New Manager : 2017

[srsmithusa]

7 minutes ago, Nigel said:

Because we are in the championship....and due to the way we have gone though managers recently....not a particularly attractive championship club. Half decent is about our limit right now.

 

Nigel, with respect, I ask you to reconsider that thinking.   Tolerating low mediocrity is in my opinion EXACTLY what's wrong at Villa.  Lambert and club management were forced to tolerate mediocrity by the financial neglect of our owner.   Tolerating mere survival became complacency and infected the board and eventually the playing staff.  Xia'schallenge is turning that around  

when half decent is your limit.   The problem is not your limit.  The problem is your attitude.  

Thats why I think Xia and the board must lead us now.  Tolerating survival as your standard IS the disease.   That's why Bruce must be let go.   We can stop this acceptance of "half decent" only from the top down.  

[Dr_Pangloss]

27 minutes ago, weedman said:

EVERY manager makes tactical choices that many fans are left baffled by, MON did all the time but got us up and challenging, Man Utd fans used to say the same about Fergie. Bruce's record throughout his career in this division prove he is not "out of his depth and/or completely useless" 

Except his tactical choices are simply not working here and his record this season is shite. 

[JAMAICAN-VILLAN]

17 minutes ago, srsmithusa said:

Nigel, with respect,

I think Nigel gets that you mean it with respect by now.

 

[dounavilla]

[srsmithusa]

7 minutes ago, JAMAICAN-VILLAN said:

I think Nigel gets that you mean it with respect by now.

 

But I really, really, really, really, meant it.   (and I hate my internet connection)

[Demitri_C]

15 hours ago, sne said:

If we are going for someone totally from left field (we won't) then Graham Potter would be a very exiting option.

He's currently manager at Östersunds FK in the Swedish top tier Allsvenskan and has since he was appointed before the 2011 taken the team that had just been relegated to the 4th tier of Swedish football to finishing 8th in their first season in the top flight. Would not be surprised if they finish top 5 this season.

They play by far the most attractive football in Sweden (sorry all Malmö FF fans) and Potter and his team are very progressive when it comes to training, analyzing data and are amazing at finding hungry players and developing them. And even thou their best players have been poached every season they have gotten better as a team.

I have no doubt Potter will go on to bigger and better things if not this summer then the year after.

Potter is actually from Solihull and was once a trainee at Birmingham City so he ticks that box. We do so love to get managers with  a history at City...

Played in the English U21 but never had a great playing career.

I've read loads of interviews with him but they are all in Swedish but I managed to find this one in English

 

Due to his lack of experience it would be a gamble, but I think he will go on to be a rather successful manager. I can promise there isn't a team in Sweden who would not want him as manager. And he will get poached by one of the biggest teams in Scandinavia very soon. 

He is exactly the type of manager I wan't us to sign.

 

Another gamble no thanks. I'd rather stick with bruce.

Like I said give him end of season see if he can turn it around. If this poor shit continues then he can't survive.

I think he will turn this around though I really do

[Nigel]

11 hours ago, srsmithusa said:

Nigel, with respect, I ask you to reconsider that thinking.   Tolerating low mediocrity is in my opinion EXACTLY what's wrong at Villa.  Lambert and club management were forced to tolerate mediocrity by the financial neglect of our owner.   Tolerating mere survival became complacency and infected the board and eventually the playing staff.  Xia'schallenge is turning that around  

when half decent is your limit.   The problem is not your limit.  The problem is your attitude.  

Thats why I think Xia and the board must lead us now.  Tolerating survival as your standard IS the disease.   That's why Bruce must be let go.   We can stop this acceptance of "half decent" only from the top down.  

Thats fair enough, and Id hope the board are heeding your advice!

However simply by stating that we wont accept mediocrity wont change our situation in terms of which managers will be willing to drop to our position.

You could show any top quality manager what we have to offer but they wont come...simply due to the fact there will be other 'better' options on the table.

We are in a state of mediocricty now like it or not.

How we get out of this is not by throwing yet more money at the next big thing (be that players or management), weve tried that.

We need to get back to a sound footing before anything can happen.  Stability is key to this.

Not only will this help weed out the bad eggs from the staff as a whole but it will also show us in a better light to any prospective future managers when we do manage to get ourselves out of this hole.

 

 

 

[AntrimBlack]

When people are talking about giving Bruce until the end of the season, or even just going with him for whatever number of games, either to achieve stability or not to be seen to change managers again, I would point out that we are uncomfortably close to the relegation places.

 

[Stevo985]

"Dinosaur"

"out of his depth"

"clueless"

"tactically inept"

 

You guys know Bruce got promoted from this league LAST SEASON right?
People are talking like he's come back into management after a 15 year sabbatical. 

