three matches.

“The issue of a caution in one leg and another caution in the second leg has no effect unless they reach that threshold”.

 

https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/championship-play-offs-boro-players-not-9245979

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12 minutes ago, Stockbridgehibby said:

The EFL rules define the “Play-off Competition” as a separate competition, so there should be no carry over of cautions.  Agree it could be more clearly stated though.

That was my initial interpretation but then I read a comment elsewhere and it concluded differently and I doubted myself.

I obviously hope play off games aren’t included, but as you say the wording doesn’t make it immediately obvious.

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10 minutes ago, briny_ear said:

Why doesn't McGinn just stop getting yellow cards? People seem to be treating this as a necessary or inevitable part of his game. It’s not. 

It's the way he plays. He's also a smart footballer who will take a yellow card for the team when facing a counter attack, like yesterday.

 

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2 hours ago, PieFacE said:

It's the way he plays. He's also a smart footballer who will take a yellow card for the team when facing a counter attack, like yesterday.

 

I really can’t see how picking up yellow cards at a high frequency, if it leads to absence for key matches, can be see as “smart”.

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Just now, briny_ear said:

I really can’t see how picking up yellow cards at a high frequency, if it leads to absence for key matches, can be see as “smart”.

Agreed, occasionally yes a player needs to take one for the team. But he has 12 yellow cards this season. Think he’s in the top 5 in the league. He needs to cut out some of the petulant yellows. There is no way we should be worrying about him getting 15 cards and missing the play offs 

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2 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said:

Agreed, occasionally yes a player needs to take one for the team. But he has 12 yellow cards this season. Think he’s in the top 5 in the league. He needs to cut out some of the petulant yellows. There is no way we should be worrying about him getting 15 cards and missing the play offs 

It's not just taking one for the team though, it's the way he plays. If you stop him from going into challenges the way he does, you stop him winning the ball back the way he does. He's not going to tackle everyone perfectly every time, a consequence of him winning the ball back so much is that occasionally he will mis time tackles. Take that element of his game away to prevent getting yellow cards then John McGinn no longer plays like John McGinn.

Edited by PieFacE
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10 minutes ago, mikeyp102 said:

Agreed, occasionally yes a player needs to take one for the team. But he has 12 yellow cards this season. Think he’s in the top 5 in the league. He needs to cut out some of the petulant yellows. There is no way we should be worrying about him getting 15 cards and missing the play offs 

It’s 13 cards unfortunately. That extra one makes it feel a lot closer, if he was on 12 I’d be a bit easier about it.

In his last 8 games, he’s picked up 4 bookings. I can’t see him going through the next 4 league games and potentially 2 semi final legs without picking up more (I don’t care if he gets booked in the play off final, should we reach it).

A booking against Millwall and another against Leeds and he would be out of both semi final legs. He picks up a second booking between Norwich and the second leg, he’s out of the final (potentially).

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