Steve Bruce

[blandy]

5 hours ago, TRO said:

I think Bruce was right at the time we signed him and I think it was the right decision when he went...He steadied a very uneasy time for us.

I don't get all the slagging off, Thankfully many clapped him when he came out.

However, You only had to see how he set them up, to know that the decision was right for him to go.....and the one to bring Dean in.

Our new owners and CEO have also made a hell of a difference in club stability

That's kind of fair I think. I didn't think he was the right choice and said so. I didn't think he would take us up and said so. But, to be fair, he did stop the rot. A difficult task. He did stop us conceding stupid goals. He did find some good players, more good than bad. He did get the club organised again. But that's kind of where it stopped. He wasn't able to do more than that. The coaching seemed to be based around give it to Jack and hope he does something. His limitations that were always apparent to many became apparent to all. As a man he's fundamentally decent, but thin skinned and that showed, too.

In terms of steps on the way he was part of it. Not an easy step, not a glorious step, but one where we stopped sinking into the mud and started to dust ourselves down. Restocked the supplies and at least pointed to where we needed to go to get to our destination. But he was never, ever, going to take us there. This not what he does.

[Zatman]

4 hours ago, Tomaszk said:

Giving him stick or booing losses and draws and bad performances in the Championship when we had about 25x the resources of our opponents? 

He made it up TRO. He got in there first to try and blame fans for the team underperforming. He made sure the media were fed this poppycock so he could fall back on it later. He's done it for years and years and years.

He's a propaganda machine.

He started by mentioning he managed that lot down the road and media jumped on it. Was never a thing for Villa fans. 

They did same with McLeish who never ever brought it up

[TRO]

6 hours ago, Tomaszk said:

Giving him stick or booing losses and draws and bad performances in the Championship when we had about 25x the resources of our opponents? 

He made it up TRO. He got in there first to try and blame fans for the team underperforming. He made sure the media were fed this poppycock so he could fall back on it later. He's done it for years and years and years.

He's a propaganda machine.

I just disagree.

that doesn't mean i would want him back.....just feel grateful for a few of his good signings inc John Terry.....stopping the rot of conceding in the last 10 minutes against teams and getting us to a play off final albeit being a damp squib.

I think the resources bit is a bit overstated and disingenous....on that parallel, why has Sheff Utd done so well on such a modest budget against what we have spent now....I think its a selective point to discredit....double standards at play, me thinks.

anyone can build a case, for someone they don't like, just like they can build a case for someone they think was ok.

I thought overall he brought in some decent buys....just his style of football was not progressive and dull

but of course everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Edited November 27, 2019 by TRO

[TRO]

3 hours ago, blandy said:

That's kind of fair I think. I didn't think he was the right choice and said so. I didn't think he would take us up and said so. But, to be fair, he did stop the rot. A difficult task. He did stop us conceding stupid goals. He did find some good players, more good than bad. He did get the club organised again. But that's kind of where it stopped. He wasn't able to do more than that. The coaching seemed to be based around give it to Jack and hope he does something. His limitations that were always apparent to many became apparent to all. As a man he's fundamentally decent, but thin skinned and that showed, too.

In terms of steps on the way he was part of it. Not an easy step, not a glorious step, but one where we stopped sinking into the mud and started to dust ourselves down. Restocked the supplies and at least pointed to where we needed to go to get to our destination. But he was never, ever, going to take us there. This not what he does.

I think that is more than fair.

On the man himself, all my sources say he is a good guy, but I heard that about McLeish too.

sometimes not so good managers are not necessarily bad people.

[Ingram85]

2 hours ago, TRO said:

I just disagree.

that doesn't mean i would want him back.....just feel grateful for a few of his good signings inc John Terry.....stopping the rot of conceding in the last 10 minutes against teams and getting us to a play off final albeit being a damp squib.

I think the resources bit is a bit overstated and disingenous....on that parallel, why has Sheff Utd done so well on such a modest budget against what we have spent now....I think its a selective point to discredit....double standards at play, me thinks.

anyone can build a case, for someone they don't like, just like they can build a case for someone they think was ok.

I thought overall he brought in some decent buys....just his style of football was not progressive and dull

but of course everyone is entitled to their opinion.

I think you are both right tbh. He had good points that you've mentioned but Tomaszk is right too. It doesnt make Bruce an evil monster but just as you said, thin skinned and trying to protect his own image at times to the detriment of fan opinion.

[TheStagMan]

21 hours ago, bannedfromHandV said:

Ah yes sorry, super reliable source.

I'll start basing my entire life off posts made by an anonymous person on a football fan forum.

