omariqy Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 Also don't discount goalscoring at lower leagues. Look at how many players have done it at the lower level and then gone on to do it at a higher level. If you have the ability you have the ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 6 minutes ago, bobzy said: You asked how is he a "natural goalscorer" and "where does this belief come from" - I was just telling you. But sure, let's go Championship... 21 goals in 33 games. Our other striker, Kodjia, had one spell in the Championship prior to signing for us - 19 goals in 49 games. Now I know you'll say Kodjia is the better striker, no doubt, and that's because he's scored goals for us. He was less proven than Hogan was when we signed him, though, and 2 years older too. Would you say he is a "natural goalscorer"? It's clear to see that our style of play is hampering Hogan. Sure, he hasn't been brilliant either, so it's a lose/lose situation but it's obviously mainly because of our "tactics". He has done far, far better in the rest of his career. His time at Villa is the outlier. Why would scoring in league 2 give you belief he's a natural scorer 2 levels up? Like I said, same with kozak. Would scoring in league 1 give a you faith a player could do it in the prem? I wouldn't have said kodjia was a natural proven striker but I did think he looked good before we signed him. I thought Hogan also looked good before we signed him. But kodjia has now done it for 2 teams over 2 seasons. More than the 32 game spell Hogan had. The rest of his career (apart from Bradford, which I've acknowledged) has been played at a much lower level. It's no indicator at all. Tactics and formation haven't helped him but I disagree it's mainly them. He's been terrible so far at so many things. I really think we need to give him a run of games as a front 2 as that's the only way I can see him doing anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 1 minute ago, omariqy said: Also don't discount goalscoring at lower leagues. Look at how many players have done it at the lower level and then gone on to do it at a higher level. If you have the ability you have the ability. And how many don't? It's no indicator that players can do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VillaChris Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 He just has the air of a luckless forward to me. Constantly hitting keepers when through on goal, getting injured frequently when he gets a run of starts. Looking increasingly likely it just isn't good to happen here for him. Any goalscoring touch he had at Brentford has long deserted him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villa89 Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 He was an odd signing at the time (did someone say panic buy?) but he's starting to look like a complete bust. He's injury record is diabolical and our hoofball style of play doesn't exactly suit him. I just hope for his sake we get a new manager in ASAP who can salvage his career here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzy Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 44 minutes ago, DCJonah said: Why would scoring in league 2 give you belief he's a natural scorer 2 levels up? Like I said, same with kozak. Would scoring in league 1 give a you faith a player could do it in the prem? On its own, it wouldn't necessarily. He followed that up with an even better scoring ratio at Championship level after a lengthy injury, though. But sure, you dismiss his career prior to Brentford. Personally, I find that odd. I mean, why would anyone sign players from lower leagues if nothing matters because it was "only League 2"? Why bother bringing through youth players if they've "only done it at youth level" etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 53 minutes ago, bobzy said: On its own, it wouldn't necessarily. He followed that up with an even better scoring ratio at Championship level after a lengthy injury, though. But sure, you dismiss his career prior to Brentford. Personally, I find that odd. I mean, why would anyone sign players from lower leagues if nothing matters because it was "only League 2"? Why bother bringing through youth players if they've "only done it at youth level" etc? Who said it doesn't matter? Do well lower leagues and progress and do well at youth team and progress. Players will earn their chance and I'm happy for us to provide those chances. But it's not a guarantee and certainly not enough to have faith it will be repeated. Players need to continue to prove themselves. I have hope Hogan will come good and I think he could be much better in a front 2 where his hold up playing and passing won't be needed as much. But lower league goals do nothing for me to see such faith he's bound to score or that all he needs is service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummybloke Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Bruce moaning that Hogan is injured again. No surprise really as he's being used as a battering ram or target man against 2 cbs every game. Maybe employ 2 forwards and play it to feet then your forwards won't be injured all the time ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodders0223 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 11 minutes ago, brummybloke said: Bruce moaning that Hogan is injured again. No surprise really as he's being used as a battering ram or target man against 2 cbs every game. Maybe employ 2 forwards and play it to feet then your forwards won't be injured all the time ? Shouldn't buy an injury prone player then, the **** idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villan-scott Posted August 18, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted August 18, 2017 Do we know the severity of the injury this time? I've not seen a prognosis anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted August 18, 2017 Author Share Posted August 18, 2017 cannot believe we blew 15m on an injury prone forward. our medical team are absolutely shit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 18, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted August 18, 2017 3 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: cannot believe we blew 15m on an injury prone forward. our medical team are absolutely shit What's it got to do with our medical team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted August 18, 2017 Author Share Posted August 18, 2017 Just now, Stevo985 said: What's it got to do with our medical team? He seems to pick up a hell of a lot of ankle injuries. Did our medical team not pick this up? I have my doubts whether it was sustained while just being here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 18, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted August 18, 2017 Just now, Demitri_C said: He seems to pick up a hell of a lot of ankle injuries. Did our medical team not pick this up? I have my doubts whether it was sustained while just being here That's not what a medical is for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Pangloss Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 15 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: cannot believe we blew 15m on an injury prone forward. our medical team are absolutely shit Nothing to do with the medical team and everything to do with the manager who signed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo_b Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 So Hogan and Kodjia are out, whose that leave us for Tomorroe, Gabby?! Oh please bring in McCormack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post DCJonah Posted August 18, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted August 18, 2017 3 minutes ago, Tommo_b said: So Hogan and Kodjia are out, whose that leave us for Tomorroe, Gabby?! Oh please bring in McCormack. Samba. 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demitri_C Posted August 18, 2017 Author Share Posted August 18, 2017 52 minutes ago, Stevo985 said: That's not what a medical is for. After doing some research it was not ankle but two cruciate ligament injuries. At 24 I think it was crazy to spend 15m on someone who ha sthat as it suggests he is injury prone. if wasnt a medical then I seriously have to question this as he is always injured and doesnt score either. when you think other teams sign strikers for much lower fees and have had a larger impact than hogan has for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCJonah Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 2 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: After doing some research it was not ankle but two cruciate ligament injuries. At 24 I think it was crazy to spend 15m on someone who ha sthat as it suggests he is injury prone. if wasnt a medical then I seriously have to question this as he is always injured and doesnt score either. when you think other teams sign strikers for much lower fees and have had a larger impact than hogan has for me It was a panic buy so it's no surprise that we've overlooked certain things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo985 Posted August 18, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted August 18, 2017 4 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: After doing some research it was not ankle but two cruciate ligament injuries. At 24 I think it was crazy to spend 15m on someone who ha sthat as it suggests he is injury prone. if wasnt a medical then I seriously have to question this as he is always injured and doesnt score either. when you think other teams sign strikers for much lower fees and have had a larger impact than hogan has for me But that's not the fault of the medical team. Medicals are to detect underlying, unknown medical issues. They are not an assessment of how injury prone a player is. The transfer team would already (you would hope) have known about that stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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