Godders Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 47 minutes ago, turvontour said: My point is that a Villa fan isn’t a specific type of character or person. If you feel shame when one or a few of the hundreds of thousands do something untoward then that’s fine, I’m just saying that I don’t. I also think that we’ll continue to see more and more of these “incidents” with the continued rise of social media. I’ll just add, that I’ve seen four or five videos of Man City and Arsenal fans kicking the hell out of each other outside Wembley on Sunday. Not condoning the prats on the train, but come on, mountain out of a mole hill. If you, or anyone else, is out in their Villa top today, then someone who's seen the article could well think "Oh, that persons wearing a Villa top. That reminds me of that article I saw earlier." Even if the people that have seen the article do not conclude that all Villa fans are dickheads, for a period of time, all Villa fans will be associated with the yobbish behaviour of these fans, purely because of the fact that seeing something identifiably Villa will trigger them to recall the article. Personally, I'm a proud person and consider myself to be an upstanding member of society, so to know that I would be associated with this behaviour because of the fact that I support this great club dissapoints me. So I, for one, certainly feel a sense of shame. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 1 hour ago, magnkarl said: The only reason why I started this thread was to see if we could stamp out this sort of thing. The people who it got aimed at were intimidated and uncomfortable for it. As a fanbase we are known to deal with people being idiots quite well, instead it turned into a "omg it's daily mail!!11" kind of thing. If people could take the sentiment of the post and apply it to their circles instead of just accepting this sort of idiotic behaviour we'd come a long way. If anyone knows any of these people I'll gladly take this to them instead, because I've had enough of people acting like £$%£$ just because "everyone else does it". That argument doesn't justify anything. If my wife got treated like that on a train I'd be up against these men in 2 seconds flat, so fair play to this brave young lad. It's up to the transport police to sort this behaviour out, not a message board . This sort of thing happens every day and will continue to happen, so why aren't you starting a thread every time it happens ? Why do you only give a shit when the words Aston Villa are involved ? People are happy to sweep every horrible incident under the carpet until it actually affects them personally, which is worrying . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 Hardly a surprise, sitting in the Holte for the first time in years this weekend reminded me that some of our fans are utter scum. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted April 26, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted April 26, 2017 Football fans in being moronic shocker. I see it from both angles. The original article is hyping it up to be much worse than it is. However, the fans are still being dickheads. I've been in that situation where a group of fans/drunks/both want you to join in and you don't want to. It's not very nice, but it's hardly worthy of the amount of outrage implied in the article. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 26, 2017 Author Share Posted April 26, 2017 (edited) 33 minutes ago, Brumerican said: It's up to the transport police to sort this behaviour out, not a message board . This sort of thing happens every day and will continue to happen, so why aren't you starting a thread every time it happens ? Why do you only give a shit when the words Aston Villa are involved ? People are happy to sweep every horrible incident under the carpet until it actually affects them personally, which is worrying . Okay, so by your behaviour we should all just have a free for all because no one gives a shit. If someone is ill treated in front of me I will react, because humans are a social species who have something called empathy. Clubs and fan clubs have rules that they work by, and when people break those rules it's got to have consequences no matter how many people do it or not. It's this sort of nonchalant attitude towards people who are treated unfairly which is making our society into a cesspool of selfies, thuggery and general armpit-ness. If you were in a situation where you got beat up on the street by a gang of people and no one bothered to help you you'd feel very differently. People need to be paid by the state (ie police or ambulance crews) to bother to help? That's just sad. So you are saying that people sweep things under the carpet until it affects them personally? Look at the responses from a lot of upstanding people on this thread and you'll find otherwise. Not everyone cowers and thinks "it's not my problem" when people need a hand buddy. Edited April 26, 2017 by magnkarl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 Just now, magnkarl said: Okay, so by your behaviour we should all just have a free for all because no one gives a shit. If someone is ill treated in front of me I will react, because humans are a social species who have something called empathy. Clubs and fan clubs have rules that they work by, and when people break those rules it's got to have consequences no matter how many people do it or not. It's this sort of nonchalant attitude towards people who are treated unfairly which is making our society into a cesspool of selfies, thuggery and general armpit-ness. If you were in a situation where you got beat up on the street by a gang of people and no one bothered to help you you'd feel very differently. So you are saying that people sweep things under the carpet until it affects them personally? Look at the responses from a lot of upstanding people on this thread and you'll find otherwise. Not everyone cowers and thinks "it's not my problem" when people need a hand buddy. It's society's problem . Not Villatalk's. This type of crap happens every day so I'm just wondering what is so special about this occasion that has you so triggered ? If it's because the words Aston Villa are involved then you need to give your head a wobble. (and FWIW I would never stand idly by and allow that to happen if I were in that situation ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 39 minutes ago, Brumerican said: People are happy to sweep every horrible incident under the carpet until it actually affects them personally, which is worrying . 