General Election 2017

[peterms]

 

[jackbauer24]

I watch TV shows like the Last Leg and Mock the Week and they all seem to be generally a lot more left leaning.

I see that most of social media seems to laugh at the Right and May more than any other party.

I work in Education and see first hand these cuts the Tories want to make and the lack of support for our current government.

I sit next to people at Villa who are deeply impacted by changes to Disability benefits.

My family, who work for the NHS, tell me the Tories are largely hated by the profession.

My mum is one of those effected by the pension change for those born in the 50s. My nan is concerned about the 'Dementia Tax'

Even on here, there seems to be a left leaning majority.

So where are all these Tory supporters? Are they all business people? Why are they all relatively silent? I genuinely don't understand why there is even a chance of a big Tory win when every part of society seems against them; the young, the disabled, the poor, the pensioners and those who work in Education, NHS or police particularly.

I'm not deluded enough to say it's a lie they are so popular and even the 'best' case scenario is a hung parliament, but I just don't understand why my life experiences indicate the complete opposite. I'm not overly political or scare people in to silence with my own views so why do Tory supporters generally stay so quiet?

If you're ashamed of who you're voting for, why are you voting for them?

[peterms]

Oh.  I see.

 

[supermon]

38 minutes ago, jackbauer24 said:

I watch TV shows like the Last Leg and Mock the Week and they all seem to be generally a lot more left leaning.

I see that most of social media seems to laugh at the Right and May more than any other party.

I work in Education and see first hand these cuts the Tories want to make and the lack of support for our current government.

I sit next to people at Villa who are deeply impacted by changes to Disability benefits.

My family, who work for the NHS, tell me the Tories are largely hated by the profession.

My mum is one of those effected by the pension change for those born in the 50s. My nan is concerned about the 'Dementia Tax'

Even on here, there seems to be a left leaning majority.

So where are all these Tory supporters? Are they all business people? Why are they all relatively silent? I genuinely don't understand why there is even a chance of a big Tory win when every part of society seems against them; the young, the disabled, the poor, the pensioners and those who work in Education, NHS or police particularly.

I'm not deluded enough to say it's a lie they are so popular and even the 'best' case scenario is a hung parliament, but I just don't understand why my life experiences indicate the complete opposite. I'm not overly political or scare people in to silence with my own views so why do Tory supporters generally stay so quiet?

If you're ashamed of who you're voting for, why are you voting for them?

Very good point, I don't even see any pro Tory related stuff on my Facebook feed, it's all Labour. It's hard to believe sometimes that there are that many Tory voters who think her policies will make the country better.

[This Could Be Rotterdam]

5 hours ago, supermon said:

Very good point, I don't even see any pro Tory related stuff on my Facebook feed, it's all Labour. It's hard to believe sometimes that there are that many Tory voters who think her policies will make the country better.

I think a lot of them dont think it will make the country better. They think it will make them marginally richer and thats all that matters. 

Look at the two tv ''debates'' ,corbyn made two people look like idiots for bringing up the corporation tax issue. Essentially, he pointed out that yes they will be expected to pay more, because they can give more, and it is a necessary 'evil' to make a fairer society where people arent living in absolute poverty. I doubt either person will be changing their vote, but it confirmed to me why i will be voting labour. 

[sharkyvilla]

6 hours ago, supermon said:

Very good point, I don't even see any pro Tory related stuff on my Facebook feed, it's all Labour. It's hard to believe sometimes that there are that many Tory voters who think her policies will make the country better.

It's the old stereotype I think, if you're under 30 and vote Tory you have no heart, if you're over 30 and vote Labour you have no brain.  Obviously as I say it's a stereotype, but the break down of voting intention by age and probable social media use suggests that Facebook will ultimately be much more left leaning.  As for the election, the Tory vote seems to have been stable in the mid-40s so it'll be down to how the social media use among the young translates to votes as to the final result and if they can create a hung parliament.

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

43 minutes ago, This Could Be Rotterdam said:

I think a lot of them dont think it will make the country better. They think it will make them marginally richer and thats all that matters.

That's what the Conservative party exists for as far as I know at it's very core and I think they would admit that themselves in private,  well some of the the honest ones at least.  Corbyn spoke about it briefly,  it's all about pulling the ladder up for them or can be easily be perceived as so.  

One thing that does seem a bit OTT is the free tuition fees for all (11 Bn?).  Just means test it and a lot of it could be paid for I suspect,  the same with fines in general.  Sticking a 80 parking fine on a 200,000 pound car seems a bit strange as well as a very simple example.

 

[peterms]

 

[darrenm]

Old purple men want to melt people.

I think they should be forced to watch videos and look at photos of Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Though they'd probably enjoy it.

[robojoel]

[peterms]

 

[peterms]

20 minutes ago, darrenm said:

Old purple men want to melt people.

I think they should be forced to watch videos and look at photos of Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Though they'd probably enjoy it.

I didn't see the programme, but people are saying that questions from this set of people amounted to 29% of the total, ie a vast over-representation.

[ChrisVillan]

47 minutes ago, darrenm said:

Old purple men want to melt people.

I think they should be forced to watch videos and look at photos of Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Though they'd probably enjoy it.

The only thing still capable of giving them an erection. 

[Davkaus]

I think what I took away from the debate wasn't anything about nukes. It was our Prime Minister patiently explaining to a nurse that magic money trees don't exist, so of course she has had to go 7 years on a gradually lowering income,and it's not going to change anytime soon. 

Condescending bitch. 

Anyone that says they support the NHS and still votes for these words removed has a clinical case of cognitive dissonance. 

[meregreen]

Compared to the NHS and Social care, every other issue pales into insignificance for me.