Well, possibly better than the random guesswork and assumption that your comments are usually based on

Edited November 27, 2019 by TheStagMan

[bannedfromHandV]

21 minutes ago, TheStagMan said:

Well, possibly better than the random guesswork and assumption that your comments are usually based on

Thanks man, you and others have done a great job in showing me the way.

[bannedfromHandV]

7 hours ago, blandy said:

That's kind of fair I think. I didn't think he was the right choice and said so. I didn't think he would take us up and said so. But, to be fair, he did stop the rot. A difficult task. He did stop us conceding stupid goals. He did find some good players, more good than bad. He did get the club organised again. But that's kind of where it stopped. He wasn't able to do more than that. The coaching seemed to be based around give it to Jack and hope he does something. His limitations that were always apparent to many became apparent to all. As a man he's fundamentally decent, but thin skinned and that showed, too.

In terms of steps on the way he was part of it. Not an easy step, not a glorious step, but one where we stopped sinking into the mud and started to dust ourselves down. Restocked the supplies and at least pointed to where we needed to go to get to our destination. But he was never, ever, going to take us there. This not what he does.

That's exactly where we should all be on this - because that is the factual overview.

Like you, I didn't think he was right when we hired him but he had a positive impact and stopped us from doing a Sunderland, then we upgraded with Smith and at the right time too.

Shame others can't see past personal jibes and some weird obsession with wanting to see him fail, it's amazing the volume of energy people expend into wanting to see others fail.

[Zatman]

Bruce and O 'Leary only 2 Villa managers to criticise the fans in the media. Funnily enough this isn't the first set of fans millionaire Bruce has had a go at

[rjw63]

15 hours ago, VillaJ100 said:

The thing with Lambert he should have gone after the Bradford farce. 

Most certainly.

I can't stand the mumbling prick but I do owe him some gratitude...it's because of him I stopped going to the Villa after 40+ years.

I am now less stressed and financially better off, and also don't get the flu from standing in the rain for two hours.

[Keyblade]

20 hours ago, useless said:

No doubt for me that he was a disaster, he played his part in the club nearly going out of business both because of his signings and loans and because he couldn't manage to get one of the most expensive ever championship squads promoted, any half competent manager would have had us top two or at least actually challenging for automatic promotion and making a better go of the play-offs if it came to that. Most Sunderland fans will pinpoint the money he wasted there as the start of their downfall as well.

If I'm not mistaken, during his 2 seasons at the club, we were only in the top 2 for a solitary week from February 11-17 2018. It's not like we narrowly missed out on top 2 finishes either. We didn't even threaten.

[lapal_fan]

2 hours ago, Zatman said:

Bruce and O 'Leary only 2 Villa managers to criticise the fans in the media. Funnily enough this isn't the first set of fans millionaire Bruce has had a go at

I'm sure MON did, directly to the fans in the holte end suite after Moscow.

Lambert said after winning after the 0-14 nil that it would "shut a few up".

McLeish did as much as well.

 

They all do, because they're always asked about it in press interviews.

Wenger had it, fergie had it (in 02), mourinho had it.

They all moan about fans or comment on fans when asked, and it's a question that is ALWAYS asked.

[lapal_fan]

1 minute ago, Keyblade said:

If I'm not mistaken, during his 2 seasons at the club, we were only in the top 2 for a solitary week from February 11-17 2018. It's not like we narrowly missed out on top 2 finishes either. We didn't even threaten.

That's the problem when you have to rebuild a team every summer because your loans return and your good players leave.  It's like us this season.  Had we have had our current players, playing last season, we'd PROBABLY be doing better than we are.  It takes time to gel. 

[Keyblade]

4 minutes ago, lapal_fan said:

That's the problem when you have to rebuild a team every summer because your loans return and your good players leave.  It's like us this season.  Had we have had our current players, playing last season, we'd PROBABLY be doing better than we are.  It takes time to gel. 

I agree, but I can't think of any loan players leaving after 16/17 tbh, I could be wrong. That team also had a year of playing together under their belt, and in 2017/18 we only made a few complimentary (and rather good signings) of Snodgrass, Terry, Whelan and Elmo (and Onomah lol). That team was settled and more than good enough to challenge for automatic promotion imo. We really missed a trick there (thankfully!).

[TRO]

4 hours ago, lapal_fan said:

I'm sure MON did, directly to the fans in the holte end suite after Moscow.

Lambert said after winning after the 0-14 nil that it would "shut a few up".

McLeish did as much as well.

 

They all do, because they're always asked about it in press interviews.

