Russia and its “Special Operation” in Ukraine

[avfc1982am]

1 hour ago, magnkarl said:

I’m starting to get the feeling I has for a period before the wall fell. Something’s happening, I feel it in my joints. Maybe someone will park a lada up against the doors of the Kremlin and toss some vodka on it?

I'm a wrong un at the best of times, but this read to me llike some sort of sexual innuendo.  

[avfc1982am]

It's no wonder the Russian Army is so feared with professionalism like this.

 

[coda]

Edward Snowdon must be delighted with the timing of his being granted Russian citizenship.

[Anthony]

1 hour ago, coda said:

Edward Snowdon must be delighted with the timing of his being granted Russian citizenship.

I have a lot of time for the guy, but am not uncritical. I feel he did the right thing with his initial leaks. He did the moral thing and It's infuriating/not shocking/a wake up call/disappointing that the only safe place he could find afterwards was Russia. That is mana to Putin's propagandists. "Russia, the only safe place for moral people who stand up to the the West and NATO's aggression"

Before the citizenship announcement and now, he is, like every citizen of Russia, 100% a captive. He had as much say in this as Ukraine did in going to war.

[magnkarl]

Seems Ukraine have been targeting the rail lines and trains coming in via Luhansk and Donetsk that are full of conscripts from the far East. They aren't even making it to the front at this rate.

[Panto_Villan]

On 25/09/2022 at 19:18, mjmooney said:

That aged well. 

Nothing in that quotes post was untrue though. That was what the think tanks predicted, that was the Russian goal and how they went about doing it. And nobody did know the outcome for sure.

Again, if you’re trying to criticise me for reading up on what respected think tanks (and the Pentagon) thought about the matter then I’m not going to apologise; they’re the experts here even if they do get it wrong once in a while.

[phily85]

9 minutes ago, Panto_Villan said:

Nothing in that quotes post was untrue though. That was what the think tanks predicted, that was the Russian goal and how they went about doing it. And nobody did know the outcome for sure.

Again, if you’re trying to criticise me for reading up on what respected think tanks (and the Pentagon) thought about the matter then I’m not going to apologise; they’re the experts here even if they do get it wrong once in a while.

Have the last few years taught you nothing, we dont listen to experts any more. Facebook and Twitter decide

[Panto_Villan]

4 minutes ago, phily85 said:

Have the last few years taught you nothing, we dont listen to experts any more. Facebook and Twitter decide

Well indeed, that’s kinda my point. This forum is very pro-vax and anti-Brexit so it’s a bit weird to call someone out for listening to experts in this case while complaining bitterly that people don’t listen to experts elsewhere.

[villa89]

7 hours ago, magnkarl said:

Seems Ukraine have been targeting the rail lines and trains coming in via Luhansk and Donetsk that are full of conscripts from the far East.

Solid game plan. 

[limpid]

5 hours ago, Panto_Villan said:

Well indeed, that’s kinda my point. This forum is very pro-vax and anti-Brexit so it’s a bit weird to call someone out for listening to experts in this case while complaining bitterly that people don’t listen to experts elsewhere.

I had no idea that the forum had any opinions on anything. It's just some software.

I'm generally pro expert, but because of that the experts that got this wrong should be asked to explain how they got it so wrong, otherwise they won't be experts any more.

[Rodders]

6 hours ago, Panto_Villan said:

. This forum is very pro-vax 

 That is a very odd way of phrasing "is  sane".  [Brexit is a political position and divergent positions and attitudes are expected to it. ]

It's akin to saying I'm "pro clean drinking water" . More perniciously it gives the impression, that vaccination is as up in the air regarding it's wisdom as choice of politics,

Edited September 27, 2022 by Rodders

[Panto_Villan]

55 minutes ago, limpid said:

I had no idea that the forum had any opinions on anything. It's just some software.

I'm generally pro expert, but because of that the experts that got this wrong should be asked to explain how they got it so wrong, otherwise they won't be experts any more.

Sure, and no doubt there will be questions asked. But in general you’ll get more right than wrong if you side with the experts.

However, it’s also worth qualifying exactly how much the experts “got this wrong” here too. Because lots of people were claiming that Russia wouldn’t actually attack Ukraine, or that it would be an operation with quite limited aims such as only taking control of the Donbas so it could be formally annexed (which is what the previously quoted post was talking about).

Its pretty clear that the US intelligence community had a copy of the Russian invasion plan before the invasion happened, and the main variable they were trying to guess was just when Putin was going to pull the trigger. That would be considered a huge intelligence coup in most armed conflicts, right? Think about the Enigma machine, etc.

Obviously the invasion plan failed disastrously - but one of the officials hauled up in front of the US Intelligence Committee pointed out that they’d penetrated the Russian military and reported back what the Russians genuinely believed their forces were capable of, as well as when and where they would attack.

So while there’s always room for improvement, it seems a lot to expect that your intelligence services know the capabilities of the enemy forces better than the enemies themselves do. And it also doesn’t give them credit for everything they did get right, which is a lot.

Edited September 27, 2022 by Panto_Villan

[Panto_Villan]

6 minutes ago, Rodders said:

 That is a very odd way of phrasing "is  sane".  [Brexit is a political position and divergent positions and attitudes are expected to it. ]

It's akin to saying I'm "pro clean drinking water" . More perniciously it gives the impression, that vaccination is as up in the air regarding it's wisdom as choice of politics,

The post wasn’t criticising the wisdom of taking vaccines.

[Mandy Lifeboats]

 

Putin  >>   "Whoever tries to interfere with us, and even more so to create threats for our country, for our people, should know that Russia's response will be immediate and will lead you to such consequences that you have never experienced in your history. We are ready for any development of events. All necessary decisions in this regard have been made. I hope that I have been heard

 

That is very scary quote until you realise that its from February.   

 

 

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

9 minutes ago, Mandy Lifeboats said:

 

Putin  >>   "Whoever tries to interfere with us, and even more so to create threats for our country, for our people, should know that Russia's response will be immediate and will lead you to such consequences that you have never experienced in your history. We are ready for any development of events. All necessary decisions in this regard have been made. I hope that I have been heard, Is this thing even on ?  1,2,  1,2,  for f***s sake,  can you even hear me at the,  oh F**k this, 1,2.  I dunno,  try the other one"

 

That is very scary quote until you realise that its from February.   

 

 

 

 

[avfc1982am]

Unreal.... conscripting civilians and then being unable to supply basics. She's basically telling them they will get shot lol. 

 

[HKP90]

98% voting for Russian control. 

Ahahaha. Nothing political is ever anything like this. It couldn't be less genuine if all the ballots only had one possible choice. 

[sne]

 

Edited September 27, 2022 by sne

[HKP90]

Brace for a tough few days. Putin will annex parts of Ukraine and hard threaten the use of nukes. 

[Amsterdam_Neil_D]

2 minutes ago, HKP90 said:

Brace for a tough few days. Putin will annex parts of Ukraine and hard threaten the use of nukes. 

I bet he drinks up town as well.