dont_do_it_doug. Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 26 minutes ago, PaulC said: In the 80s there were very few convictions for child abuse so if the club had have gone to the police no doubt it would never have gone to court Not the club's decision to make. P.S. nobody is accusing the current 'regime' of any wrongdoing. Where is that conversation coming from? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briny_ear Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 37 minutes ago, Demitri_C said: Like I said it was under different leadership so why is the current club getting accused? Surely they should be going for the individuals who were at the club at the time? Don't think anyone is "accusing" the club. Just reporting what they have learned about what happened in the 80s. However the club is obviously involved because they may have records of what happened, which would be relevant to the investigations currently going on. Also an organisation unfortunately (some may say fortunately) cannot just shed responsibility for the past actions of its employees and board members because they have left the organisation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 11 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: Not the club's decision to make. P.S. nobody is accusing the current 'regime' of any wrongdoing. Where is that conversation coming from? I am only going on earlier posts. If the parents didn't want to take the matter any further then I'm not sure the club could do anything. Surely you needs the parents consent to press charges against the individual. I'm not defending the club but not sure they could have done anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 The facts as they are being reported on the Victoria Derbyshire show are: (The interview is about 12 minutes into today's programme if anyone can stomach it) 1988 we sack him and don't go to the police. In 2007 he was jailed for offences between 1976 and 1989. i.e. he commited an/some offence/s after he left the club. Tony Brien was 12 in 1981 when the alledged abuse started when he was playing for Dunlop Terriers and he stopped it when he was 14. 6 or 7 occasions over 2 years He reported it to Leicester when he was 18 (and Langford was a scout at Villa) and it would seem to Dave Richardson at Villa who he had worked with at Leicester previously (I believe he signed him for the youth team). Phone calls over 3-5 weeks culminating in a phone call "can you really be dealing with all this Tony? Obscenities from the terraces" and basically dissuaded from going public. Something Richardson denies. The programme claims Richardson originally did "appear to remember speaking to you" according to the programme but then clarified in a statement to them "he did not believe he had ever spoken to you about the abuse" (you being Mr Brien). He does however say that He, DE and GT had heard claims of abuse from other parents and sacked him. "During the 1987/88 pre season I was told of some alarming allegations about Mr Langford by a member of staff at Aston Villa. I took these [allegations] extremely seriously and began making enquiries, these led me to speak to the parents of two young footballers at Aston Villa who told me each of their sons had been abused by Ted Langford. I asked them if they were going to report these allegations to the police or if they wanted me to. After consulting with each other both sets of parents told me they did not want the matter reported to the police". (Dave Richardsons statement via lawyers). Mr Brien did not report his abuse to the police it seems until December of last year when he was informed Langford had died so there was no legal case to bring. IPlayer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonLax Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 13 minutes ago, PaulC said: I am only going on earlier posts. If the parents didn't want to take the matter any further then I'm not sure the club could do anything. Surely you needs the parents consent to press charges against the individual. I'm not defending the club but not sure they could have done anything else. No that's certainly not the case. If a person is suspected of such a serious crime the police have a duty to investigate. The parents may wish to make it go away but if nothing is done a predator will go on to attack other children. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grasshopper Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 I started to read it, my blood began to boil, then I started to feel sick. so I stopped reading. I just dont understand how 1 human being can feel that he/she has the right to impose their personal perversions on another human being against their will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeHavilland Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 So it was a different era, and if anything less tolerant - and from my perspective, if this had happened to one of my Lads something would have been done about it, no matter what the club did or didn't do, I would have struggled with been complicit in any other childs abuse - let alone my own, I just don't understand what would of been in anybodys minds. Ultimately a parents responsibility to there kids is to protect them, no matter what - putting career and financial reward over anything else, and you shouldn't even have kids, its atrocious behaviour - which I just do not comprehend. If I am been very honest with myself, sure the club would of been the first point of call, but I would of fully expected to get fobbed off - vested interest etc. then it would of been the police, authorities then the press, and anyone else who would listen, failing that I don't know how far I would go. Would I be placated by a sacking? - no way if I thought the perpetrator could carry on somewhere else - which they undoubtedly do without prosecution. I am not defending the club - far from it, I am just questioning the morality and the subsequent complicity of the parents. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulC Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 33 minutes ago, LondonLax said: No that's certainly not the case. If a person is suspected of such a serious crime the police have a duty to investigate. The parents may wish to make it go away but if nothing is done a predator will go on to attack other children. Yes you are right. I can't defend the club they were wrong to allow it to go on for so long and to not at least take the matter to the police. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dont_do_it_doug. Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, VILLAMARV said: The facts as they are being reported on the Victoria Derbyshire show are: (The interview is about 12 minutes into today's programme if anyone can stomach it) 1988 we sack him and don't go to the police. In 2007 he was jailed for offences between 1976 and 1989. i.e. he commited an/some offence/s after he left the club. Tony Brien was 12 in 1981 when the alledged abuse started when he was playing for Dunlop Terriers and he stopped it when he was 14. 6 or 7 occasions over 2 years He reported it to Leicester when he was 18 (and Langford was a scout at Villa) and it would seem to Dave Richardson at Villa who he had worked with at Leicester previously (I believe he signed him for the youth team). Phone calls over 3-5 weeks culminating in a phone call "can you really be dealing with all this Tony? Obscenities from the terraces" and basically dissuaded from going public. Something Richardson denies. The programme claims Richardson originally did "appear to remember speaking to you" according to the programme but then clarified in a statement to them "he did not believe he had ever spoken to you about the abuse" (you being Mr Brien). He does however say that He, DE and GT had heard claims of abuse from other parents and sacked him. "During the 1987/88 pre season I was told of some alarming allegations about Mr Langford by a member of staff at Aston Villa. I took these [allegations] extremely seriously and began making enquiries, these led me to speak to the parents of two young footballers at Aston Villa who told me each of their sons had been abused by Ted Langford. I asked them if they were going to report these allegations to the police or if they wanted me to. After consulting with each other both sets of parents told me they did not want the matter reported to the police". (Dave Richardsons statement via lawyers). Mr Brien did not report his abuse to the police it seems until December of last year when he was informed Langford had died so there was no legal case to bring. IPlayer In retrospect I can *sort of* sympathise* with Richardson here, especially if he escalated this further up the chain. Shirking his responsibility in a sense, though I guess the point was that it would have ruined the lads career. Unfortunately, that may well have been the case no matter how much we wish it wasn't. I still think he got it wrong, horribly wrong but it's clear he was caught up in something he was not equipped to deal with. I'm glad football is now taking this very seriously and I hope this can serve as a lesson. As for the parents, if this is true, criminal charges should be bought against them in my opinion. They were complicit in child abuse against their own children and no reason they can give will be good enough. *sympathise is definitely the wrong word, but 'understand' sounded even worse still. Edited January 30, 2017 by dont_do_it_doug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyrusr Posted January 30, 2017 VT Supporter Share Posted January 30, 2017 14 minutes ago, dont_do_it_doug. said: In retrospect I can *sort of* sympathise* with Richardson here, especially if he escalated this further up the chain. Shirking his responsibility in a sense, though I guess the point was that it would have ruined the lads career. Unfortunately, that may well have been the case no matter how much we wish it wasn't. I still think he got it wrong, horribly wrong but it's clear he was caught up in something he was not equipped to deal with. I'm glad football is now taking this very seriously and I hope this can serve as a lesson. As for the parents, if this is true, criminal charges should be bought against them in my opinion. They were complicit in child abuse against their own children and no reason they can give will be good enough. *sympathise is definitely the wrong word, but 'understand' sounded even worse still. Perhaps the words "acknowledge where he is coming from" maybe? I also see that Leicester disputed that he had gone to them which goes against what he says he did. When the allegations seem to be when he was a Leicester City scout. Indeed, you also see that Tony Brien never played for Villa. Indeed, the Villa connection is tenuous and only because Langford was a scout to us and we asked questions when it was raised. I am not sure why Villa would be saying to him about "comments from the terraces". Does raise questions which can be challenged, certainly much more to this than meets the eye. I think unfortunately because there are comments that Richardson at some point may have said he spoke with Tony Brien the programme has run the story against Villa as there is a response. If he did raise it with Leicester and they didn't do anything that to me raises more concerns. Again though, reiterate my previous point that I hope they f****** learn from it and make sure it doesn't happen in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VILLAMARV Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 It's not really a story where we can find much good at all. I think what we can say is that this is just the tip of the iceberg football wise if the numbers mentioned in the inquiry are anything to go by. Nothing but praise for the guy for coming forward with his story. I suspect the fact that there is no legal case in this instance had a bit to do with him waiving his right to anonymity to get the story on the record. I don't think we should be speculating over the victims account too much. What is unfortunate is that no one appears (and unless more comes out we'll never know if this is true or not) to have reported it to the police, the three victims, the families of those victims, the two clubs or any of the individuals along the way. If it was truly the families decision to not formally report a crime and press charges you have to assume it was out of compassion for their children rather than any tacet approval of any crimes. What we should all be grateful for is that we now live in a society where none of this behaviour is seen as even remotely acceptable or honourable. It was a different time and thank **** for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheepyvillian Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 If true , it is shocking and shameful . How anyone could attempt to hush up a crime , so vile ,is beyond me . I was really hoping that we wouldn't be tainted by all the latest allegations, but sadly not ,and even this great club must hang it's head in shame . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeHavilland Posted January 30, 2017 Share Posted January 30, 2017 Out of curiosity - how many scouts did we have at the time? As I recall every man and his dog was a scout for one club or another. I'm not trying to circumnavigate any of the blame - I'm just trying to get a better perspective of the general landscape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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