[DCJonah]

1 hour ago, Stevo985 said:

"Dinosaur"

"out of his depth"

"clueless"

"tactically inept"

 

You guys know Bruce got promoted from this league LAST SEASON right?
People are talking like he's come back into management after a 15 year sabbatical. 

Last year Ranieri won the premier league, that doesn't mean he's one of the best managers in the league currently. 

I look at the likes of Monk, Stam and Wagner with their teams in the playoffs and it's looking like good young, progressive coaches are making a big difference in this league. 

Bruce is probably good for a settled team where not much has to be built up. For us, he's looking more and more like a man who is completely out of his depth. 

Edited February 13, 2017 by DCJonah

[kurtsimonw]

4 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Last year Ranieri won the premier league, that doesn't mean he's one of the best managers in the league currently. 

I look at the likes of Monk, Stam and Wagner with their teams in the playoffs and it's looking like good young, progressive coaches are making a big difference in this league. 

Why bother bringing in Monk, Stam or Wagner to try and take us up next season? Just because they did a good job this season doesn't mean they will next.

[DCJonah]

6 minutes ago, kurtsimonw said:

Why bother bringing in Monk, Stam or Wagner to try and take us up next season? Just because they did a good job this season doesn't mean they will next.

I didn't suggest we do. 

I think they're the type of manager I'd like to see us go for now. 

 

 

[Stevo985]

24 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Last year Ranieri won the premier league, that doesn't mean he's one of the best managers in the league currently. 

I look at the likes of Monk, Stam and Wagner with their teams in the playoffs and it's looking like good young, progressive coaches are making a big difference in this league. 

Bruce is probably good for a settled team where not much has to be built up. For us, he's looking more and more like a man who is completely out of his depth. 

You could also look at managers like Hughton, Benitez, McLaren and Warnock and say experienced, proven managers are making a big difference too.

I'm not even saying Bruce is right or wrong. But saying a man who's got promoted from this league 4 times, the latest as recently as last season, is "out of his depth" is a bit odd.

Doing badly doesn't equal "out of his depth"

[Grasshopper]

@Stevo985

I'm sorry mate, but you seem to be drawing your conclusions from pasts and what should bes.

The real world of life in any field is not calculable.

One has to look at what Bruce is doing at AVFC, his record here after a good run of result over a 7 week period has morphed into a bad run of results over a 10 week period with no sign of improvement and a tendency to be increasingly worse.

Take snapshots at 4 points in his tenure

1) Appointment - We were a total mess (not his fault)

2) Brighton v AV - our best performance over 90 mins managing a draw

3) The last game before the JanWin - AV 1-1 Leeds - at this point SB had 25pts from 13 games - playoffs well in sight.

Now lets pause here.

You have a transfer window to come in the hope you can keep things going better still kick on.

Factors

GK - Loans in SJ instead of an experienced proven GK

Goals - Kodjia our only constant goal scorer off to Afcon - Bruce gambles on Gaby

Gestede - Club sells fo 6mill - good deal - possibly as funds for new targets - Stick or twist?

Signings - Nobody can predict how long this can take - but one must be aware that signings can take till the very last day so one must plan accordingly.

4) AV 0-1 Ipswich - 5 defeats and 1 draw - undefeated Home record gone - 16th in the table -  16pts off 6th - 7pts off 22nd (relegation)

thats double the distance from playoffs to the relegation places.

Now if that isnt clear enough to you that Bruce is NOT doing a good job, then I cant help you. If you think that his style of football and approach to the game (despite having players suited to the opposite) will suddenly change along with performances and results I have to say you are delusional.

The proof is the now

Not promotions that are not with AVFC.

Time has run out

BRUCE OUT

[Eastie]

2 minutes ago, Grasshopper said:

@Stevo985

I'm sorry mate, but you seem to be drawing your conclusions from pasts and what should bes.

The real world of life in any field is not calculable.

One has to look at what Bruce is doing at AVFC, his record here after a good run of result over a 7 week period has morphed into a bad run of results over a 10 week period with no sign of improvement and a tendency to be increasingly worse.

Take snapshots at 4 points in his tenure

1) Appointment - We were a total mess (not his fault)

2) Brighton v AV - our best performance over 90 mins managing a draw

3) The last game before the JanWin - AV 1-1 Leeds - at this point SB had 25pts from 13 games - playoffs well in sight.

Now lets pause here.

You have a transfer window to come in the hope you can keep things going better still kick on.

Factors

GK - Loans in SJ instead of an experienced proven GK

Goals - Kodjia our only constant goal scorer off to Afcon - Bruce gambles on Gaby

Gestede - Club sells fo 6mill - good deal - possibly as funds for new targets - Stick or twist?

Signings - Nobody can predict how long this can take - but one must be aware that signings can take till the very last day so one must plan accordingly.

4) AV 0-1 Ipswich - 5 defeats and 1 draw - undefeated Home record gone - 16th in the table -  16pts off 6th - 7pts off 22nd (relegation)

thats double the distance from playoffs to the relegation places.

Now if that isnt clear enough to you that Bruce is NOT doing a good job, then I cant help you. If you think that his style of football and approach to the game (despite having players suited to the opposite) will suddenly change along with performances and results I have to say you are delusional.

The proof is the now

Not promotions that are not with AVFC.

Time has run out

BRUCE OUT

This has taken you a lot of time to type and I feel for your situation but Bruce is not going to be sacked at this stage and will be given more time .

[flamingsombrero]

 

[Stevo985]

16 minutes ago, Grasshopper said:

@Stevo985

I'm sorry mate, but you seem to be drawing your conclusions from pasts and what should bes.

The real world of life in any field is not calculable.

One has to look at what Bruce is doing at AVFC, his record here after a good run of result over a 7 week period has morphed into a bad run of results over a 10 week period with no sign of improvement and a tendency to be increasingly worse.

Take snapshots at 4 points in his tenure

1) Appointment - We were a total mess (not his fault)

2) Brighton v AV - our best performance over 90 mins managing a draw

3) The last game before the JanWin - AV 1-1 Leeds - at this point SB had 25pts from 13 games - playoffs well in sight.

Now lets pause here.

You have a transfer window to come in the hope you can keep things going better still kick on.

Factors

GK - Loans in SJ instead of an experienced proven GK

Goals - Kodjia our only constant goal scorer off to Afcon - Bruce gambles on Gaby

Gestede - Club sells fo 6mill - good deal - possibly as funds for new targets - Stick or twist?

Signings - Nobody can predict how long this can take - but one must be aware that signings can take till the very last day so one must plan accordingly.

4) AV 0-1 Ipswich - 5 defeats and 1 draw - undefeated Home record gone - 16th in the table -  16pts off 6th - 7pts off 22nd (relegation)

thats double the distance from playoffs to the relegation places.

Now if that isnt clear enough to you that Bruce is NOT doing a good job, then I cant help you. If you think that his style of football and approach to the game (despite having players suited to the opposite) will suddenly change along with performances and results I have to say you are delusional.

The proof is the now

Not promotions that are not with AVFC.

Time has run out

BRUCE OUT

I think you've wasted a lot of energy to type all that out  

I even said in my post that I wasn't agreeing or disagreeing with the notion of wanting bruce out (I DO disagree, but that's a separate argument)

My only point here is that he's not "out of his depth".

He isn't. Doing badly doesn't mean you're out of your depth. It just means you're doing a bad job.

A manager who has managed for as long as Bruce has and has 4 promotions from the league we are currently in is not out of his depth at our club. He's just not doing very well at the moment.

[Grasshopper]

 

16 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

My only point here is that he's not "out of his depth".

He isn't. Doing badly doesn't mean you're out of your depth. It just means you're doing a bad job.

A manager who has managed for as long as Bruce has and has 4 promotions from the league we are currently in is not out of his depth at our club. He's just not doing very well at the moment.

By definition he's out of his depth.

He has not promoted a club with the size or exoactancy of our.

He has promoted smaller clubs

Comes to his self confessed "Biggest club I've ever managed" and shows no signs of handling it well.

He's well out of his depth and should go immediately.

Bruce Out

[vreitti]

26 minutes ago, Stevo985 said:

I think you've wasted a lot of energy to type all that out  

I even said in my post that I wasn't agreeing or disagreeing with the notion of wanting bruce out (I DO disagree, but that's a separate argument)

My only point here is that he's not "out of his depth".

He isn't. Doing badly doesn't mean you're out of your depth. It just means you're doing a bad job.

A manager who has managed for as long as Bruce has and has 4 promotions from the league we are currently in is not out of his depth at our club. He's just not doing very well at the moment.

Then again it's a fine line between "doing a bad job" and actually being "out of depth". I don't believe his past success by any means necessitates he's incapable of being out of depth. But that's an altogether different discussion. 

Bruce is undoubtedly doing a bad job at the moment, there can be no doubt about that. Imho he isn't that far away from seemingly being out of his depth. He inherited one of the most expensive sides ever built in this division. Sure there were some imbalance issues with the squad, and a few players with a poor attitude. Was he able to get the best out what he had at his disposal? Did he manage to build a working system? No and hell no. In fact he didn't even try. Instead he went and bought an entirely new team, and the way things are looking, he doesn't even seem to be capable of producing results with his 'own players'.

That to me signals a manager being "out of depth". 

Edited February 13, 2017 by vreitti

[Stevo985]

We're arguing semantics so let's agree to disagree.