[This Could Be Rotterdam]

1 hour ago, Amsterdam_Neil_D said:

That's what the Conservative party exists for as far as I know at it's very core and I think they would admit that themselves in private,  well some of the the honest ones at least.  Corbyn spoke about it briefly,  it's all about pulling the ladder up for them or can be easily be perceived as so.  

One thing that does seem a bit OTT is the free tuition fees for all (11 Bn?).  Just means test it and a lot of it could be paid for I suspect,  the same with fines in general.  Sticking a 80 parking fine on a 200,000 pound car seems a bit strange as well as a very simple example.

 

The tuition fee issue is actually one of the main things i disagree with him on. Ive said it earlier in the thread, but i went to uni the year before the fees were increased luckily, worked really hard and believe the wage im earning now is a direct representation of that. Im happy to pay my loan every month (i think it amounts the less that £90, and comes out before my wages so i never notice it is missing) because i know that without that education i wouldnt be earning what i am, and would be significantly worse off.

My concern with the free fees is that uni just becomes even more of a 3 year holiday that people dont take it seriously. Then again, i didnt take it seriously because of the fees, it was because i wanted to do well. 

However, i would be happy with free fees for people doing specific courses which would tackle a specific skills gap that needs addressing for the country, providing they stay in that employment for a set amount of time after they leave uni. Once they have done their time, they would have technically paid back what they have got for free. If they leave before a set time then they have an amount calculated based on the percentage of what they 'paid back', and the time they have done is deducted. I believe this has been used before, but whether it was this country or another escapes me. 

Either way, im certainly not going to let free education sway me towards voting for that despicable woman! 

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

1 minute ago, This Could Be Rotterdam said:

Either way, im certainly not going to let free education sway me towards voting for that despicable woman!

That's a good point,  not that many people are directly effected by the current or future policy anyway in terms of people actually planning to go to uni vs the rest of the general population that will vote next week.  Yes a lot of people will pay for it though but it's as you say,  not a subject that people will set themselves on fire over.

Free or paid tuition is only of any real value if the education of kids is of a highest quality all the way up to uni age anyway.  Giving free tuition to 1000's of ill educated idiots archives nothing long term.  To be a global player in the employment market we have to produce a wide range of skilled people throughout all the industry sectors anyway,  not all these are taught at Uni.

[blandy]

10 hours ago, darrenm said:

It would have been great for Corbyn to say something like this. Spell it out in great detail what people are asking him if he'll do. Make them feel really good about themselves

Half agree. It would have been good for him to have a proper answer, but peter's isn't it. It's complete rubbish, unfortunately and would get Corbyn torn to shreds. It's sometimes good to be emotive in trying to win a debate, but if you're going to use emotion about circumstances, you have to be truthful. No part of having ( or cancelling) trident involves the pm deciding which parts of this country get nuked, incinerated, nuclear fallout and cancers and all that stuff Peter mentioned. It's an awful argument when placed that way. On balance, I'm just about against us having nukes, though there are some very good arguments for having them. I just wish people (politicians ) could talk about the whole subject more rationally, lay out the pros and cons, and then explain why their chosen path has been chosen. "Yeah, I'd push the button" v "it means picking which part of the uk to incinerate" is moronic in the extreme.

[Nicho]

8 hours ago, supermon said:

Very good point, I don't even see any pro Tory related stuff on my Facebook feed, it's all Labour. It's hard to believe sometimes that there are that many Tory voters who think her policies will make the country better.

I have been thinking this. My Facebook is all my demographic mainly so no surprise they all hold ,y views and related videos reinforce that.

My experiences of Tory voters is that they are quiet but when voicing their views it is still things like May will deliver Brexit and I don't like Corbyn. When questioned on Policies they can't give answers. 2 of my colleagues both my age (28) who both have kids age 4 will be voting Tory. One goes home to his parents every weekend with his son, as child care and rent takes all his wages and he doesn't need to spend anymoney when the grandparents are around.

I think the labour support is loud due to the fact that people who are or will be effected by cuts have been **** over and people feel passionately about it. Whether that by friend or family member of someone who works In any public services or related contracts.

If your voting Tory on some stupid fact less reason like she will deliver a good Brexit your not passionate about it as you have no concrete evidence to give. And again if your doing it because you don't like Corbyn people are turning around and asking why.

I've said before that if you can afford your own home, pay for private schooling and health care and don't give a **** about anyone else vote Tory.

The last few weeks have given me hope but I fear the country will let me down. I fear that on the day all those Tory voters who now think Labour and Corbyn is the right thing to do will still vote Tory once in that box.

[peterms]

4 minutes ago, blandy said:

No part of having ( or cancelling) trident involves the pm deciding which parts of this country get nuked, incinerated, nuclear fallout and cancers and all that stuff Peter mentioned

The detailed plans that came to light in the 1980s (and which will no doubt have existed before then) involve setting out which areas are the likely targets of a nuclear attack, the effects of possible nuclear attack at varying levels of intensity, radiation effects caused by wind drift and so on.  They involve calculating roughly how many people would be immediately incinerated versus suffering lingering deaths in a number of scenarios.  They also involve assumptions about the amount of emergency services which might survive, the impossibility of getting any medical supplies or assistance to affected areas, and all the rest.  You must know this stuff exists, Pete.

The likely areas of attack are, obviously, strategically important military sites, major population centres, and anything else that is strategically important.  It's not rocket science.  (Oh, hang on...).

This is not "deciding which parts of this country get nuked" in the sense of being offered a menu and making a choice; it is however deciding which parts of this country to place at greater risk of being nuked by possessing nuclear weapons.  It is also deciding that this is an acceptable price to pay in return for the perceived benefits.