6 hours ago, Brumerican said: Thanks for the faux outrage after a nothing story ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 4 minutes ago, rodders0223 said: I'm not people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turvontour Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 52 minutes ago, Godders said: If you, or anyone else, is out in their Villa top today, then someone who's seen the article could well think "Oh, that persons wearing a Villa top. That reminds me of that article I saw earlier." Even if the people that have seen the article do not conclude that all Villa fans are dickheads, for a period of time, all Villa fans will be associated with the yobbish behaviour of these fans, purely because of the fact that seeing something identifiably Villa will trigger them to recall the article. Personally, I'm a proud person and consider myself to be an upstanding member of society, so to know that I would be associated with this behaviour because of the fact that I support this great club dissapoints me. So I, for one, certainly feel a sense of shame. No that’s fine, I completely get your take on it. I just think that we’re powerless to stop dickheads being dickheads and we know there’s a lot of them associated with the club through the sheer volume of fans. We also know that every other club has their share of them (us less than most I’d also like to hazard based on our level of support). Put it this way, I’m about as embarrassed of Villa fans being dickheads as I am of people who share my star sign being dickheads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markavfc40 Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 I think the most surprising thing about this is that it has featured on at least two national newspaper websites. You will get pissed up footie fans doing this kind of thing after games every weekend up and down the country so this was not anything out of the ordinary. I guess they aren't all filmed though. The above isn't to say that this kind of behaviour isn't wrong, as it is bang out of order, and I feel for the couple involved and wouldn't like to be in that situation myself. I don't personally feel the need to apologise or go out of my way to condemn them though as I like 99% of our fans, and other footie fans in general, have no association with village idiots like these other than happening to have a passion for the same sport and in this instance the same team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srsmithusa Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 Some people on a train behave like inconsiderate thugs. It's fine to post it. It's not like VT is forced to have threads only if they are approved by the membership. If you don't think it should be posted, there should be a button at the bottom right of the page that says something to the effect... next unread topic. It's right to be angry that some people behave like ass holes. It's silly to feel guilty by association because they are Villa fans (you should also leave VT immediately and permanently for your own mental health.) It's silly to get bent out of shape that thuggish behavior bothers people enough that they would want to post it on social media. I'm going to the next thread now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dom_Wren Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 22 minutes ago, Brumerican said: It's society's problem . Not Villatalk's. This type of crap happens every day so I'm just wondering what is so special about this occasion that has you so triggered ? If it's because the words Aston Villa are involved then you need to give your head a wobble. (and FWIW I would never stand idly by and allow that to happen if I were in that situation ) I know you wouldnt shoot em, youd miss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 9 minutes ago, Dom_Wren said: I know you wouldnt shoot em, youd miss I could shove buckshot up my arse and fart a tighter a group from 300 yards than you could from 50 . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 @Brumerican Just a thought. You my have valid points to make (although I am struggling to see them) but do you have to be so angry and offensive in the way you are making them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 Just now, briny_ear said: @Brumerican Just a thought. You my have valid points to make (although I am struggling to see them) but do you have to be so angry and offensive in the way you are making them? Being offended is a choice. I'm not particularly angry either. I'll try and structure my future posts with a more user friendly tone just for you . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 3 hours ago, turvontour said: I don't get this feeling of collective shame at all. There was 40,000 Villa fans at the game on Sunday. Surely you appreciate that a significant proportion of those people are dickheads. Doesn't one in four people in the UK have a criminal record? So presumably 10,000 of those fans will have had some dealing with the police before. Might be driving offences sure, but could be rape or murder, we don't know. If those lads in the video weren't being dickheads on a train on the way to the football, they would be being dickheads (either individually or collectively) somewhere else. On the bolded bit, no, this is a bit of fake news. I think the idea comes from a story in 2011 when the new national police database was being set up. It was reported that 15 million names would be stored by the police, which at least one national newspaper claimed was a quarter of the UK population. However, the point of the story was that 6 million of the names would be of victims of crime, not criminals. There is no authoritative figure for the proportion of the population that has a criminal record, although some reasonably respectable organisations have estimated it is around 9-10 million so around one in six/seven. Not that I can really see how this has any relevance to the discussion here. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 12 minutes ago, Brumerican said: Being offended is a choice. I'm not particularly angry either. I'll try and structure my future posts with a more user friendly tone just for you . Yeh, I've got a sneaky feeling that wouldn't just be for me. Your interventions on this thread are a bit of a pain and that will be true for everyone I suspect. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_Villain Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 2 hours ago, mykeyb said: If they wore a Blue & White scarf I am sure they would be labelled as scum by pretty much everyone on here......................................are we saying because they are fellows fans its just banter...really! Scum To be fair though, a blue & white scarf is a prerequisite to being a complete word removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnkarl Posted April 26, 2017 Author Share Posted April 26, 2017 1 hour ago, Brumerican said: It's society's problem . Not Villatalk's. This type of crap happens every day so I'm just wondering what is so special about this occasion that has you so triggered ? If it's because the words Aston Villa are involved then you need to give your head a wobble. (and FWIW I would never stand idly by and allow that to happen if I were in that situation ) To me it seems like you'd be more likely to be at home in front of the computer hissing and moaning about someone having an opinion on anything that isn't "not giving a crap". If you don't like the thread then please stop goading people on and move to a thread that you find enjoyable. Arguing on the internet is so 2014. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brumerican Posted April 26, 2017 Share Posted April 26, 2017 (edited) 5 minutes ago, magnkarl said: To me it seems like you'd be more likely to be at home in front of the computer hissing and moaning about someone having an opinion on anything that isn't "not giving a crap". If you don't like the thread then please stop goading people on and move to a thread that you find enjoyable. Arguing on the internet is so 2014. I have no qualms about confronting jerks in public , even it looks like I could get a pasting for my trouble . I have never stood by and watched anyone being bullied, EVER. The thing is , I'm like that all year round . Not just when Villa fans are involved. Edited April 26, 2017 by Brumerican Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts