maqroll

Russia

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Putin has proven to be a very formidable figure. He has improbably tilted the scales back to Russia, politically. Their cyber warfare and propaganda capability seems to be second to none, and they're flexing military force. He's now just had extremely harsh words for the US about the airfield bombing. Trump is stupid, impetuous and reactionary, which makes him dangerous, but Putin is smart, savvy, ruthless and globally ambitious. And that makes him sinister. Interesting times.

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1 hour ago, maqroll said:

Putin has proven to be a very formidable figure. He has improbably tilted the scales back to Russia, politically. Their cyber warfare and propaganda capability seems to be second to none, and they're flexing military force. He's now just had extremely harsh words for the US about the airfield bombing. Trump is stupid, impetuous and reactionary, which makes him dangerous, but Putin is smart, savvy, ruthless and globally ambitious. And that makes him sinister. Interesting times.

I'll respectfully disagree. 

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12 minutes ago, trekka said:

I'll respectfully disagree. 

I'll respect your disagreement.

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Meanwhile, in the Southern part of the morality cesspool that is modern day Russia, the contemptibly backward toilet state of Chechnya has opened up concentration camps for homosexual people.

Quote

Gay men are being held in “camps” in the Chechen Republic where they are subjected to torture and beatings, human rights campaigners have claimed.

The claims follow reports last week that 100 gay men had been rounded up and imprisoned in Chechnya, with at least three people allegedly murdered. The allegations were made by a Russian newspaper and human rights campaigners. “In Chechnya, the command was given for a ‘prophylactic sweep’ and it went as far as real murders,” independent newspaper Novaya Gazeta claimed. 

Chechnya's official response is typical of the kind of response to come from similarly repressed toilet countries or states.  Saying that they're not putting homosexuals into concentration camps because of course Chechnya doesn't HAVE any homosexuals to begin with.

Obviously.

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Well I feel reassured about that, that's that resolved.

In other news Putin says they don't have any drugs so can't be cheats...

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28 minutes ago, jon_c said:

The 2018 World Cup is going to be an absolute cluster***k isn't it?

Only amongst straight people though.

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On 09/04/2017 at 11:30, trekka said:

I'll respectfully disagree. 

I'd be genuinely interested to hear your take on Putinism.

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30 minutes ago, Awol said:

I'd be genuinely interested to hear your take on Putinism.

On 4/9/2017 at 08:30, trekka said:

Putin is smart, savvy, ruthless and globally ambitious

Maybe it was the last part of this bit that was the issue. I'm not sure Putin could really be accurately be described as globally ambitious. Without going into great detail, and at length, he seems to have 3 main interests - whatever order you like

1. Maintaining his own grip on power.

2. a kind of version of Trump's slogan - Make Russia Great again. He wants Russia to be feared and respected, but that doesn't involve any global ambitions, other than to stay mates with his mates, to keep bases where he has bases and for Russia's voice to be listened to.

3. Monumental levels of corruption.

 

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Clearly he doesn't display any signs of global ambitions in a territory sense but I'm assuming trekka didn't mean that.

I assumed that to be more in terms of making Russia a player on the global political stage in a way it used to be and had in recent years declined from being.

Russia has been very active outside its borders, in terms of Its aggression to Turkey, the annex of Crimea and the situation within the Ukraine. It has been trying to push back/holt the borders of the EU and the reach of the UN. Under Putin they've also take a far more active role in the Middle East than we had seen for quite some time.

So I think that it is fair to say Putin has tried and to an extent succeeded in making Russia a global power again. 

He is without a doubt the things you say blandy and more but I do feel that the West has had a hand in this having spent years poking the beer with a stick as we court nations like Ukraine to move away from their traditional allie (other terms might be more apt)

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1 hour ago, blandy said:

Maybe it was the last part of this bit that was the issue. I'm not sure Putin could really be accurately be described as globally ambitious. Without going into great detail, and at length, he seems to have 3 main interests - whatever order you like

1. Maintaining his own grip on power.

2. a kind of version of Trump's slogan - Make Russia Great again. He wants Russia to be feared and respected, but that doesn't involve any global ambitions, other than to stay mates with his mates, to keep bases where he has bases and for Russia's voice to be listened to.