Wenger had it, fergie had it (in 02), mourinho had it.

They all moan about fans or comment on fans when asked, and it's a question that is ALWAYS asked.

He most certainly did, in no uncertain terms.

[TRO]

18 hours ago, Tomaszk said:

Giving him stick or booing losses and draws and bad performances in the Championship when we had about 25x the resources of our opponents? 

He made it up TRO. He got in there first to try and blame fans for the team underperforming. He made sure the media were fed this poppycock so he could fall back on it later. He's done it for years and years and years.

He's a propaganda machine.

That's a cop out...so on that note we should be outgunning Sheff Utd, now.......The football was uninspiring and lacked progression granted ....but some of the accusations lack substance. His final season with us was a  horror show for a number of reasons some personal to him, some the club was just in disarray, with its finances and leadership. we don't know the real details, it must have been a horror show......Prior to that 24 wins, 72 goals for, 42 against with a GD of 30 was commendable, not great but not bad either.

I think to paint the picture that He was all bad is disingenuous.....He made some good signings.....2 that got us the winning goals at Wembley to send us up and it didn't go unnoticed That Dean Smith, generous to a fault, mentioned it immediately after the match, such is the mans integrity and honesty.

Its ironic that the 2 goal scorers Monday nigh was his signings.

I am glad he is gone and happy Dean is now in the seat......but to cast him as a bad un for us......No not me......I can see and appreciate the good that he did for us, despite it not working out for either of us at the time.

 

 

Edited November 27, 2019 by TRO

[DCJonah]

Said it before. But smith getting promoted and performing an absolute miracle, has helped the memory of Bruce. 

Without that miracle we would be in the championship, watching Grealish, McGinn and Mings in another teams colours. God knows the state our squad would be in with regards FFP and I'd imagine we wouldn't be challenging. We'd then all be aware that Bruce had **** us big time by being in charge for 2 years and causing terrible long term damage 

But we got the right man, we performed a miracle and we are where we are. So looking back some see Bruce as not that bad, but for me he was an utter disaster. 

[Tomaszk]

41 minutes ago, DCJonah said:

Said it before. But smith getting promoted and performing an absolute miracle, has helped the memory of Bruce. 

Without that miracle we would be in the championship, watching Grealish, McGinn and Mings in another teams colours. God knows the state our squad would be in with regards FFP and I'd imagine we wouldn't be challenging. We'd then all be aware that Bruce had **** us big time by being in charge for 2 years and causing terrible long term damage 

But we got the right man, we performed a miracle and we are where we are. So looking back some see Bruce as not that bad, but for me he was an utter disaster. 

100%.

In a team with Grealish and McGinn he had us heading for a bottom half season easily, could have been even worse.

The bull he spouted worked on many, I can see why he's done it his whole career.

[TRO]

4 hours ago, DCJonah said:

Said it before. But smith getting promoted and performing an absolute miracle, has helped the memory of Bruce. 

Without that miracle we would be in the championship, watching Grealish, McGinn and Mings in another teams colours. God knows the state our squad would be in with regards FFP and I'd imagine we wouldn't be challenging. We'd then all be aware that Bruce had **** us big time by being in charge for 2 years and causing terrible long term damage 

But we got the right man, we performed a miracle and we are where we are. So looking back some see Bruce as not that bad, but for me he was an utter disaster. 

That is absolute rubbish.

Both managers took over under different circumstances.

Its not a case of promoting Steve Bruce ,its a case of fair play and a reasonable assessment.

Dean and Steve are different managers with different skill sets......Fortunately Dean is an intelligent man and on Numerous occasions has praised the job Steve Did......He has no agenda, just an honest view.

I accept the criticisms of some of Steve Bruces managerial skills at the same time as appreciating his other skills.

Our History is riddled with ups and downs and the successful managers have on many occasions took over from a leg up the wall.......Vic Crowe Left Super Ron with some great kids to develop, the rest is history.

There is absolutely no reason for us to have this debate......Our current manager has many times referred to Steve in a positive light, any manager taking over is in a good position to be accurate in their assessment.

I will listen to Dean Smiths opinion and bin the rest.

 

 

[sne]

3 minutes ago, TRO said:

Our current manager has many times referred to Steve in a positive light, any manager taking over is in a good position to be accurate in their assessment.

I will listen to Dean Smiths opinion and bin the rest.

Has there ever been an example where a manager when asked a direct question about his predecessor by a journalist has answered anything except polite platitudes?

I'm sure there has been but 99 times out of 100 it's nice guy, difficult situation, best of luck and so on.