General Election 2017

[Straggler]

Sums up how I feel, including the NSFW language.

[tonyh29]

5 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

http://www.labour.org.uk/index.php/10-pledges

 

I'm not sure there's anything I massively disagree with there.

 

and all you have to do is tax the wealthy at 90% to pay for it ..which kinda rules out number 8

 

[TrentVilla]

Just now, tonyh29 said:

and all you have to do is tax the wealthy at 90% to pay for it ..which kinda rules out number 8

 

Is that 90% of the 10% they expose to U.K. tax?

[villakram]

This is gonna be so much fun 

[tonyh29]

Just now, TrentVilla said:

Is that 90% of the 10% they expose to U.K. tax?

Price Waterhouse Cooper FTW 

 

[TrentVilla]

2 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

Price Waterhouse Cooper FTW 

 

So long as they hand you the right envelope!

[Davkaus]

25 minutes ago, tonyh29 said:

and all you have to do is tax the wealthy at 90% to pay for it ..which kinda rules out number 8

 

Or you borrow while interest rates remain at history lows rather than inflicting austerity on a population for ideological reasons while pretending that a national economy is comparable to a household budget. 

[jon_c]

43 minutes ago, Davkaus said:

http://www.labour.org.uk/index.php/10-pledges

 

I'm not sure there's anything I massively disagree with there.

 

This highlights one of the biggest problems with Corbyn, you can't particularly argue with the aspirations of many of these policies. But you have to ask, how the hell are you going to actually afford this and bring it to fruition? It's like he knows he'll never get elected so he can make grand pledges like full employment and universal childcare because he'll never actually have to deliver it.

[Davkaus]

10 minutes ago, jon_c said:

This highlights one of the biggest problems with Corbyn, you can't particularly argue with the aspirations of many of these policies. But you have to ask, how the hell are you going to actually afford this and bring it to fruition? It's like he knows he'll never get elected so he can make grand pledges like full employment and universal childcare because he'll never actually have to deliver it.

Investments in infrastructure pay for themselves over time. The money doesn't disappear; it goes to businesses that pay taxes and salaries in the UK, it's more money in the hands of workers, who are then able to spend more. It creates jobs, income, and lessens reliance on the welfare state. Borrowing and investing while interest rates are low is a financially prudent move.

Someone will be along to chime in about not being able to afford a pint when your bank balance is £0 at some point.

Edited April 18, 2017 by Davkaus

[jjaacckk91]

4 hours ago, Straggler said:

Corbyn has to know he can't win from here in the time he has.  Being a realist and admitting this allows the opposition to the Tories to fight against a hard Brexit whilst May only has a slim majority in Parliament.  Corbyn should call May out as a cynical opportunist and slap her down.  He can even use her own words against her, she called this process a cheap trick, she said this needs to be a time for stability and healing, she basically has talked a whole load of crap about doing exactly what she is doing today.

Those things aren't mutually exclusive though. Perhaps he thinks he can trash her with her own words whilst also believing that he and the Labour party can do a better job over the next few years.

Not that I think he's particularily capable of convincing people of that.

 

Just seen a green party broadcast, do they really think refugees and supporting protests is going to be a vote winner? Very bizarre choice imo.

[dAVe80]

The real question is, where do we think Paul Nuttalls of the UKIPs is going to be renting a house that he's not going to bother moving into?

[TrentVilla]

I bet old Mark Reckless got the nod a few weeks back...

[blandy]

1 hour ago, Davkaus said:

I'm not sure there's anything I massively disagree with there.

That's fine. Some of it is sort of quite good. Problem is half of it is just not possible or credible, or necessarily desirable the consequences would be counter to what good is said to be aimed at.

Building a million homes - really - 200,000 a year for 5 years. Where? Who's going to do that? What about protecting the land? There's not a shortage of houses, there's a shortage of available housing - i.e there are enough homes already, but they're not occupied - 2nd homes etc. or the empty housing that there is, is not where the people who need homes are currently residing.

Ending (completely) zero hours contracts. It's true they've exploded in number over the past 5 years or so, and many people are exploited, but it's also true that they are for some people and some businesses mutually agreeable and helpful.

The nationalisation of railways and NHS services - they won't do it in 5 years because of contracts and franchises already in place.

High skilled, high tech, low carbon economy to ensure that no one and no community is left behind - not with Brexit, they won't. The high tech, high skilled companies will be moving operations and labour etc. abroad (to an extent - i.e. more of it abroad than is the case now). Brexit will make the UK poorer, too, meaning fewer business able to invest as much in R&T and training, and ditto for the Gov't.

And so on. There's good stuff in amongst it all, but most manifestos promise apple pie and jam.

And none of them are credible, from any party.

 

Edited April 18, 2017 by blandy
bloody autocorrect

[jon_c]

Islington North voted remain by76%. Hayes and Harlington was 59% remain. If I were the Lib Dems I would be going to town on those constituencies. 

[dAVe80]

2 minutes ago, jon_c said:

Islington North voted remain by76%. Hayes and Harlington was 59% remain. If I were the Lib Dems I would be going to town on those constituencies. 

Like everything they do, they'd be wasting their time. No way Jeremy or John McDonnell will lose their seats.

[blandy]

1 minute ago, jon_c said:

Islington North voted remain by76%. Hayes and Harlington was 59% remain. If I were the Lib Dems I would be going to town on those constituencies. 

Yeah, It'll be interesting* to see if places that voted remain, but have "leave" MPs and vice versa will end up voting with brexity views and kicking out the MPs, or with traditional party views and staying the same. There just might be a whole bunch of MPs in relatively safe seats who get turfed out because they differ on brexit to the people who vote in their area.

 

*not actually that interesting 

[Chindie]

1 hour ago, Chindie said:

His faith and it's effect on his positions on various points.

To elaborate

I can't vote for someone whose personal views so openly are illiberal.

Not that it matters anyway, my seat will stay Labour with a spineless empty suit in place.

[PaulC]

In theory yes but in reality it wont work without increasing our borrowing and by raising the taxes for the wealthy won't work because they  will always  find ways of avoiding it.

[OutByEaster?]

Regardless of whether you agree with the Corbyn policies over the page and regardless of whether you think they're affordable and do-able - this election, like every election this century in every major western democracy will have about as much to do with policy as it does with ice cream. 

It's a PR contest in which one side has pretty much all of the mainstream media and just for giggles that side also has a huge head start. If it was a fight, you'd call it off already.

 

 

[Chindie]

No debates this time.

I can't help thinking that if the Tories had a candidate who came across as a human being the debates will go full steam ahead. As is, they just said no.