3. Monumental levels of corruption.

 

No argument on 1. and 3. but I think 2. Is more complicated. I'd suggest his ambition is to destabilize the lands of the Intermarium and undermine the western alliance - both EU and NATO. 

Some of the best analysis I've read situates Putin ideologically  not in the Bolshevik tradition but further back in Tsarist, Imperial Russia. 

He appears to be a revisionist shooting for a 19th century spheres of influence style of world order, which for Russia encompasses much of Eastern Europe and (through the so called Eurasian Union) Central Asia - a likely point of friction in future with China and its OBOR/BRI ambitions. 

So as you say not global ambition, but certainly unsatisfied with the current arrangements and actively seeking to change them. 

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5 minutes ago, TrentVilla said:

Clearly he doesn't display any signs of global ambitions in a territory sense but I'm assuming trekka didn't mean that.

I assumed that to be more in terms of making Russia a player on the global political stage in a way it used to be and had in recent years declined from being.

Russia has been very active outside its borders, in terms of Its aggression to Turkey, the annex of Crimea and the situation within the Ukraine. It has been trying to push back/holt the borders of the EU and the reach of the UN. Under Putin they've also take a far more active role in the Middle East than we had seen for quite some time.

So I think that it is fair to say Putin has tried and to an extent succeeded in making Russia a global power again. 

He is without a doubt the things you say blandy and more but I do feel that the West has had a hand in this having spent years poking the beer with a stick as we court nations like Ukraine to move away from their traditional allie (other terms might be more apt)

No man stands for his beer being poked, that's fighting talk. 

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1 hour ago, blandy said:

He wants Russia to be feared

I think this is spot on.  This is his desire more than anything,  he wants to be remembered as the one who left "The Legacy" no matter the cost in money, lives or even dignity.  Step back from it all,  Syria,  is that the very best Putin can come up with to make himself and that god forsaken country of his relevant ? There is no outcome where Putin looks good in this.    Little man syndrome gone terribly wrong alongside tons of propaganda,  short term he is on a winner,  long term Russia will slowly move into the shadows of global politics,  they have nothing to offer except complications and misery to any issue.  He has no shame,  he will be friends with North Korea next after China drops them.  Mincing around the world making friends with the "Bad lads" and then threatening everyone, Putin really is a child in many ways but, he is the Jimmy Saville of World politics,  oh he will fix you alright,  just not how you really expected it and now you really regret writing the letter. 

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21 minutes ago, Amsterdam_Neil_D said:

Step back from it all,  Syria,  is that the very best Putin can come up with to make himself and that god forsaken country of his relevant ? There is no outcome where Putin looks good in this.    Little man syndrome gone terribly wrong

That's how it might look to you, and that's fair enough.

But...Russia isn't "God-forsaken" and certainly absolutely not in Putin's eyes, or the eyes of its population. And from that, making what is seen as a once proud country "relevant" again would make Putin "look good".

As a former KGB man, the stereotype suggests he's likely to have different standards to the Western sensitivities about civilians being killed, about the use of brutality and is likely to be a consummate schemer and manipulator. I don't see the "little man" syndrome, and I suspect the stereotype I mentioned is well earned in his case.

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While he is probably a vile, dangerous and untrustworthy man but in a perverse way I sort of respect Putin more than other recent western leaders like Trump, Obama, Cameron etc. He is strong minded and puts the cards on the table he believes is right 

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How the world loves a charismatic strong man.

It's weird, human development. How we can consider flight to Mars and discover graphene, yet so many just want to fall in behind the biggest baddest ape and be told what to do.

 

 

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2 hours ago, chrisp65 said:

How the world loves a charismatic strong man.

It's weird, human development. How we can consider flight to Mars and discover graphene, yet so many just want to fall in behind the biggest baddest ape and be told what to do.

 

 

But!

Biggest baddest ape, Wernher von Braun, space flight!

Big bad ape, Darmstadt University, Hanns-Peter Boehm, graphene!

:)

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